Americans, Never Forget: December 7, 1941

[CTALNH]

America.

I live for the day you collapse.

You're going to have to live a long time then kid.

Face facts: The US has the most defensible territory in the world, with greatest capacity for agricultural output, and the lowest natural transportaiton costs. This simply allows the US to consolidate internally and project outward becoming a natural balance-of-power in every other region ... it is classic divide and conquer. They did it between UK, France and Germany is Europe and then played Russia against its periphery. China is the game today and they encircle is From Alaska to S. Korea, to Japan, to Philippines to Vietnam, etc ...

I understand the natural inclination toward America bashing. I truly do. Especially when so many countries are stuck in seeming endless cycles of boom and bust or corruptions and internal political and economic turmous (Like Greece) being envious or hating on the superpower is easy.

America isn't going to collapse anytime soon.

I know.

I just want it okay,

[Starkiller101]

Americans didn't think the japensase would do that but guess what they're wrong.But other than that its a sad day for amercians that actually care.

[Charellia]

So striking a country you're not at war with a sneak attack while most of them are sleeping isn't cowardly to you?

Not as cowardly as a drone strike.

[Spreewerke]

Actually, this seems to be a recurring event in American History. Every time we finish kicking somebody's ass, everybody is all like "Pfft, America, what are they gonna do?", and some fool decides to get involved in a war with us. I can't understand for the life of me why people underestimate America's resolve.

At least off the top of my head, a fair amount of conflicts we've been in after World War II was the result of us deciding to enter it.

[Benuty]

Perhaps the lack of a follow-up attack of our west coast. Japan didn't go nearly far enough to reach their goal of knocking us out of the war.

Not that they could, oil shortages and all.

Didn't they take Malaysia and Dutch Indonesia gaining a rather large supply of oil?

[Benuty]

So striking a country you're not at war with a sneak attack while most of them are sleeping isn't cowardly to you?

Not as cowardly as a drone strike.

Drones didn't exist in 1941.

[Greed and Death]

In the spirit of this day I again demand Japan apologize and take back yoko ono.

[Greed and Death]

Not that they could, oil shortages and all.

Didn't they take Malaysia and Dutch Indonesia gaining a rather large supply of oil?

Yes they had, there was no need for picking a fight with the US.
Rather Japan felt the US was going to get pulled into this war regardless.

[Alouite]

Not as cowardly as a drone strike.

Drones didn't exist in 1941.

They do now, and the US uses them all the time, I call that OPing real life, and it isn't cool, someone should tell the mods to warn the United States for these actions.

[Russadonia]

So striking a country you're not at war with a sneak attack while most of them are sleeping isn't cowardly to you?

Not as cowardly as a drone strike.

Touché.

[Prussia-Steinbach]

Where's the option for "FDR pressured them into it so he could become involved in WWII?"

[Rio Cana]

Japan's tactics was Impressive,

First attacking, Pearl Harbor, then Attack a Major US ''Colony''; Philippines, I find it amusing how the Japanese handled The Americans and the Filipinos, wherein, though it took them Months to finally Control The Philippines, they Actually Destroyed Fort Bataan and Fort Correggidor, Killing Tens of thousands of Americans/Filipinos, its Really creepy to live on a place where WWII Happened...

The island of Corregidor was not taken by the Japanese. It was too well fortified. US forces had to surrendered Corregidor because they had run out of food and ammunition. The Japanese had ammunition and bombarded that island to the max. Those fighting on Battan had the same problems. Running out of food and ammunition.

Found this. It is the last US radio message from the island of Corregidor before US forces surrendered. Year 1942.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viCAX8WupTY

This is on the retaking of Corregidor by the US in 1945.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuOQyrgM0CU

Edit - Found this short video of the actual Japanese attack on Corregidor.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIlHMUa5biM

[95X]

Fellow Americans, let us never forget that dreadful 7th day of December, when... "...the United States of America, was suddenly and deliberately attacked, by naval and air forces, of the Empire of Japan..." ...and how that date... "...will live in infamy..." ...in the minds of Americans for years to come.

Seriously, thanks for the reminder. I've got what seems like a million things going on right now, really makes one wonder if/what their life would be like if the country they lived in didn't exist.

Still, I think the internment camps were the wrong way for the US to respond. Germany was considered a far greater threat than Japan, but the US decided to single out one ethnic group which would lead to years and years of further unprovoked stereotypes.

They got back at us Americans by inventing HFCS.

And anime (including Pokémon). And J-pop. And transistor radios. And vehicles that were safer than American vehicles at the time.

[Alouite]

Fellow Americans, let us never forget that dreadful 7th day of December, when... "...the United States of America, was suddenly and deliberately attacked, by naval and air forces, of the Empire of Japan..." ...and how that date... "...will live in infamy..." ...in the minds of Americans for years to come.

Seriously, thanks for the reminder. I've got what seems like a million things going on right now, really makes one wonder if/what their life would be like if the country they lived in didn't exist.

Still, I think the internment camps were the wrong way for the US to respond. Germany was considered a far greater threat than Japan, but the US decided to single out one ethnic group which would lead to years and years of further unprovoked stereotypes.

They got back at us Americans by inventing HFCS.

And anime (including Pokémon). And J-pop. And transistor radios. And vehicles that were safer than American vehicles at the time.

I dunno, J-pop could be a minus.

[Hathradic States]

Pearl Harbor...the only proof which argues against the "Bad Asian Driver" thingy.

[Greed and Death]

Where's the option for "FDR pressured them into it so he could become involved in WWII?"

There was already defacto war in the Atlantic with convoys engaging subs.
http://militaryhistorynow.com/2013/01/0 ... nt-in-ww2/

[Alouite]

Pearl Harbor...the only proof which argues against the "Bad Asian Driver" thingy.

Yet their driving still resulted in crashes. Perhaps rather than bad drivers, the Asians are good crashers.

[Hathradic States]

Pearl Harbor...the only proof which argues against the "Bad Asian Driver" thingy.

Yet their driving still resulted in crashes. Perhaps rather than bad drivers, the Asians are good crashers.

I like that theory.

[Spreewerke]

Pearl Harbor...the only proof which argues against the "Bad Asian Driver" thingy.

Yet their driving still resulted in crashes. Perhaps rather than bad drivers, the Asians are good crashers.

IJA-tested, Kamikaze-approved.

[Occupied Deutschland]

Yet their driving still resulted in crashes. Perhaps rather than bad drivers, the Asians are good crashers.

IJA-tested, Kamikaze-approved.

As a historical side-note, the whole kamikaze phenomenon was an accident.

The Japanese Air Force, requiring more pilots, softened its normally extremely brutal training regime and introduced 'positive reinforcement' techniques. This led to one squadron being told 'You da' bomb' by its commander.
They took it far too literally.

^Made-up, somewhat offensive, but still somewhat humorous in my eyes history

[Alouite]

IJA-tested, Kamikaze-approved.

As a historical side-note, the whole kamikaze phenomenon was an accident.

The Japanese Air Force, requiring more pilots, softened its normally extremely brutal training regime and introduced 'positive reinforcement' techniques. This led to one squadron being told 'You da' bomb' by its commander.
They took it far too literally.

^Made-up, somewhat offensive, but still somewhat humorous in my eyes history

Lol. Good one.

[Scaevolus]

A cowardly attack, to be sure.

[Greed and Death]

So striking a country you're not at war with a sneak attack while most of them are sleeping isn't cowardly to you?

No. It's called a pre-emptive strike. It would have been how the Cold War went hot.
Besides, the strike was well after dawn and lasted for several hours. This is the time at which air defence troops should have been most alert. In fact, there were a series of points at which an attack could have been predicted and prepared for. All were either missed or outright ignored.

And, had Japanese intelligence correctly pinpointed the American carrier location, then it would have been a successful one.

Besides, assault is not the action of the coward.

Not just air defense all troops.

It is called stand to, because dawn attacks are very common.

[Vetalia]

Great idea on paper, terrible idea in practice. The Japanese would have been much better off declaring war on the USSR and forcing the Soviets to relocate forces from the Eastern Front.

[Herskerstad]

I love how some people are semi-defending the pre-emptive strike here.

Let's get some facts straight. Imperial Japan was neither a good place to live, a good society, and while some of their outlined 'victory goals' at least had some level of humanitarianism, it would literally provoke a world war. So short of a Korean annexation which proved to be one of the most brutal occupations for quite some time, the war on China truly demonstrated some of the most inhumane atrocities which gave the US every right to sever their trade relations with them, and impose a full embargo. Yes Japan was miserable economically, yes they stood largely reliant on US trade which the US kept on a tight leash, however, after the confict on the Manchurian bridge coupled with their treatment of Korean and Chinese, which under full knowledge from their high command had reached distopian levels of inhumanity, and while yes, they needed the armaments and fuel to continue their war in China giving them few choices short of a very limited victory, it stands to reason that their grounds of war stood largely based around conquest to become the sole super-power in the east, which, is the most detestable kind of imperialism when you could consider that they wanted to cut not just the US and China down, but every colonial region and the eastern part of the soviet union, ensuring all kinds of hell.

As for the strike itself, it was a tactical success, although they could have used their submarine carrier to cement the panama canal, perhaps slowing the Allied war effort on the east even further. It was however a gigantic strategic blunder of extraordinary disproportions. Even if they had managed to conquer every island in the pacific, the mainland of the US could easily be able to outproduce them on the naval front, making it just a matter of time before the tide would turn. Yamashita, probably their single best military mind stood against it, but the Japanese high command had faith in the unconquerable spirit of their armies, which did not prove too effective against superior firepower. With basic intelligence it could be argued that the political front of the US would probably largely have remained an arms-salesman to the European and Chinese frontier unless directly provoked, as it would have cost FDR too much political capital to be the one directly responsible for starting the war. Yes rainbow plans stood drawn, mostly against Germany, however in the worst case scenario there could be years of negotiation prior to the US directly starting an offensive campaign against Japan.

So to summarize, was it smart? Nope. Was it justified? No. Is the world better with the post-imperial Japan? It sure is.