Luxembourg swears in openly gay PM

[Ainin]

Are you implying that I don't support human rights?

Yes.

http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/

(1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
(2) Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.
(3) The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.

And in case the anti-marriage equality types counter with "UDHR is nonbinding":

1. The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.
2. The right of men and women of marriageable age to marry and to found a family shall be recognized.
-Article 23, International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights

[Petacada]

You can do whatever you want. I disagree with it though. Whats wrong with that?

What's wrong is that because some people feel mild discomfort for a few moments, they want to deny other people equal rights.

Ive never said that i want to deny people rights. All i said earlier was that i dont want someone to represent me who doesnt share some of my highest held beliefs.

[Ostroeuropa]

Where the hell does this keep coming from?

http://www.navytimes.com/article/201308 ... 308140021/

"Gay service members who want to tie the knot may be eligible for up to 10 days of extra “marriage leave” so they can travel to a state that legally recognizes same-sex marriage, under a new Pentagon policy unveiled Wednesday."


Specifically, they are looking to be able to publicly and forcibly tell me what their sexuality is and ask me to change my life to suit theirs. They are looking for government authorization to ram into others' lives and ask religions to marry them against their will, as an example.

In short, I don't give a crap what you want or do unless it effects me or those I care about.

That isn't extra rights.
They have the right to get married. So do heterosexuals.
If you have to travel to get married, then you have to travel.
Their rights are being ENFORCED. Not EXPANDED.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

What's wrong is that because some people feel mild discomfort for a few moments, they want to deny other people equal rights.

Ive never said that i want to deny people rights. All i said earlier was that i dont want someone to represent me who doesnt share some of my highest held beliefs.

How the hell is two people of the same sex marrying even remotely comparable to 'representing' you and you're precious beliefs?

[Othelos]

What's wrong is that because some people feel mild discomfort for a few moments, they want to deny other people equal rights.

Ive never said that i want to deny people rights. All i said earlier was that i dont want someone to represent me who doesnt share some of my highest held beliefs.

Gays can be Christian.

[Luveria]

Yes.

http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/

(1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
(2) Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.
(3) The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.

Whatever, I'm not a big fan if the UN anyway. It's too.... capitalist.

The ever-shifting goalposts which can never be reached.

Yes.

http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/

(1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
(2) Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.
(3) The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.

Strange minds think alike. I just went to grab that. But with other articles too.

1. All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

2. Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

3. Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.


(Note, the language of 3 does not specify the men and women have to marry EACHOTHER.)
(Note2, the language of 1+2, especially 1, clearly implies discrimination on the basis of sexuality is not ok.)

The language of men and women implies men and men and women and women can marry each other. It does not specify only between man and woman. There is a reason the UN as an organization is working to extend marriage rights.

[Luveria]

Ive never said that i want to deny people rights. All i said earlier was that i dont want someone to represent me who doesnt share some of my highest held beliefs.

Gays can be Christian.

If they swear to never have sex again?

[Blouman Empire]

That isn't extra rights.
They have the right to get married. So do heterosexuals.
If you have to travel to get married, then you have to travel.
Their rights are being ENFORCED. Not EXPANDED.

It is extra entitlements that other service members don't get.

Though the fact that there is such a thing as marraige leave shouldn't be around anyway, if you want to get married use your annual leave otherwise they get an unfair advantage over those who don't or can't get married.

[Kistan]

That isn't extra rights.
They have the right to get married. So do heterosexuals.
If you have to travel to get married, then you have to travel.
Their rights are being ENFORCEDDOWNRELIGIONSTHROAT. Not EXPANDED.

There.

You see, religions can't legally act against it, so why the need to force churches to marry gays? Isn't that a violation of another groups' rights?

[Othelos]

Where the hell does this keep coming from?

http://www.navytimes.com/article/201308 ... 308140021/

"Gay service members who want to tie the knot may be eligible for up to 10 days of extra “marriage leave” so they can travel to a state that legally recognizes same-sex marriage, under a new Pentagon policy unveiled Wednesday."


Specifically, they are looking to be able to publicly and forcibly tell me what their sexuality is and ask me to change my life to suit theirs. They are looking for government authorization to ram into others' lives and ask religions to marry them against their will, as an example.

In short, I don't give a crap what you want or do unless it effects me or those I care about.

You realize that if same sex marriage was legalized nationally, they wouldn't receive the extra ten days?

[Pandeeria]

Ive never said that i want to deny people rights. All i said earlier was that i dont want someone to represent me who doesnt share some of my highest held beliefs.

Gays can be Christian.

I never understood why some gays are Christian.

[Petacada]

Ive never said that i want to deny people rights. All i said earlier was that i dont want someone to represent me who doesnt share some of my highest held beliefs.

How the hell is two people of the same sex marrying even remotely comparable to 'representing' you and you're precious beliefs?

If you dont understand by now you never will. Would you vote for someone who is anti-gay? No. Because its against your beliefs. P

[Oneracon]

Where the hell does this keep coming from?

http://www.navytimes.com/article/201308 ... 308140021/

"Gay service members who want to tie the knot may be eligible for up to 10 days of extra “marriage leave” so they can travel to a state that legally recognizes same-sex marriage, under a new Pentagon policy unveiled Wednesday."

Fun fact: If all states recognized and performed same-sex civil marriages then this would not need to happen.

Specifically, they are looking to be able to publicly and forcibly tell me what their sexuality is and ask me to change my life to suit theirs.

Vague point is vague.

They are looking for government authorization to ram into others' lives and ask religions to marry them against their will, as an example.

If that was truly the case, then why has every single law in the world that recognized equality of marriage specifically included provisions exempting religious groups from performing marriages that contradict their beliefs?

You are exercising tired rhetoric and nothing more.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

Gays can be Christian.

If they swear to never have sex again?

Um...People can still follow religious creeds even if they ain't heterosexual.

[Aeken]

Gays can be Christian.

If they swear to never have sex again?

There are many sects of Christianity, Luv.

[Blouman Empire]

Gays can be Christian.

If they swear to never have sex again?

Really? It is entirely possible to be a Christian and be gay and have sex with soemone of the same sex. Maybe not your 'fathers' christianity but your 'fathers' christianity isn't the only one.

[Ostroeuropa]

Whatever, I'm not a big fan if the UN anyway. It's too.... capitalist.

The ever-shifting goalposts which can never be reached.

Strange minds think alike. I just went to grab that. But with other articles too.

1. All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

2. Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

3. Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.


(Note, the language of 3 does not specify the men and women have to marry EACHOTHER.)
(Note2, the language of 1+2, especially 1, clearly implies discrimination on the basis of sexuality is not ok.)

The language of men and women implies men and men and women and women can marry each other. It does not specify only between man and woman. There is a reason the UN as an organization is working to extend marriage rights.

Exactly.
BOTH men AND Women have the right to marry and found a family.
Nowhere is it specified which gender they have to marry.
Coupled with the anti-discrimination along gender grounds, and it becomes incredibly obvious that gay marriage is a fundamental human right for the same reasons the supreme court laid out.


Jack and Jill love eachother.
They can get married.
But Jack and Jack love eachother, they cannot get married.
Why? Because of their gender.
That's discrimination based on gender.

The sexuality doesn't even enter into it.

Your sexuality matters for jack shit when getting married, it's the GENDER or possibly the Sex (EXPLICITLY forbidden) that is being discriminated against.

[Ainin]

That isn't extra rights.
They have the right to get married. So do heterosexuals.
If you have to travel to get married, then you have to travel.
Their rights are being ENFORCEDDOWNRELIGIONSTHROAT. Not EXPANDED.

There.

You see, religions can't legally act against it, so why the need to force churches to marry gays? Isn't that a violation of another groups' rights?

Your source says "to compensate for the fact that same-sex couples cannot legally marry in 37 states, DoD will grant special leave to gay troops who want to get married but are stationed more than 100 miles from a state that legally recognizes same-sex marriages".

You say they're forcing churches to marry gays.

I'm not seeing the connection here.

[Luveria]

Gays can be Christian.

I never understood why some gays are Christian.

Probably because they follow a strain of Christianity which doesn't tell gays they are nasty sinful fucks for loving someone of the same sex.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

How the hell is two people of the same sex marrying even remotely comparable to 'representing' you and you're precious beliefs?

If you dont understand by now you never will. Would you vote for someone who is anti-gay? No. Because its against your beliefs. P

And yet my beliefs aren't based on theocratic religious texts that don't even apply to Christians.

[Pandeeria]

I never understood why some gays are Christian.

Probably because they follow a strain of Christianity which doesn't tell gays they are nasty sinful fucks for loving someone of the same sex.

Is there any mainstream strain that is neutral or pro-LGBT?

[Petacada]

Gays can be Christian.

I never understood why some gays are Christian.

Me either. We agree on something! Ha

[Ruridova]

That isn't extra rights.
They have the right to get married. So do heterosexuals.
If you have to travel to get married, then you have to travel.
Their rights are being ENFORCEDDOWNRELIGIONSTHROAT. Not EXPANDED.

There.

You see, religions can't legally act against it, so why the need to force churches to marry gays? Isn't that a violation of another groups' rights?

.... You've never heard of civil marriage, have you? That's the marriage we're talking about, not forcing churches to marry homosexuals. Civil, not religious.

[Pandeeria]

I never understood why some gays are Christian.

Me either. We agree on something! Ha

Yay!

[Ostroeuropa]

That isn't extra rights.
They have the right to get married. So do heterosexuals.
If you have to travel to get married, then you have to travel.
Their rights are being ENFORCEDDOWNRELIGIONSTHROAT. Not EXPANDED.

There.

You see, religions can't legally act against it, so why the need to force churches to marry gays? Isn't that a violation of another groups' rights?

Nobody is forcing churches to marry gays.
We're saying they are allowed to.