Gay Civil Union Discussion

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Except that natural ordering doesn't exist and you made it up.

Of course it exists. Certain acts are designed (whether by man, God, or evolution) to result in certain outcomes.

You obviously have a loose grasp of reality.

There is no order in the universe. At a macro level, and even at the micro level, shit just happens.

[Jormengand]

Except that natural ordering doesn't exist and you made it up.

Of course it exists. Certain acts are designed (whether by man, God, or evolution) to result in certain outcomes.

Ah, but answer me this:

Why does your natural order mean that something must be a good thing?

[Lost heros]

Last I checked, coitus means sexual intercourse. Gays can engage in that too.

Coitus means vaginal intercourse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_intercourse

Other forms of penetrative sexual intercourse include penetration of the anus by the penis

[Oneracon]

Sure they can.

No they can't.

Yes they can.

[Auralia]

That's true. Failure to consummate a marriage is grounds for annulment.

But does not prevent them from marrying in the first place. They are legaly married, and not having sex does not mean their marriage is automatically annulled.

Annulment is merely legal recognition that the marriage never actually existed, and the state was wrong to say they were married in the first place. The only reason why they can "marry in the first place" is that it would be a violation of privacy to check whether they could consummate their marriage in advance.

[Ifreann]

Except that natural ordering doesn't exist and you made it up.

Of course it exists. Certain acts are designed (whether by man, God, or evolution) to result in certain outcomes.

No they aren't, because nature doesn't design anything. Humans do. A god might. But nature doesn't. Nature just happens, without any kind of plan or forethought or intentions.

[Olthar]

Sure they can.

No they can't.

There are men with vaginas and women with penises.

I've got video evidence of this, too. XD

[Neutraligon]

But does not prevent them from marrying in the first place. They are legaly married, and not having sex does not mean their marriage is automatically annulled.

Annulment is merely legal recognition that the marriage never actually existed, and the state was wrong to say they were married in the first place. The only reason why they can "marry in the first place" is that it would be a violation of privacy to check whether they could consummate their marriage in advance.

The state is the only one who can define what marriage is, anything else is not marriage.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

No they can't.

There are men with vaginas and women with penises.

I've got video evidence of this, too. XD

What don't you have video of?

[Auralia]

No they can't.

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

[Neutraligon]

No they can't.

There are men with vaginas and women with penises.

I've got video evidence of this, too. XD

Some of them are very good looking too.

[Neutraligon]

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

And this matters why?

[Lost heros]

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

Why the hell is that a prerequisite for marriage?

[Avenio]

Coitus remains naturally ordered towards childbearing even when either or both spouses are infertile. This is easily demonstrated by the fact that a single conjugal act does not necessarily result in procreation, even when both spouses are fertile.

Except that natural ordering doesn't exist and you made it up.

'Natural ordering' is a euphemism for 'designed by God'. His whole argument is trying to foist off the usual Christian doctrine of procreation and homosexuality as sin as clumsy secularism.

[Oneracon]

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

Given that it is only one form of sexual contact, that is irrelevant.

[Jormengand]

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

Remind us why this matters?

[Auralia]

Annulment is merely legal recognition that the marriage never actually existed, and the state was wrong to say they were married in the first place. The only reason why they can "marry in the first place" is that it would be a violation of privacy to check whether they could consummate their marriage in advance.

The state is the only one who can define what marriage is, anything else is not marriage.

I disagree. Marriage is a natural institution that predates the state; the state can either choose to provide legal protection for the institution or not, but they cannot change what it is.

[The Emerald Dawn]

There are men with vaginas and women with penises.

I've got video evidence of this, too. XD

Some of them are very good looking too.

Mangina. I'm trying to remember....

It'll come to me. Don't be surprised if I blurt it out at random later in the thread.

[Lost heros]

There are men with vaginas and women with penises.

I've got video evidence of this, too. XD

What don't you have video of?

You realize she's talking about pr0n, right?

[Threlizdun]

Fucking is fun. That's why it's usually done and is the sole reason why it will be happening when fertility is literally impossible. Sex is not naturally ordered towards childbearing, especially when it is naturally impossible.

Coitus remains naturally ordered towards childbearing even when either or both spouses are infertile. This is easily demonstrated by the fact that a single conjugal act does not necessarily result in procreation, even when both spouses are fertile.

It is ordered towards nothing. People have sex because they want to have sex. Childbearing can be a reason, but so can fun or the feeling of intimacy it creates between those involved in it.

A good analogy is a baseball team. A baseball team is naturally ordered towards winning baseball games, even if they never actually win a baseball game.

Baseball teams are natural phenomena ordered to an objective purpose now?

[Blasveck]

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

You seem to care a lot about how other people have sex considering you probably abstain from it.

Just saying.

[Pandeeria]

Yes they can.

You have your definition, I have mine. It doesn't really change the substance of the argument, which is that gay couples cannot engage in an act of sexual intercourse that involves the insertion of a penis into a vagina.

And? Who cares if they don't want heterosexual intercourse?

[Caecuser]

The state is the only one who can define what marriage is, anything else is not marriage.

I disagree. Marriage is a natural institution that predates the state; the state can either choose to provide legal protection for the institution or not, but they cannot change what it is.

By chance do you mean, "natural institution put in place by God"?

And you are wrong, it can be changed and has been changed.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

What don't you have video of?

You realize she's talking about pr0n, right?

That was the joke's implications and you just ruined a good followup, methinks

[Olthar]

There are men with vaginas and women with penises.

I've got video evidence of this, too. XD

What don't you have video of?

Iron Man 3.