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Could Hitler win WWII IF... he had divine foresight...

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God Kefka
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Could Hitler win WWII IF... he had divine foresight...

Postby God Kefka » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:51 pm

Everything happens as in the original timeline... however, within days AFTER the launching of Operation Barbarossa Hitler, in a dream, gets a vision from God telling him that when he wakes up he will find a book warning him about his impending doom if he does not ''change his ways.''

Hitler wakes up from this vivid dream and on his table was a copy of the American Pageant US History textbook. He has it translated and finds that there are several chapters in there about what happened in ''World War II.'' He learns in the general language of the book, that there is this narrative where he will invade Russia, lose at Stalingrad, Japan will launch some kind of Pearl Harbor nonsense, D-Day will happen etc

This is a general history textbook so it only covers the big events, nothing in minute details.

Now the question is... what happens at this point?

Does Hitler dismiss the textbook as being some kind of a prank (despite the dream) and proceed to fight the war as he did in OTL and still lose?

Does he take some of the book seriously, treat it as a divine map to the future, and do things differently from this point onward (change his diplomatic strategy, fight different battles in Russia etc)? This is the more interesting scenario.

Keep in mind that he's already invaded Russia but the rest of it hasn't happened yet...

Could he change the outcome of history and win WWII or at least get some kind of peace in his favor?

Keep in mind that this is Hitler we are dealing (he can be awfully stubborn and sometimes quite stupid). What happens now?

Speculate on how history may play out differently...
Last edited by God Kefka on Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Estado Paulista
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Postby Estado Paulista » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:52 pm

What the fuck?
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Benuty
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Postby Benuty » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:54 pm

Yahshua HaMaschiach wept...this is certainly odd.
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Postby Galloism » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:54 pm

Depending on the level of detail in the textbook, he may be able to drag out the war another 1-3 years if he heeds history.

However, against the might of Russia and the industry of America, there could be no victory.

Oh, and the British helped too.
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Mike the Progressive
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Postby Mike the Progressive » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:55 pm

Well sure, and if I was banging Sally Hindsight, maybe I would have invested in Google stock early on.
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Postby Neoconstantius » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:55 pm

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Postby Avenio » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:57 pm

No, because obviously Stalin would be recieving messages from the Devil to counter Hitler's divine prescience.

Come on, OP. It's like you've never even read Nostradamus.

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Benuty
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Postby Benuty » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:57 pm

Galloism wrote:Depending on the level of detail in the textbook, he may be able to drag out the war another 1-3 years if he heeds history.

However, against the might of Russia and the industry of America, there could be no victory.

Oh, and the British helped too.

Hitler was his own worst enemy could be described as the main factor of it all.
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Dangelia
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Postby Dangelia » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:57 pm

If he didn't invade Russia, he would've won the war. If he didn't invade Yugoslavia, he would've beaten Russia.

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God Kefka
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Postby God Kefka » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:57 pm

Galloism wrote:Depending on the level of detail in the textbook, he may be able to drag out the war another 1-3 years if he heeds history.

However, against the might of Russia and the industry of America, there could be no victory.

Oh, and the British helped too.


Just think of your typical high school textbook covering World War II very generally including the main battles in terms of the level of details...

I said American Pageant but it can really be any mainstream North American textbook that has World War II as the focus in one or more chapters.

So for example, they would mention the battle of Stalingrad and the impact of its outcome. But it won't mention in detail the positioning, organization, and numbers of the opposing forces etc, the situation breakdown in hours, specific general's memoirs etc...
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Postby Axonic » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:58 pm

Well, If He Ended his alliance with Japan, Then he could avoid getting America in the war... But the Soviets would crush him.
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Postby God Kefka » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:58 pm

Avenio wrote:No, because obviously Stalin would be recieving messages from the Devil to counter Hitler's divine prescience.

Come on, OP. It's like you've never even read Nostradamus.


No... the devil is not in the details here...
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Hindu America
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Postby Hindu America » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:59 pm

An alternate history website is what you are looking for.

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Postby Benuty » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:59 pm

Dangelia wrote:If he didn't invade Russia, he would've won the war. If he didn't invade Yugoslavia, he would've beaten Russia.

Bitter peace isn't exactly total victory.
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Postby Galloism » Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:59 pm

God Kefka wrote:
Galloism wrote:Depending on the level of detail in the textbook, he may be able to drag out the war another 1-3 years if he heeds history.

However, against the might of Russia and the industry of America, there could be no victory.

Oh, and the British helped too.


Just think of your typical high school textbook covering World War II very generally including the main battles in terms of the level of details...

I said American Pageant but it can really be any mainstream North American textbook that has World War II as the focus in one or more chapters.

So for example, they would mention the battle of Stalingrad and the impact of its outcome. But it won't mention in detail the positioning, organization, and numbers of the opposing forces etc, the situation breakdown in hours, specific general's memoirs etc...

Probably wouldn't make a damn bit of difference then.

And whoever the Time Lord is that's helping him, he sucks.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


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Galloism
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Postby Galloism » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:00 pm

Benuty wrote:
Galloism wrote:Depending on the level of detail in the textbook, he may be able to drag out the war another 1-3 years if he heeds history.

However, against the might of Russia and the industry of America, there could be no victory.

Oh, and the British helped too.

Hitler was his own worst enemy could be described as the main factor of it all.

Truth.

Great propagandist.

Terrible general.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


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Postby Imperializt Russia » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:00 pm

Hitler could have done significantly better, if not necessarily won, the war if he'd left the warfighting to people who knew how to warfight.

Hitler didn't.

He could have defeated the British at Dunkirk - encircled the Russians - bolstered the Italians - held the line in the Ardennes.

He did none of these things, and obviously lost the war.
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Saint Kitten
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Postby Saint Kitten » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:00 pm

Dangelia wrote:If he didn't invade Russia, he would've won the war. If he didn't invade Yugoslavia, he would've beaten Russia.

No, he still would've ended up like Napoleon :p
Last edited by Saint Kitten on Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Dangelia » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:00 pm

Axonic wrote:Well, If He Ended his alliance with Japan, Then he could avoid getting America in the war... But the Soviets would crush him.

If he didn't invade Russia, the soviets would've allied with Germany.

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Dangelia
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Postby Dangelia » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:01 pm

Saint Kitten wrote:
Dangelia wrote:If he didn't invade Russia, he would've won the war. If he didn't invade Yugoslavia, he would've beaten Russia.

No, he still would've ended up like Neapolitan :p
(I think I spelled his name wrong:/)

Not true, if he had Russia, he wouldn't have fought a war on two fronts, he could've focused much more troops, and money into France and Britain.

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Postby Galloism » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:02 pm

Dangelia wrote:
Axonic wrote:Well, If He Ended his alliance with Japan, Then he could avoid getting America in the war... But the Soviets would crush him.

If he didn't invade Russia, the soviets would've allied with Germany.

Presuming that happened, Britain, The US, and their allies would have one hell of a fight on their hands.
Venicilian: wow. Jesus hung around with everyone. boys, girls, rich, poor(mostly), sick, healthy, etc. in fact, i bet he even went up to gay people and tried to heal them so they would be straight.
The Parkus Empire: Being serious on NSG is like wearing a suit to a nude beach.
New Kereptica: Since power is changed energy over time, an increase in power would mean, in this case, an increase in energy. As energy is equivalent to mass and the density of the government is static, the volume of the government must increase.


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Postby Themiclesia » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:02 pm

With divine foresight, all competent1 military commanders can send Germany into victory.

1: that is to say, anyone but Hitler.
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Postby Saint Kitten » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:04 pm

Dangelia wrote:
Saint Kitten wrote:No, he still would've ended up like Neapolitan :p
(I think I spelled his name wrong:/)

Not true, if he had Russia, he wouldn't have fought a war on two fronts, he could've focused much more troops, and money into France and Britain.

I'm saying if he invaded (which is what I thought you meant by "he would've beaten Russia"). I don't think any nation has successfully attacked Moscow from the west.. Ever..
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Postby Avenio » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:05 pm

God Kefka wrote:
Avenio wrote:No, because obviously Stalin would be recieving messages from the Devil to counter Hitler's divine prescience.

Come on, OP. It's like you've never even read Nostradamus.


No... the devil is not in the details here...


Of course it's not, because your entire scenario is woefully inadequate.

What do the angelic hordes do? Do they descend to the Eastern Front and aid the Wehrmacht in their struggle against the godless Soviets? Surely the Archangel Gabriel would descend down out of Heaven to minister to the Allied High Command about the error of their ways and unite with the blessed Nazi forces against the atheistic, demonic forces of the proletarian abyss. Of course, if that happens, the Devil's allies in the Red Army would surely summon infernal allies of their own to even the playing field.

Jeez, do they not teach this stuff in Conjuring 101 anymore?

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Postby Ursymnia » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:06 pm

Dangelia wrote:
Axonic wrote:Well, If He Ended his alliance with Japan, Then he could avoid getting America in the war... But the Soviets would crush him.

If he didn't invade Russia, the soviets would've allied with Germany.

But fascism is vehemently anti Communist, and the bulk of the Russian army was short brown people from east Russia. Its why they're tanks are so short.

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