GUN CONTROL!

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

Quite simply, possession of weapons of any sort is patently incompatible with, and a threat to, a free society.

The entire purpose of a weapon is to impose one's will upon another. And as it happens, that that is the sort of social dynamic that is diametrically opposed to a free society.

[Blasveck]

Quite simply, possession of weapons of any sort is patently incompatible with, and a threat to, a free society.

The entire purpose of a weapon is to impose one's will upon another. And as it happens, that that is the sort of social dynamic that is diametrically opposed to a free society.

The purpose is also to defend oneself.

How do you propose ridding guns from society anyways?

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

Quite simply, possession of weapons of any sort is patently incompatible with, and a threat to, a free society.

The entire purpose of a weapon is to impose one's will upon another. And as it happens, that that is the sort of social dynamic that is diametrically opposed to a free society.

The purpose is also to defend oneself.

Such a situation only comes about when someone else is trying to impose hir will on you. It's not really addressing the root cause. Furthermore, some people have a seriously fucked-up idea of what constitutes an "attack" on them.

How do you propose ridding guns from society anyways?

Who said we should do that? I'm arguing for abolishing weapons.

Guns are fine. Weapons are the problem. If you want to shoot pieces of paper all day long, or blast watermelons to smithereens, go right ahead. It's a lot of fun; I used to do it myself from time to time. It's when you use it to impose your will on someone--whether aggressively or in so-called "self-defense"--that it becomes a problem.

The way to prevent this? Make guns available only at heavily-controlled target-shooting facilities, under lock and key, set up somehow so they can't operate after leaving the designated shooting zones.

[The Truth and Light]

Quite simply, possession of weapons of any sort is patently incompatible with, and a threat to, a free society.

The entire purpose of a weapon is to impose one's will upon another. And as it happens, that that is the sort of social dynamic that is diametrically opposed to a free society.

Define, "free."

[Blasveck]

The purpose is also to defend oneself.

Such a situation only comes about when someone else is trying to impose hir will on you. It's not really addressing the root cause. Furthermore, some people have a seriously fucked-up idea of what constitutes an "attack" on them.

How do you propose ridding guns from society anyways?

Who said we should do that? I'm arguing for abolishing weapons.

Guns are fine. Weapons are the problem. If you want to shoot pieces of paper all day long, go right ahead. It's when you use it to impose your will on someone--whether aggressively or in so-called "self-defense"--that it becomes a problem.

It may not address the root cause, but how will you deal with such a situation when it inevitably arises?

And I'm frankly confused about how you plan to abolish weapons, but not guns, when guns can "become" a "weapon" at a moment's notice.

Edit: I read your edit. Thanks for clarification.

[Spirit of Hope]

I'm arguing for abolishing weapons.

What do you consider a weapon? Please give some examples.

[Imperializt Russia]

I'm arguing for abolishing weapons.

What do you consider a weapon? Please give some examples.

Apparently, something that can be used in an offensive capacity.
Hence why firearms are fine so long as they never can leave a shooting range.

[Spirit of Hope]

What do you consider a weapon? Please give some examples.

Apparently, something that can be used in an offensive capacity.
Hence why firearms are fine so long as they never can leave a shooting range.

Yes but does that extend to knives? Blunt objects? You can see where I am going with this, I would like a definition of what he considers a weapon.

[Chernoslavia]

He's saying that being in the military don't make you top shot.

but on average trained people are better shots than untrained.

You don't think civilians get training too?

[The High Guardians]

but on average trained people are better shots than untrained.

You don't civilians get training too?

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

[Christmahanikwanzikah]

The way to prevent this? Make guns available only at heavily-controlled target-shooting facilities, under lock and key, set up somehow so they can't operate after leaving the designated shooting zones.

Explosives. Use explosives!

[Christmahanikwanzikah]

You don't civilians get training too?

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

Oh, so that's how I've been doing it wrong.

Next time I go to the range, I'll make sure to tell everyone to tell me how awful I am.

[Spirit of Hope]

You don't civilians get training too?

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

Ahh but what about police? Because I can tell you that I have outshot police officers on a couple of occasions and I generally only get to go to the range a couple of times a year. But that is all besides the point of talking about gun control, as this thread is supposed to talk about.

[New Waterford]

I fail to see why ownership of a device specifically and solely designed to maim and kill is seen as a basic human right, self defence or not.

[The High Guardians]

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

Oh, so that's how I've been doing it wrong.

Next time I go to the range, I'll make sure to tell everyone to tell me how awful I am.

No just let me stand 2 inches away from your face telling you how better a shot your mum is.

[Spirit of Hope]

I fail to see why ownership of a device specifically and solely designed to maim and kill is seen as a basic human right, self defence or not.

Well in the US it is enshrined in the constitution, and it was put there for a multitude of reasons. Which gets into the society of the time. The most important factors being, those that wrote the constitution had just gotten out of a war where private citizens using there own weapons had been a major contribution to the war effort, they wanted to keep that around. Secondly a large part of the country was still "frontier" and they planed to expand the country anyways, so they needed armed citizens to live on that frontier and protect/claim it. Thirdly they wanted an armed citizenry to act as a defense against a possible tyranny, but that one gets rather complicated.

[Dyakovo]

but on average trained people are better shots than untrained.

You don't civilians get training too?

I assume you inadvertently omitted "think"...
Some do get proper training, some don't.

[Dyakovo]

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

Oh, so that's how I've been doing it wrong.

Next time I go to the range, I'll make sure to tell everyone to tell me how awful I am.

Unless training standards have gone to shit in the last 20 years, I seriously doubt he's in the military...
That isn't what firearms training in either the Army or Marines is like.

[Dyakovo]

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

Ahh but what about police? Because I can tell you that I have outshot police officers on a couple of occasions and I generally only get to go to the range a couple of times a year. But that is all besides the point of talking about gun control, as this thread is supposed to talk about.

Actually, it really isn't off-topic... Ensuring proper training is one of the things we've mentioned as being part of the gun control measures we'd like to see put in place.

[Ayreonia]

Not on the same level, I'm military and unless you guys are spending 7-8 hours a range a week with someone drill sergeant in your ear reminding you how rubbish you are. It's literally not the same, I've seen civilians learning how to use a rifle and soldiers. Different training...entirely.

Ahh but what about police? Because I can tell you that I have outshot police officers on a couple of occasions and I generally only get to go to the range a couple of times a year. But that is all besides the point of talking about gun control, as this thread is supposed to talk about.

Outshooting someone at the range does not mean you're a better shot in an actual firefight.

[The High Guardians]

Oh, so that's how I've been doing it wrong.

Next time I go to the range, I'll make sure to tell everyone to tell me how awful I am.

Unless training standards have gone to shit in the last 20 years, I seriously doubt he's in the military...
That isn't what firearms training in either the Army or Marines is like.

I'm not the U.S.....

[Dyakovo]

Ahh but what about police? Because I can tell you that I have outshot police officers on a couple of occasions and I generally only get to go to the range a couple of times a year. But that is all besides the point of talking about gun control, as this thread is supposed to talk about.

Outshooting someone at the range does not mean you're a better shot in an actual firefight.

Very true.

[Dyakovo]

Unless training standards have gone to shit in the last 20 years, I seriously doubt he's in the military...
That isn't what firearms training in either the Army or Marines is like.

I'm not the U.S.....

Fair enough.
Where ever you're from, your firearms training was shit.

[The High Guardians]

I'm not the U.S.....

Fair enough.
Where ever you're from, your firearms training was shit.

My nations troops aren't known for blue on blue. We are known for however receiving blue on blue from Americans.

[Ayreonia]

Fair enough.
Where ever you're from, your firearms training was shit.

My nations troops aren't known for blue on blue. We are known for however receiving blue on blue from Americans.

Well, if your firearms training consists of firing from the prone for hours and hours while being told you suck, I'm not surprised you don't hit friendlies.