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White History Month.

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Should White People get a equal footing as black people?

Poll ended at Thu Dec 12, 2013 8:56 pm

Yes
340
69%
No
155
31%
 
Total votes : 495

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Vamtrl
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Postby Vamtrl » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:20 pm

Shaggai wrote:
Vamtrl wrote:
History class would have been great if they taught us about mongol hordes.

They did in my class.


Where are you located?

I had to take an elective (genocide class) to learn about histories of other countries, I love Canada but Canadian history is fucking boring.

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Grantica
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Postby Grantica » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:22 pm

Gauthier wrote:If the whites didn't enslave, oppress and discriminate against blacks there'd have been no need for a Black History Month to begin with.

Y'all brought it upon yourselves.

I did none of those things, and I am white.

Am I not an individual?
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Huntmar
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Postby Huntmar » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:23 pm

White has always been on top. Now we're pretty much even. The whites were never on the bottom, they never had to suffer through slavery and racism like blacks did. That's why we give a month to them, the people who toiled hard day after day for nothing. A white history month is just a sham by the bourgeois.
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Kanery
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Postby Kanery » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:24 pm

Blacks have a have a history month to make up for the discrimination they've received, if that happens to whites then sure.
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Postby Valendia » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:26 pm

Grantica wrote:
Gauthier wrote:If the whites didn't enslave, oppress and discriminate against blacks there'd have been no need for a Black History Month to begin with.

Y'all brought it upon yourselves.

I did none of those things, and I am white.

Am I not an individual?


Social =/= Individual. Americans seem to have a problem in conflating the two.
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Valendia
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Postby Valendia » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:26 pm

Huntmar wrote:White has always been on top. Now we're pretty much even. The whites were never on the bottom, they never had to suffer through slavery and racism like blacks did. That's why we give a month to them, the people who toiled hard day after day for nothing. A white history month is just a sham by the bourgeois.


*white Christian heterosexual males.
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Shaggai
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Postby Shaggai » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:26 pm

Vamtrl wrote:
Shaggai wrote:They did in my class.


Where are you located?

I had to take an elective (genocide class) to learn about histories of other countries, I love Canada but Canadian history is fucking boring.

'MURICA! HELL YEAH!

Seriously though, you have to take an elective just to learn about other countries?
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Vamtrl
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Postby Vamtrl » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:26 pm

Huntmar wrote:White has always been on top. Now we're pretty much even. The whites were never on the bottom, they never had to suffer through slavery and racism like blacks did.


In North America history sure.

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Yumyumsuppertime
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Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:29 pm

Vamtrl wrote:
Huntmar wrote:White has always been on top. Now we're pretty much even. The whites were never on the bottom, they never had to suffer through slavery and racism like blacks did.


In North America history sure.


And since "Black History Month" is a North American thing, and "White History Month" was proposed by the OP as a counter to it, that's exactly what we're talking about. Nobody's proposing a Black OR White History Month for the entire world.

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Slooshas Crossing
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Postby Slooshas Crossing » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:29 pm

LOLing at poll question.

OP, do you know what would really happen if white people were treated like black people?

This.

"Equal footing" would be a downgrade for white people. Check your privilege.
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Drawkland
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White History Month.

Postby Drawkland » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:30 pm

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Vamtrl
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Postby Vamtrl » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:30 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
Vamtrl wrote:
In North America history sure.


And since "Black History Month" is a North American thing, and "White History Month" was proposed by the OP as a counter to it, that's exactly what we're talking about. Nobody's proposing a Black OR White History Month for the entire world.


LOL this is my ignorance speaking about its only in North America? Color me surprised.

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Vamtrl
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Postby Vamtrl » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:31 pm

Shaggai wrote:
Vamtrl wrote:
Where are you located?

I had to take an elective (genocide class) to learn about histories of other countries, I love Canada but Canadian history is fucking boring.

'MURICA! HELL YEAH!

Seriously though, you have to take an elective just to learn about other countries?


Yup, we started from colonization up to the Korean War.

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Benuty
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Postby Benuty » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:33 pm

Meh I prefer ethnic history months anyway. So who is up for Bantu and Slovakian history month?
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Mkuki
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Postby Mkuki » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:36 pm

Benuty wrote:Meh I prefer ethnic history months anyway. So who is up for Bantu and Slovakian history month?

1. Bantu? I prefer Zulu.
2. Slovakia has a cool-ass flag. That's reason enough.
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Postby Nazi Flower Power » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:37 pm

Vamtrl wrote:
Shaggai wrote:Or nobody and just include it in the curriculum as a whole.


History class would have been great if they taught us about mongol hordes.


They'd probably find some way to make it boring anyway. Mongol hordes are cool, but some history teachers can suck the life out of anything.

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Ooh! Can we have Nazi History Month?


Sure. :roll:


What are you rolling your eyes about? >:(
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Vamtrl
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Postby Vamtrl » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:47 pm

Nazi Flower Power wrote:What are you rolling your eyes about? >:(


No reason. :roll:

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Postby Nazi Flower Power » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:48 pm

Vamtrl wrote:
Nazi Flower Power wrote:What are you rolling your eyes about? >:(


No reason. :roll:


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Mistelemr
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Postby Mistelemr » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:50 pm

Grantica wrote:
Gauthier wrote:If the whites didn't enslave, oppress and discriminate against blacks there'd have been no need for a Black History Month to begin with.

Y'all brought it upon yourselves.

I did none of those things, and I am white.

Am I not an individual?


You did not personally do it, but you HAVE personally benefited from the entrenched racism, as well as the gains made long ago from slavery. So while you are not DIRECTLY responsible for it, you are INDIRECTLY so.

Thus, you shouldn't have to pay them reparations in a court of law as an individual, but should you have any damn moral decency you should feel an obligation to help them via laws and programs meant to erase the gap that exists between white and black in a societal manner.

Surely when we have personally gained from what was done by them, we can at least give something, even if something small, back to them so that they may have some chance at leveling the playing field.

I know people here seem to hate it, but I really like Affirmative Action in cases like this. I don't really like quota's but, lending a helping hand is by no means racist. Let's repair the damage that was done, and then eventually things like Affirmative Action can fade away, and we'll have less racial tension as a result.
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The USOT
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Postby The USOT » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:51 pm

Mkuki wrote:You make good points, however, is there any actual evidence that these dedicated months have had any real effects all on their own?
In all honesty I dont know. I know individuals who it has had notable effects on but dont know if there are any studies to show it as effective. I cant see however how a month where it is more notable could not make issues related with black history more apparent however. Hell we are having this very conversation because of it XD

1. "Many"? What constitutes "many"?
2. "I know very few people (outside of civilisation players) that have had any experience of Persia beyond 300."- USOT, you should know by now that anecdotal evidence is rarely evidence of anything.
Normally I would agree. The point here isnt neccesarily that a large number of these people exist. The point is that some adults are walking around bearing no knowledge of such an amazing civilisation that (depending on interpretation) lasted longer than the Roman civilisation. If anything the one area where Anecdotal evidence can be useful is to say "this kind of person exists" rather than neccesarily the quantity.
The many constitutes almost everyone who I know enough to have had a conversation remotely relating to history. That I know of, I only know 3 people who know what the Persian Empire was outside of civilisation or 300 :( now as said im sure that is not indicative of a trend to a global nature, but my issue relating to Adults not understanding their cultural history (no matter the number) concerns me.

Time is indeed a great problem. May be a good time to restructure the education system in the United States.
I dont think its just a problem with the US. Here in the UK we still have a lot of problems with education too. I reccomend looking up "digital aristotle" as an interesting future alternative to industrial education.
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Cameroi
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Postby Cameroi » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:52 pm

if such a thing as "white people" existed. but they don't. there are a number of eurocentric ethnicities. that is as close as it gets to there being such a thing.

the only way you could have a white history, would be about the history of white pigments used in paint.
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Conservative Conservationists
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Postby Conservative Conservationists » Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:05 pm

What is white culture?

Its something that most people have a very hard time explaining.

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Mkuki
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Postby Mkuki » Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:09 pm

The USOT wrote:
Mkuki wrote:You make good points, however, is there any actual evidence that these dedicated months have had any real effects all on their own?
In all honesty I dont know. I know individuals who it has had notable effects on but dont know if there are any studies to show it as effective. I cant see however how a month where it is more notable could not make issues related with black history more apparent however. Hell we are having this very conversation because of it XD

I find it rare that coverage of African-American history in schools is extended beyond the big names (MLK, GWC, Malcolm X, etc.) and big events (Slavery, ACW black units, Civil Rights Movement, etc.). Rarely are people like Marcus Garvey deeply discussed and analyzed.

The above is why I think Black History Month has trivialized African-American history. Rarely, in my experience (as regrettably anecdotal it is), is African-American history truly looked at and discussed. A video here, a light discussion there and your done. It's disappointing.

Normally I would agree. The point here isnt neccesarily that a large number of these people exist. The point is that some adults are walking around bearing no knowledge of such an amazing civilisation that (depending on interpretation) lasted longer than the Roman civilisation. If anything the one area where Anecdotal evidence can be useful is to say "this kind of person exists" rather than neccesarily the quantity.
The many constitutes almost everyone who I know enough to have had a conversation remotely relating to history. That I know of, I only know 3 people who know what the Persian Empire was outside of civilisation or 300 :( now as said im sure that is not indicative of a trend to a global nature, but my issue relating to Adults not understanding their cultural history (no matter the number) concerns me.

1. I think there's a reason for that. Roman (and Greek) civilization have had a greater direct impact on Western thought and law than the Persian empires ever did. It doesn't help that the Greeks under Alexander ended up wrecking them.
2. Another reason I can think of for this historical ignorance is that history, at least in American schools, and the related social studies aren't as heavily emphasized as science classes or math classes. Also, the general perception of history being linear, unfun, and rigid (rather than being nonlinear, exciting, and dynamic) could also be one reason for such ignorance.
3. If people are using movies like 300 to justify their personal opinions then the movies are, most likely, not the problem or point of origin of said opinions.

I dont think its just a problem with the US. Here in the UK we still have a lot of problems with education too. I reccomend looking up "digital aristotle" as an interesting future alternative to industrial education.

I will. I, personally, like the teaching styles of John Green, Hank Green, and CGPGrey. Some of the more well known of the YouTube education people.

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Last edited by Mkuki on Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Nazi Flower Power » Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:24 pm

Mkuki wrote:I find it rare that coverage of African-American history in schools is extended beyond the big names (MLK, GWC, Malcolm X, etc.) and big events (Slavery, ACW black units, Civil Rights Movement, etc.). Rarely are people like Marcus Garvey deeply discussed and analyzed.

The above is why I think Black History Month has trivialized African-American history. Rarely, in my experience (as regrettably anecdotal it is), is African-American history truly looked at and discussed. A video here, a light discussion there and your done. It's disappointing.


I think that applies to history in general. Even big things like WWII are not analyzed very insightfully unless you study them independently or at a good college.
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Vamtrl
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Postby Vamtrl » Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:27 pm

Nazi Flower Power wrote:
Vamtrl wrote:
No reason. :roll:


Eyerollers are an inferior race! We must annihilate them for the good of Germany!


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

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