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Best Presidents of the U.S.

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Olivaero
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Postby Olivaero » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:32 pm

Divair wrote:
New Corenea wrote:Liberals in foreign sense (except for Great Britain and South Korea and a few other countries) are more associated with American conservatism or libertarianism. The liberals in America are are closer to democratic socialist ideology and traditional conservatism.

Democrats favored regulation on market, progressive tax rates, and bigger government which is associated with European socialism. Republicans favored free market, low taxes, and smaller government which is associated with classical liberalism on the case of Europe and most countries

This post makes no sense and I find it hard to believe you're someone who has any knowledge in politics after referencing democratic socialism when discussing the USA or claiming there's something called European socialism.

Considering he/she also said the republicans are pro small government I think it's pretty clear how clueless he/she is.
Last edited by Olivaero on Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Divair
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Postby Divair » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:32 pm

New Corenea wrote:Socialists in Europe made some changes in their ideology in the cold war. If you look at important socialist parties in Europe, they're not focusing on revolution or something like that. They focus on the topic of welfare, regulation, stronger central government, something Democrats bring up

There are almost no popular socialist parties anywhere in Europe. Most of Europe is run by center-right parties very similar to the Democrats or center-left parties very similar to the Justice Party or 1940's era Democrats/1950's era Republicans.

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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:36 pm

The Socialist Party in France, the Social-Democrat party in Germany, the Labour Party in Britain, the Socialist Party in Bulgaria,
They're pretty important. centre-left parties are influential and France is under a Socialist President Francois Hollande
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Divair
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Postby Divair » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:37 pm

New Corenea wrote:The Socialist Party in France, the Social-Democrat party in Germany, the Labour Party in Britain, the Socialist Party in Bulgaria,
They're pretty important. centre-left parties are influential and France is under a Socialist President Francois Hollande

They're all social democrats. Much like North Korea calling itself a democratic republic, names mean nothing.

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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:38 pm

The New Deal by Franklin D Roosevelt pretty much created the American form of liberalism which contrast with the liberalism continnental Europe uses vastly
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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:39 pm

Those are social democrats. Not denying that and the Democrat Party in the US is have nearly the same principles as these centre-left parties in Europe
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Divair
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Postby Divair » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:40 pm

New Corenea wrote:Those are social democrats. Not denying that and the Democrat Party in the US is have nearly the same principles as these centre-left parties in Europe

No it doesn't. The Democrats have in the past shrunk welfare, "denationalized" (if you can even call it that, the US is so far right it very rarely actually nationalizes something) industries, and introduced austerity measures.


And social democrats aren't socialists.

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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:44 pm

Obamacare is pretty much nationalizing healthcare, Obama's planned education budget nationalize the education system, Democrats support higher taxation on rich people, and there's still lots of welfare in America, used by both economically disadvantaged and welfare kings and queens
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Divair
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Postby Divair » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:47 pm

New Corenea wrote:Obamacare is pretty much nationalizing healthcare,

A mandate to buy insurance from private insurance companies isn't anything like nationalization. Do you even know what the fuck nationalization is?

New Corenea wrote:Obama's planned education budget nationalize the education system,

Source.

New Corenea wrote:Democrats support higher taxation on rich people,

So do center-right parties everywhere else. Progressive taxation is a given for every party that isn't far-right.

New Corenea wrote:and there's still lots of welfare in America, used by both economically disadvantaged and welfare kings and queens

Compared to Europe or South America it's nothing.
Last edited by Divair on Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro
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Postby Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:50 pm

I'm a Brazilian who learned English and to a minor degree Spanish by himself because he is a digital native.

Of course I only know that Bush the Kid was surely in the top 5 of the worst persons to be democratically elected in all of the 21st century regarding their countries (even worse than Putin if considering this aspect, and I am proud bi genderqueer, everybody knows Russia is backward, they need the good ol' PLC 122 i.e. the planned anti-heterosexist Brazilian thought police) and Obama is not good, and "worse than regular" according to Americans I know, but he surely is much less worse.
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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:51 pm

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Divair
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Postby Divair » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:52 pm

New Corenea wrote:http://www.ed.gov/news/press-releases/obama-administration-2014-budget-prioritizes-key-education-investments-provide-o

You have no fucking clue what nationalization is, do you? Where does it say the government is taking over private schools and universities?

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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:52 pm

Although I can't say I oppose the education budget, this is only from one side of the review so it could be sinister than said
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Hippostania
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Postby Hippostania » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:58 pm

Republican:
1) Ronald Reagan
2) Calvin Coolidge
3) Dwight D. Eisenhower
4) George W. Bush
5) William McKinley

Democrat:
1) Andrew Jackson
2) Harry S. Truman
3) John F. Kennedy
4) James Buchanan
5) James K. Polk
Factbook - New Embassy Program
Economic Right: 10.00 - Social Authoritarian: 2.87 - Foreign Policy Neoconservative: 9.54 - Cultural Liberal: -1.14
For: market liberalism, capitalism, eurofederalism, neoconservatism, British unionism, atlanticism, LGB rights, abortion rights, Greater Israel, Pan-Western federalism, NATO, USA, EU
Against: communism, socialism, anarchism, eurosceptism, agrarianism, Swiss/Irish/Scottish/Welsh independence, cultural relativism, all things Russian, aboriginal/native American special rights

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Conservadores
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Postby Conservadores » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:59 pm

Republican:
1- Ronald Reagan
2 - Calvin Coolidge
3 - Dwight D. Eisenhower
4 - George W. Bush
5 - William McKinley

Democrat :
1- JFK
2 - LBJ
3 - Woodrow Wilson
4 - Grover Cleveland
5 - Andrew Johnson
Last edited by Conservadores on Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Americanada
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Postby Americanada » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:08 pm

Top 5 Republican Presidents

1. Abraham Lincoln
2. Ulysses S. Grant
3. Theodore Roosevelt
4. Dwight D. Eisenhower
5. Richard Nixon

Top 5 Democratic Presidents

1. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
2. Harry Truman
3. John F. Kennedy
4. Lyndon B. Johnson
5. Bill Clinton
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Frisivisia
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Postby Frisivisia » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:09 pm

Conservadores wrote:Republican:
1- Ronald Reagan
2 - Calvin Coolidge
3 - Dwight D. Eisenhower
4 - George W. Bush
5 - William McKinley

Democrat :
1- JFK
2 - LBJ
3 - Woodrow Wilson
4 - Grover Cleveland
5 - Andrew Johnson

It's like you picked the essential opposite of what makes sense. Ronny Dumbfuck and Calvin Coolidge were two of the worst Presidents of the 20th century.

While I'm a fan of JFK and LBJ, they do have that Vietnam thing to answer for.
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TaQud
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Postby TaQud » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:12 pm

Conservadores wrote:Republican:
1- Ronald Reagan
2 - Calvin Coolidge
3 - Dwight D. Eisenhower
4 - George W. Bush
5 - William McKinley

is it a coincidence that you have same top 5 republican as hippostania's?
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Hippostania
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Postby Hippostania » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:13 pm

TaQud wrote:
Conservadores wrote:Republican:
1- Ronald Reagan
2 - Calvin Coolidge
3 - Dwight D. Eisenhower
4 - George W. Bush
5 - William McKinley

is it a coincidence that you have same top 5 republican as hippostania's?

I find this rather curious as well. Even McKinley managed to get a place in his list.
Factbook - New Embassy Program
Economic Right: 10.00 - Social Authoritarian: 2.87 - Foreign Policy Neoconservative: 9.54 - Cultural Liberal: -1.14
For: market liberalism, capitalism, eurofederalism, neoconservatism, British unionism, atlanticism, LGB rights, abortion rights, Greater Israel, Pan-Western federalism, NATO, USA, EU
Against: communism, socialism, anarchism, eurosceptism, agrarianism, Swiss/Irish/Scottish/Welsh independence, cultural relativism, all things Russian, aboriginal/native American special rights

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Inter de Milano
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Postby Inter de Milano » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:18 pm

Top 5 Republicans:
1. Abraham Lincoln
2. Dwight D. Eisenhower
3. Theodore Roosevelt
4. Richard Nixon
5. William H. Taft

Top 5 Democrats:
1. Franklin D. Roosevelt
2. Bill Clinton
3. Lyndon B. Johnson
4. John F. Kennedy
5. Harry Truman
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Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro
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Postby Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:18 pm

Americanada wrote:Top 5 Republican Presidents

1. Abraham Lincoln
2. Ulysses S. Grant
3. Theodore Roosevelt
4. Dwight D. Eisenhower
5. Richard Nixon

Top 5 Democratic Presidents

1. Franklin Delano Roosevelt
2. Harry Truman
3. John F. Kennedy
4. Lyndon B. Johnson
5. Bill Clinton


While I have no fucking idea of who Grant was, and Nixon was presented to me in a very negative light, if what I learned in school makes some sense I totally approve of the Democratic list.
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Test: Seemingly, libertarian communism was renamed "social democracy"
Compass: economic left -9.85, social libertarian -8.97
Socio-Economic Ideology: Democratic Socialist (92% ditto/Marxist, 75% Anarchist/Social democrat, 0% etc)

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Hippostania
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Founded: Nov 23, 2008
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Postby Hippostania » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:20 pm

Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:Nixon was presented to me in a very negative light

And for a good reason: He was one of the worst American presidents of the 20th century.
Factbook - New Embassy Program
Economic Right: 10.00 - Social Authoritarian: 2.87 - Foreign Policy Neoconservative: 9.54 - Cultural Liberal: -1.14
For: market liberalism, capitalism, eurofederalism, neoconservatism, British unionism, atlanticism, LGB rights, abortion rights, Greater Israel, Pan-Western federalism, NATO, USA, EU
Against: communism, socialism, anarchism, eurosceptism, agrarianism, Swiss/Irish/Scottish/Welsh independence, cultural relativism, all things Russian, aboriginal/native American special rights

Hippo's Political Party Rankings (updated 21/7/2013)

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Conservadores
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Founded: Jul 22, 2013
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Postby Conservadores » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:21 pm

TaQud wrote:
Conservadores wrote:Republican:
1- Ronald Reagan
2 - Calvin Coolidge
3 - Dwight D. Eisenhower
4 - George W. Bush
5 - William McKinley

is it a coincidence that you have same top 5 republican as hippostania's?


It's just a coincidence .
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Occupied Deutschland
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Postby Occupied Deutschland » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:24 pm

Republican:
1. N/A
2. N/a
3. N/A
4. N/A
5. Calvin Coolidge

Democrat:
1. N/A
2. N/A
3. N/A
4. N/A
5. Grover Cleveland

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New Corenea
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Postby New Corenea » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:26 pm

I am rooting for Whole Pizza in 2016. Do not be swayed by leftovers from earlier times, whole pizza will bring a fresh, warm outlook to the Presidency.


^^
I would to vote for Whole Pizza
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