Fascism: Good or Bad?

[Frisivisia]

I think that the idea that people should do the most for their country, and only their country, is stupid.

That is wrong, too.
You should do all you can for the flag that flies above your land. By doing so for your country you will also be doing so for your fellow citizens in the country, meaning you all work hard for one common goal; the betterment of your nation.

Not when the flag is perverting the interests of those people.

[Pensalum]

I think that the idea that people should do the most for their country, and only their country, is stupid.

That is wrong, too.
You should do all you can for the flag that flies above your land. By doing so for your country you will also be doing so for your fellow citizens in the country, meaning you all work hard for one common goal; the betterment of your nation.

So, you should support your country even if you don't agree with anything it's doing? Don't you think people should be able to disagree or go against their flag?

[Tsmida Eri]

...probably one of the better Fascist leaders. Like Pinochet...

If I collected all the people who thought that together, I bet I could fill a football stadium.

American Football or European Football?

[Utceforp]

Okay, so name one time when fascism was successful. Getting back to my original argument.

The Perons seemed to manage it pretty well.

I don't know enough about them, so I will assume for the sake of argument that they are as good as you say. But the Hitlers, Mussolinis and Generalissimos that Fascist governments tend to produce outweighs the benefits of any one Peron-like leader.

[Verdum]

That is wrong, too.
You should do all you can for the flag that flies above your land. By doing so for your country you will also be doing so for your fellow citizens in the country, meaning you all work hard for one common goal; the betterment of your nation.

So, you should support your country even if you don't agree with anything it's doing? Don't you think people should be able to disagree or go against their flag?

You heard the word Ultranationalist, right?

The Government would be doing what the people want anyways. In a Ultranationalist society, when everyone only wants to better the nation, we all have one common goal.

[Tsmida Eri]

The Perons seemed to manage it pretty well.

I don't know enough about them, so I will assume for the sake of argument that they are as good as you say. But the Hitlers, Mussolinis and Generalissimos that Fascist governments tend to produce outweighs the benefits of any one Peron-like leader.

That's because most Fascist leaders are extremists, sadly. There hasn't been very many sensible Fascists. I feel so alone.

[Verdum]

That is wrong, too.
You should do all you can for the flag that flies above your land. By doing so for your country you will also be doing so for your fellow citizens in the country, meaning you all work hard for one common goal; the betterment of your nation.

Not when the flag is perverting the interests of those people.

Ugh, Biden.

Like I said; Ultranationalist Government does what the nation needs(Or so they think).

People want to do what the nation needs.
Not much conflict.

[Utceforp]

I think that the idea that people should do the most for their country, and only their country, is stupid.

That is wrong, too.
You should do all you can for the flag that flies above your land. By doing so for your country you will also be doing so for your fellow citizens in the country, meaning you all work hard for one common goal; the betterment of your nation.

But why do all you can for your country when you could be doing all you can for the world? The needs of all of the other countries outweigh the needs of one country.

[Pandeeria]

So, you should support your country even if you don't agree with anything it's doing? Don't you think people should be able to disagree or go against their flag?

You heard the word Ultranationalist, right?

The Government would be doing what the people want anyways. In a Ultranationalist society, when everyone only wants to better the nation, we all have one common goal.

ul·tra·nat·ion·al·ism
ˌəltrəˈnaSHənəˌlizəm/
noun
1.
extreme nationalism that promotes the interest of one state or people above all others.
"the Yugoslav president is fanning the flames of ultranationalism"

Again, people should work together (voluntarily) for the betterment of humanity. And being ultra-patriotic is exactly good, especially if you lived in nazi Germany.

[Pandeeria]

I don't know enough about them, so I will assume for the sake of argument that they are as good as you say. But the Hitlers, Mussolinis and Generalissimos that Fascist governments tend to produce outweighs the benefits of any one Peron-like leader.

That's because most Fascist leaders are extremists, sadly. There hasn't been very many sensible Fascists. I feel so alone.

I don't think totalitarianism, ultra-nationalism, suppression of rights, extreme over-militarization, etc. is exactly sensible.

[Pensalum]

You heard the word Ultranationalist, right?

The Government would be doing what the people want anyways. In a Ultranationalist society, when everyone only wants to better the nation, we all have one common goal.

The definition of ultra-nationalism is extreme nationalism, especially when opposed to international cooperation.

So, if The people want to better the government, by say, changing it wouldn't that go against the state. Also, what happens when two groups of people have different ideas on how to better the government?

We can see in many societies today, that the governments, despite their effort, don't do what the people want them too.

[Tsmida Eri]

That's because most Fascist leaders are extremists, sadly. There hasn't been very many sensible Fascists. I feel so alone.

I don't think totalitarianism, ultra-nationalism, suppression of rights, extreme over-militarization, etc. is exactly sensible.

It's not Ultranationalist, there's no such thing as 'rights', and it's not extreme over-militarization. You're either thinking of Nazism or Italian Fascism.

[Morganutopia]

State before self is a bad plan,but us over I is a good plan. Fascism Bad.

State before self be a bad plan,but us over I be a jolly plan. Fascism Bad.

[Pandeeria]

I don't think totalitarianism, ultra-nationalism, suppression of rights, extreme over-militarization, etc. is exactly sensible.

1. It's not Ultranationalist, 2. there's no such thing as 'rights', 3. and it's not extreme over-militarization. 4. You're either thinking of Nazism or Italian Fascism.

1. Wikipedia states:

Fascism /ˈfæʃɪzəm/ is a form of radical authoritarian nationalism.

2. I think the UN along with hundreds of other nations and probably billions of people would like to disagree with you on that one.

3. Fair enough, though fascist states do have the tendency to be militaristic.

4. Were they not fascist at all?

[Lerodan Chinamerica]

Just another vile leftist ideology.

[Pandeeria]

Just another vile rightist ideology.

Fixed.

[Mewtinigrad]

Just another vile leftist ideology.

>leftist

I don't think that word means what you think it means

[Pensalum]

Just another vile rightist ideology.

Fixed.

Personally, I think the whole left-right view of politics is broken. It's too constricting, and doesn't define the forms of governments well enough. Fascism supports economic control by the state, which can be viewed as a left policy, however it also supports limiting rights, which is more right.

[Blasveck]

I don't think totalitarianism, ultra-nationalism, suppression of rights, extreme over-militarization, etc. is exactly sensible.

It's not Ultranationalist, there's no such thing as 'rights', and it's not extreme over-militarization. You're either thinking of Nazism or Italian Fascism.

I find it odd that you didn't address the "Totalitarian" bit.

And yes, rights exist.

[Pandeeria]

Fixed.

Personally, I think the whole left-right view of politics is broken. It's too constricting, and doesn't define the forms of governments well enough. Fascism supports economic control by the state, which can be viewed as a left policy, however it also supports limiting rights, which is more right.

Under fascism there are still privately owned means if production. And as Mussolini said:

Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power.
~Benito Mussolini

[Verdum]

That is wrong, too.
You should do all you can for the flag that flies above your land. By doing so for your country you will also be doing so for your fellow citizens in the country, meaning you all work hard for one common goal; the betterment of your nation.

But why do all you can for your country when you could be doing all you can for the world? The needs of all of the other countries outweigh the needs of one country.

Ha.
Hahaha.
HAHAHAHA.
That's funny, man! You had me going the-
Oh, you're serious. Yeah, no. I would prefer bettering MY country, MY people, and MY situation.

The definition of ultra-nationalism is extreme nationalism, especially when opposed to international cooperation.

So, if The people want to better the government, by say, changing it wouldn't that go against the state. Also, what happens when two groups of people have different ideas on how to better the government?

We can see in many societies today, that the governments, despite their effort, don't do what the people want them too.

International Cooperation? Screw the rest of the world; they don't give two holy hell's about you.

And no Government is perfect. Take America's for example; they SHUT DOWN.

[Imperializt Russia]

I enjoy the nationalistic and militaristic aspects of fascism.
As concepts.

Just not how nationalism usually ends up working, ie being racist and genocidal.

As such, fascism is on a whole bad.

[Utceforp]

But why do all you can for your country when you could be doing all you can for the world? The needs of all of the other countries outweigh the needs of one country.

Ha.
Hahaha.
HAHAHAHA.
That's funny, man! You had me going the-
Oh, you're serious. Yeah, no. I would prefer bettering MY country, MY people, and MY situation.

How is a country any more "yours" than the world? To paraphrase Diogenes, we are "citizens of the world". And either way, you have a very selfish viewpoint. Why are you special? Why should you spend your time bettering your country, people and situation, when there are many other countries, peoples and situations that could be bettered?

[Verdum]

Ha.
Hahaha.
HAHAHAHA.
That's funny, man! You had me going the-
Oh, you're serious. Yeah, no. I would prefer bettering MY country, MY people, and MY situation.

How is a country any more "yours" than the world? To paraphrase Diogenes, we are "citizens of the world". And either way, you have a very selfish viewpoint. Why are you special? Why should you spend your time bettering your country, people and situation, when there are many other countries, peoples and situations that could be bettered?

Because the other countries are not our problem. I don't care about Africa, I don't care about Kuwait, Iraq, or Iran. I don't really want to start on Syria due to that being a very touchy subject right now, but the basic point is: I. Don't. Care.

[Pandeeria]

How is a country any more "yours" than the world? To paraphrase Diogenes, we are "citizens of the world". And either way, you have a very selfish viewpoint. Why are you special? Why should you spend your time bettering your country, people and situation, when there are many other countries, peoples and situations that could be bettered?

Because the other countries are not our problem. I don't care about Africa, I don't care about Kuwait, Iraq, or Iran. I don't really want to start on Syria due to that being a very touchy subject right now, but the basic point is: I. Don't. Care.

You don't care about others? Isn't that really selfish?