Adult Baby Persecuted By Senator

[The Black Forrest]

I wonder how much the Senator is spending going after this guy......

[Nailed to the Perch]

He's demonstrated ,on television, behavior that suggests he may be able to function in society. Investigating whether or not that's the case is a completely valid move.

Seriously-affected PTSD people lose their conscience and start to have violent outbursts where they completely lose their personal sense of space and time and are sent back to their oppressive environment.

Quick note: while PTSD absolutely can cause violent outbursts, that's certainly not always how severe PTSD works. Generally, particularly bad flashbacks will cause intense and overwhelming fear, but whether one reacts to that fear by fighting or running away or hiding or going catatonic or sobbing uncontrollably or any of a number of other responses will vary with the person in question. None of those responses are likely to be particularly conducive to functioning in a work environment, though.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Quick note: while PTSD absolutely can cause violent outbursts, that's certainly not always how severe PTSD works. Generally, particularly bad flashbacks will cause intense and overwhelming fear, but whether one reacts to that fear by fighting or running away or hiding or going catatonic or sobbing uncontrollably or any of a number of other responses will vary with the person in question. None of those responses are likely to be particularly conducive to functioning in a work environment, though.

Thanks for the enlightenment. There are some years (I think it was 2008 or 2009) that I don't read about the condition and the controversy so I didn't remember things very well.

On any case, it is a very serious disability indeed, and I think sufferers should deserve respect. Even because nothing more nothing less than the Bush government and its corporate-friendly fool-deceiving wars is to blame for the most recent wave of cases.

He's clearly suffering an anti-kink witchhunt; nothing, no offense, that I wouldn't see happening in the country of DOMA where the average age of consent is 18 and where prostitutes are mostly regarded as criminals, though.

[The Tiger Kingdom]

Are you currently drawing welfare for being unable to work? I assume you're not.

You know what they say about assumptions?

...That everyone makes them all the time?

I'm not currently receiving SSDI. I am currently unable to work. And yet I can still do all the things you cited as evidence that someone couldn't possibly be disabled.

Like I said you said you have an unspecified pair of those problems listed above that make you unable to work. Fine. I won't and shouldn't inquire as to which, as that would be rude and doesn't matter anyway.
He apparently has an "unspecified" number of such issues, which could mean anything from five (one more than the four explicitly ennumerated) to...well, sky's the limit, apparently. I still don't think your situation and what he claims his to be are entirely the same.

That about ends the comparison between you and him.
What I was clearly saying was that it's odd he's apparently literally unable to work, WHILE SIMULTANEOUSLY being able to do all those other things, in the face of spinal injuries and all the other (unspecified) stuff.
Quit projecting.

Kiddo, I'm not "projecting." I'm "actually having first-hand experience with disability." You seem to think it's suspicious that someone could have multiple serious things wrong with them and yet do more than drool on themselves. That's bunk.

It's obviously bunk, but judging from how many he claims he has, and how severe he claims they are...
And again, I'm speaking purely to what I see of his situation. I'm not blanket-ly saying everyone who has PTSD is a faker or should just get over it, because that's stupid and wrong, or that everyone who's on disability is totally incapable of movement.
Something about his story just seems off to me.

And if we want proof of how much you DON'T know what you're talking about...

I will admit, I'm not on disability, and like I said, I'm not intending to speak generally about disability or in general. If I came off that way, I didn't do a good job representing what I'm trying to say.

That's also true.
But I think we both know that doctors aren't infallible, or mind-readers. For example, if you insist you've got terrible, horrible back pain to a doctor that can't find any reason for it, he's not going to call you a faker.

...methinks you've never gone to a doctor with terrible, horrible pain and no obvious reason for it, because this is the exact opposite of true.

Admittedly, I have not, but I have had friends go into docs, claiming (falsely) they were in pain, have the docs basically say "I have no idea what your deal is", and getting medicinal pot for it. You hear stories like that all the time. It does happen.

And as to the "normal people" comment...yeah. No defending that.
I fucked up, and I apologize.
A lot of times, I write too fast, and what comes out is stupid (hence my high edit count). It was late, I was tired, and I apparently got careless. I didn't mean anything offensive by it - to you or anyone, or to imply that disabled people aren't "normal". Feel free to substitute "non-disabled" or something like that for that particular word.
I'm legitimately sorry about it.

[Herskerstad]

Should a baby-diaper lifestyle be subsidized by the government? No.

Should severe PTSD qualify for disability benefits? Yes.

Seeing how he also have work-related skills, it would be best for the social office to see if they cannot find ways to get him some part-time work at home if that's what he prefers, maybe decrease the disability payments while he gets to keep the profit of that labor, increasing his financial gains and limiting the load from the taxpayer. Win-win.

[Llamalandia]

While, i still fail to see how this is a relevant topic in 2013 given that this story all happened in 2011, but whatever. I will say this, putting aside some of the specifics of htis case it seems as though it highlights the problems inherent in disability payments, which to often seem to be based on what you can't do rather than what you can. As has clearly beenestablished this guy can at least on part time basis work out of his making handcrafted furniture (including perhaps providing an custom work for an extremely specific niche). I mean, yeah ok he has ptsd (if i recall correctly though the guy is a moron who keeps getting himself hospitalized which as I recall is what triggers his ptsd) fine, can't work a regualr 9 to 5 fine, he seems to have plenty of skill as a communicator online, I fail to see why, he couldn't be selling furniture from home, heck the amish make good money doing it and they don't even have internet or electricity (well unless youre in the amish mafia ).

But just to reiterate here, why is this story from 2011 suddenly relevant 2 years later?

[Galloism]

Quick note: while PTSD absolutely can cause violent outbursts, that's certainly not always how severe PTSD works. Generally, particularly bad flashbacks will cause intense and overwhelming fear, but whether one reacts to that fear by fighting or running away or hiding or going catatonic or sobbing uncontrollably or any of a number of other responses will vary with the person in question. None of those responses are likely to be particularly conducive to functioning in a work environment, though.

Thanks for the enlightenment. There are some years (I think it was 2008 or 2009) that I don't read about the condition and the controversy so I didn't remember things very well.

On any case, it is a very serious disability indeed, and I think sufferers should deserve respect. Even because nothing more nothing less than the Bush government and its corporate-friendly fool-deceiving wars is to blame for the most recent wave of cases.

He's clearly suffering an anti-kink witchhunt; nothing, no offense, that I wouldn't see happening in the country of DOMA where the average age of consent is 18 and where prostitutes are mostly regarded as criminals, though.

I'd have to make a chart to confirm it, but I think the average age of consent is 16.

Also, DOMA is dead.

[Nailed to the Perch]

You know what they say about assumptions?

...That everyone makes them all the time?

I'm not currently receiving SSDI. I am currently unable to work. And yet I can still do all the things you cited as evidence that someone couldn't possibly be disabled.

Like I said you said you have an unspecified pair of those problems listed above that make you unable to work. Fine. I won't and shouldn't inquire as to which, as that would be rude and doesn't matter anyway.
He apparently has an "unspecified" number of such issues, which could mean anything from five (one ore than the four explicitly ennumerated) to...well, sky's the limit, apparently. I still don't think your situation and what he claims his to be are entirely the same.

Well, they're definitely not entirely the same, insofar as I have no interest in dressing up in diapers. That said, you still seem to be working from the idea that having lots of things wrong with you is somehow suspicious. The thing is, that's one of those ideas people fortunate enough to be in good health tend to come up with and not really analyze. Not only does having Health Problem A not make you any less likely to have Health Problem B than anyone else, it very frequently makes it MORE likely, because our bodies aren't systems of totally independent parts. Say, for example, someone gets in a car accident and badly breaks their leg, so they're stuck in a wheelchair for six months. Sitting all the time greatly increases their chance of all sorts of health problems, from blood clots to hemorrhoids to muscular degeneration to weight gain. That weight gain increases their chance of developing type 2 diabetes. The pain may give them insomnia, exacerbating their underlying tendency towards depression. Lack of sleep also weakens their immune system, making, say, the cold they happen to catch turn into pneumonia, causing permanent lung damage. And so on and so forth. And that's just the issues where one health problem causes or contributes to another - in his case, there's apparently an obvious reason why one cause could lead to multiple health problems. Someone who was severely abused as a child having both physical and mental trauma is pretty much the exact opposite of suspicious.

(Incidentally, just to be clear, while I do have two of the same health issues he does, neither of them is directly responsible for causing me to be so disabled I can't work. They do, however, both worsen and be worsened by the other health problems that are doing so; my depression, for example, is kicking my ass much more these days than it generally did back when I wasn't in chronic pain, and also makes it significantly harder for me to motivate myself to do things like "go to physical therapy regularly.")

Kiddo, I'm not "projecting." I'm "actually having first-hand experience with disability." You seem to think it's suspicious that someone could have multiple serious things wrong with them and yet do more than drool on themselves. That's bunk.

It's obviously bunk, but judging from how many he claims he has, and how severe he claims they are...
And again, I'm speaking purely to what I see of his situation. I'm not blanket-ly saying everyone who has PTSD is a faker or should just get over it, because that's stupid and wrong, or that everyone who's on disability is totally incapable of movement.
Something about his story just seems off to me.

And if we want proof of how much you DON'T know what you're talking about...

I will admit, I'm not on disability, and like I said, I'm not intending to speak generally about disability or in general. If I came off that way, I didn't do a good job representing what I'm trying to say.

...methinks you've never gone to a doctor with terrible, horrible pain and no obvious reason for it, because this is the exact opposite of true.

Admittedly, I have not, but I have had friends go into docs, claiming (falsely) they were in pain, have the docs basically say "I have no idea what your deal is", and getting medicinal pot for it. You hear stories like that all the time. It does happen.

I suspect you probably haven't asked a lot of disabled people for their stories.

That said, getting medical marijuana in states where it's legal is a very different task than getting disability payments. From what I've heard (I don't live in a state where it's legal, more's the pity), there are plenty of doctors who are happy to prescribe it for people without a lot of investigation not because they trust everyone who comes in but because they feel that the harm in denying it to someone whom it would actually help is greater than the harm in not making a drug-seeker who really wants an easily-accessible, mostly-harmless drug get it from a dealer instead. Try doing the same thing with, say, opiates, and you'll likely get a very different result in most cases - and successfully getting approved for disability payments is far, far harder than either, especially if your disability is anything less obvious than, like, "I am literally missing all of my limbs."

And as to the "normal people" comment...yeah. No defending that.
I fucked up, and I apologize.
A lot of times, I write too fast, and what comes out is stupid (hence my high edit count). It was late, I was tired, and I apparently got careless. I didn't mean anything offensive by it - to you or anyone, or to imply that disabled people aren't "normal". Feel free to substitute "non-disabled" or something like that for that particular word.
I'm legitimately sorry about it.

It's sincerely appreciated.

[Geilinor]

But just to reiterate here, why is this story from 2011 suddenly relevant 2 years later?

I have no idea. This thread should be left to die.

[Neo Art]

Is this another useless eaters flamenco?

[Neo Art]

But just to reiterate here, why is this story from 2011 suddenly relevant 2 years later?

Because this forum has attracted the attention of one individual who has made "disability secession" his little pet project, and will periodically show up to announce to the world how the disabled are being oppressed, often drudging up years old stories to do so, becoming increasingly more aggressive and hostile until he gets his nation deleted, where he then disappears for a while, only to renew the cycle.

I suspect this is just the newest incarnation.

[Nailed to the Perch]

But just to reiterate here, why is this story from 2011 suddenly relevant 2 years later?

Because this forum has attracted the attention of one individual who has made "disability secession" his little pet project, and will periodically show up to announce to the world how the disabled are being oppressed, often drudging up years old stories to do so, becoming increasingly more aggressive and hostile until he gets his nation deleted, where he then disappears for a while, only to renew the cycle.

I suspect this is just the newest incarnation.

It doesn't look like it. The OP's personal stake seems to be about "adult babies," not disability in general.

(Also, I always felt bad about Useless Eaters. He would start with a reasonable point that I agreed with completely, and then carry it off into some strange tinfoil-hat world that left me going, "wut" - and an awful lot of people didn't do a good job of mocking just the "wut" part and not the underlying good point.

On the other hand, my sig still cracks me the fuck up. )

[Neo Art]

It doesn't look like it. The OP's personal stake seems to be about "adult babies," not disability in general.

Yes, well...

Incarnation #1 before Useless Eaters.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

I'd have to make a chart to confirm it, but I think the average age of consent is 16.

Also, DOMA is dead.

Well, general perception where I lived is that it is still too moralistic in regards to sexuality and relationships by the standards of the developed world, and average by the standards of the continental Americas (Canada, Uruguay, Argentina, Brazil, Chile and IIW Costa Rica are more liberal and Mexico, Venezuela and Colombia are as liberal).

It is higher than 16 on most states, and those who have 17 are the small minority.

1996-2013 is... 17 years? And it isn't fully dead.

[Galloism]

I'd have to make a chart to confirm it, but I think the average age of consent is 16.

Also, DOMA is dead.

Well, general perception where I lived is that it is still too moralistic in regards to sexuality and relationships by the standards of the developed world, and average by the standards of the continental Americas (Canada, Uruguay, Argentina, Brazil, Chile and IIW Costa Rica are more liberal and Mexico, Venezuela and Colombia are as liberal).

It is higher than 16 on most states, and those who have 17 are the small minority.

1996-2013 is... 17 years? And it isn't fully dead.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_ ... th_America

29 states plus DC say 16.
9 states say 17.
12 states say 18.

The majority say 16, pretty clear cut.

And DOMA is dead. Section three was struck as unconstitutional. The rest was either constitutionally already that way, and thus irrelevant, or unconstitutional.

Thus, DOMA is dead.

[Llamalandia]

Well heck since it's being talked about anyway, let me share this nugget from the bio on the man's own website:

So we decided to move to California for three reasons. The first was because in California shock treatment is only voluntary. It cannot be forced on you. Not yet at least. Secondly because SSI pays $870.00 a month compared to New York's $525.00. And the third reason was because I was willing to give one more shot at repairing the relationship between me and my mom.

http://www.bedwettingabdl.com/Stanleys_personal_page_Part5.html

Asside from the obvious question of ptential cost of living difference negating some of the net gain here, seriously you move half way across the country in part because…you get more govt money? Really.

But also from Coburn's senate page:

Man living as an ‘adult baby’ is cleared of Social Security fraud

Even Coburn is acknowledging that an investigation seems to have substaniated the claim of disability by this guy as least as far as the letter of the law is concerned (I still question if this is really in keeping with the spirit of the program but meh what can ya do?)

http://www.coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/news?ContentRecord_id=340d6faf-ff06-4582-8a2d-eb0d8ce5ff6c&ContentType_id=abb8889a-5962-4adb-abe8-617da340ab8e&Group_id=2b5f5ef9-5929-4863-9c07-277074394357&MonthDisplay=10&YearDisplay=2011

[Nailed to the Perch]

Well heck since it's being talked about anyway, let me share this nugget from the bio on the man's own website:

So we decided to move to California for three reasons. The first was because in California shock treatment is only voluntary. It cannot be forced on you. Not yet at least. Secondly because SSI pays $870.00 a month compared to New York's $525.00. And the third reason was because I was willing to give one more shot at repairing the relationship between me and my mom.

http://www.bedwettingabdl.com/Stanleys_personal_page_Part5.html

Asside from the obvious question of ptential cost of living difference negating some of the net gain here, seriously you move half way across the country in part because…you get more govt money? Really.

I'm not sure why that's supposed to be bad? Most people tend to consider finances when deciding on a move.

[Llamalandia]

Well heck since it's being talked about anyway, let me share this nugget from the bio on the man's own website:

http://www.bedwettingabdl.com/Stanleys_personal_page_Part5.html

Asside from the obvious question of ptential cost of living difference negating some of the net gain here, seriously you move half way across the country in part because…you get more govt money? Really.

I'm not sure why that's supposed to be bad? Most people tend to consider finances when deciding on a move.

Because it govt money he's chasing, not too mention if youre so poor that u rely on a $500 a month govt check (and actually i believe he and his friends received more in total benefits) how the heck can you afford to move from one coast to another, I mean literally he went from NY to CA, that's crazy, kind undermines any argument about how america is full of "food deserts" and people are trapped geographically in improverished areas without access to good food.
Again, I realize this wasn't his only motivation for moving but still it just strikes me as odd, especially considering that california is generally a fairly high CoL state (though i suppose NY isn't cheap either).

[Neo Art]

Well heck since it's being talked about anyway, let me share this nugget from the bio on the man's own website:

http://www.bedwettingabdl.com/Stanleys_personal_page_Part5.html

Asside from the obvious question of ptential cost of living difference negating some of the net gain here, seriously you move half way across the country in part because…you get more govt money? Really.

I'm not sure why that's supposed to be bad? Most people tend to consider finances when deciding on a move.

I KINDA get it, it seems a bit of "gaming the system". I'm all for people getting the help they need, but a bit of...strategic relocation to best take advantage of social welfare programs...rubs me a little bit the wrong way.

On the other hand, one would hope our social welfare system was robust enough that such choices wouldn't really prove beneficial, as it wouldn't really matter. But I can understand how something that seems to be a bit of..moving across country to maximize money received from taxpayers can seem a little disconcerting.

[Republic of South Carolina]

PTSD dissipates over time, unless it is C-PTSD. I was diagnosed with PTSD by the VA when I came back after my last deployment(which was the worst of all my tours). I never really had any symptoms or just ignored them. I made the VA Seal my records and that diagnoses since I am in Law Enforcement. My agencies shrink has not been able to detect any PTSD, so it was most likely CSR. I did not beg for any Government benefits or pills and kept on working a career almost as stressful as a combat zone(in the right(or wrong (however you look at it) places). If he does have C-PTSD then he should get the benefits. Otherwise, suck it up, get a job, pay taxes, and take your medication. Too many former members of the Armed Forces are faking PTSD symptoms to milk the teat..

[Nailed to the Perch]

I'm not sure why that's supposed to be bad? Most people tend to consider finances when deciding on a move.

Because it govt money he's chasing

So? Money is money. Most people prefer having more money over having less money. Why this is shocking is beyond me.

, not too mention if youre so poor that u rely on a $500 a month govt check (and actually i believe he and his friends received more in total benefits) how the heck can you afford to move from one coast to another

Lots of ways. If you don't have a lot of stuff, the cost of moving from one coast to the other can simply be the cost of transporting yourself and a couple of suitcases. Have a friend who's making a road trip anyway, or a willingness to sleep in your van, or something like that, and that cost gets more than low enough to be worth it purely financially for an extra $345 a month even if you didn't also have very good reasons to want to move.

, I mean literally he went from NY to CA, that's crazy, kind undermines any argument about how america is full of "food deserts" and people are trapped geographically in improverished areas without access to good food.

I don't see how. The fact that someone who is unemployed and has no dependents or obligations to anyone in their area can move cross-country says very little about whether the average poor person can do so. I'm also not sure why you think people on that kind of budget would be likely to move from an impoverished area to a nice area rather than from an impoverished area to a different impoverished area.

Again, I realize this wasn't his only motivation for moving but still it just strikes me as odd, especially considering that california is generally a fairly high CoL state (though i suppose NY isn't cheap either).

It seems likely that he knows his budget better than random people on the internet, and figured out how cost of living would impact him.

[AiliailiA]

He's clearly suffering an anti-kink witchhunt; nothing, no offense, that I wouldn't see happening in the country of DOMA where the average age of consent is 18

DOMA has been killed by the Supreme Court. Didn't you hear?

As to age of consent, no the average is not 18. Wikipedia.
18: 12 States
17: 9 States
16: 30 States

... and about a third of states have close-in-age exemptions, or at least reduced penalties for the older partner. On the other hand, a quarter or so have higher age of consent when the older partner is in a position of authority (typically these are age 16 states, so it's still not over 18).

EDIT: I see Galloism has covered this exactly the same way. I'm not THAT slow, I must have forgot to refresh the page before replying.
Anyway, yank-bashing fail.

and where prostitutes are mostly regarded as criminals, though.

Not sure how relevant this is to the thread. Lacking details, we shouldn't assume that there is anything sexual about the man's "babyhood" or his volunteer "mothering".

[Llamalandia]

I'm not sure why that's supposed to be bad? Most people tend to consider finances when deciding on a move.

I KINDA get it, it seems a bit of "gaming the system". I'm all for people getting the help they need, but a bit of...strategic relocation to best take advantage of social welfare programs...rubs me a little bit the wrong way.

On the other hand, one would hope our social welfare system was robust enough that such choices wouldn't really prove beneficial, as it wouldn't really matter. But I can understand how something that seems to be a bit of..moving across country to maximize money received from taxpayers can seem a little disconcerting.

i wouldn't be surprised though if there wasn't some calculation made about state level benefits as well that he may have ommitted from his bio here. I mean I don't have hard data in front of me but as far as i recall California is generally pretty generous on this kind of stuff.

Part my problem with the guy though is that his ptsd is often triggered and exacerbated the most by a very specific thing. namely being involuntarily committed to psych ward/mental hospital whatever. And yet, periodically throughout his life he has felt the need to call suicide hpotlines which he know will result in his involuntary commitment to the very places that in fact make him less healthy and probably more suicidal to boot! I mean seriously, if his website is as extensive as he claims maybe he could reach out to some people online to get him thorugh the rough times instead of calling people he know will end up sending a freaking ambulance and psych team and forcibly remove him from his home. I mean I'm sorry but it's a huge waste of resources and I'm not trying to throw all the blame on him here, some of the problem is probably tied up with mandatory reporting laws/policies but come on at some point you gotta wise up and quit calling every time youre depressed.

[Llamalandia]

Because it govt money he's chasing

So? Money is money. Most people prefer having more money over having less money. Why this is shocking is beyond me.

, not too mention if youre so poor that u rely on a $500 a month govt check (and actually i believe he and his friends received more in total benefits) how the heck can you afford to move from one coast to another

Lots of ways. If you don't have a lot of stuff, the cost of moving from one coast to the other can simply be the cost of transporting yourself and a couple of suitcases. Have a friend who's making a road trip anyway, or a willingness to sleep in your van, or something like that, and that cost gets more than low enough to be worth it purely financially for an extra $345 a month even if you didn't also have very good reasons to want to move.

, I mean literally he went from NY to CA, that's crazy, kind undermines any argument about how america is full of "food deserts" and people are trapped geographically in improverished areas without access to good food.

I don't see how. The fact that someone who is unemployed and has no dependents or obligations to anyone in their area can move cross-country says very little about whether the average poor person can do so. I'm also not sure why you think people on that kind of budget would be likely to move from an impoverished area to a nice area rather than from an impoverished area to a different impoverished area.

Again, I realize this wasn't his only motivation for moving but still it just strikes me as odd, especially considering that california is generally a fairly high CoL state (though i suppose NY isn't cheap either).

It seems likely that he knows his budget better than random people on the internet, and figured out how cost of living would impact him.

ok let me rephrase i'm questioning the morality of moving from one state to another for the express purpose of collecting more govt money, yes Irealize it's in his own self-interest obviously.
As for dependents as Irecall from his bio which i have actually rad, he was living with two very disabled friends of his at the time of the move and while they weren't technically listed as dependents i nthe same way kids might be (in fact as irecall they had some limited power of attorney over him so they could make medical decisions on his behalf everytime he gets committed to a psych facility) these people would likely be even harder to move cross country with and I'm fairly certain sleeping in the van wasn't really an option given there special needs. I'd say that's bit more cumbersome then managing and assisting a few kids in a move. And yes i realize we can't entirely extrapolate much about al poor people from this one guy, I'm just saying though that if he can do it i think a reasonable person would conclude there is precedent for many more poor people to be more than I often here them portrayed to be on site.

[Llamalandia]

The goverment has no right to be dealing with this guy who acts like a baby!!! They should let him be! The Government is becoming more nosy lately!! And how did this senator find out? Was it the NSA?

Fair enough but then let him be means zero interference, means no more free govt checks.

I mean I hate govt spying on us citizens too, ( and quite frankly outside the terrorist hotbed type countries i'd prefer we not be spying on other foreigners either) but seriously when you get free money you get some scrutiny too, thats part othe American social compact.