US Government Shutdown? Not any more!

[The Serbian Empire]

The Citizens of the United States are to blame for the shutdown, and the impending default. We continue to vote these fools into office every election cycle, then look at each other utterly dumbfounded when the broken system continues to be broken.

I suspect that is a product of the First Past the Post system offering little more than two types of political dung, Republican and Democrat.

[YellowApple]

We're to blame. The political system is to blame. Republicans and Democrats alike are to blame. Everyone is to blame.

This has been coming for years; as both sides of the bipartisan political landscape continue to polarize, compromise becomes decreasingly feasible.

Even if we do work through the current shutdown, this will happen again, and will continue to happen, unless we make a conscious effort to throw out the asshats currently polluting our Congress and bring in some new life. Unfortunately, even that might not fix anything, since it's pretty likely that the only candidates to vote for will just be new generations of asshattery.

Bipartisanship: not even once.

[New Chalcedon]

Hopefully the default can be avoided and the Tea Party loses a lot of power at the same time. Best of both worlds.

And the GOP collapses leaving a sane center-right party to form from the ashes.

One can hope.

You've already got one of those. It's called the Democratic Party.

[Vault 1]

You've already got one of those. It's called the Democratic Party.

...and a left-winger as always comes to the rescue, bearing the flag of Perfection Itself, the party that is never to be blamed for anything, in whole or in the smallest part.

It doesn't fit the criteria of "sane" or "center-right".

[HappyShark]

We're to blame. The political system is to blame. Republicans and Democrats alike are to blame. Everyone is to blame.

This has been coming for years; as both sides of the bipartisan political landscape continue to polarize, compromise becomes decreasingly feasible.

Even if we do work through the current shutdown, this will happen again, and will continue to happen, unless we make a conscious effort to throw out the asshats currently polluting our Congress and bring in some new life. Unfortunately, even that might not fix anything, since it's pretty likely that the only candidates to vote for will just be new generations of asshattery.

Bipartisanship: not even once.

This pretty much explains it ...

[New Chalcedon]

Current Chance of Default: 73.9% .

The New Jersey Special Senate Election tomorrow should be a good indicator of the initial democratic boost from this situation - the more blame being directed toward the Republicans, the less votes Lonegan will get.

First, too soon to tell.
Second, a special election will have an even lower (and whiter, and older, and more conservative) turnout than a midterm. So no, not really representative of the chances of Democrats going forward.

In reference to your earlier post: I do hope you were joking when you listed Colorado, Minnesota and Virginia as plausible Republican pickups.

Sen. Mark Udall (D-CO) is near or above 50% in all polls to date, and typically between 10 and 15 points ahead of any named Republican challenger.

Sen. Al Franken (DFL-MN) may have won by a squeaker in 2008, but not only is the MN GOP horribly disorganised (they can't even afford the rent on their own HQ!), there aren't any Republicans in Minnesota with the stature to take on a Democratic incumbent statewide and win. What's more, he may have been a comedian in a previous career, but he's been, to date, a respectable junior Senator, tacking on amendments to other members' bills to get things done and generally being good at his job...which is why he leads any and all Republican candidates by 15-20 points and is over the 50% mark in all polls to date.

Sen. Mark Warner (D-VA) has been another respectable junior Senator, the VA GOP is in shambles (with two of their top three statewide officeholders, McDonnell and Cucinelli, under investigation for corruption-related crimes) and the polls are once again showing him with garish leads or 10-20%, depending on the GOP candidate. I doubt he'll end up that far ahead, but I don't think he'll sweat re-election that badly at all.

On the flip side, I'd advise you take Nebraska off the "possible Democratic pickup" list. While NE-02 (Omaha) is a legit tossup district (and the Democrats have just landed a candidate there, in specific reaction to the GOP incumbent's stunningly-stupid remarks about keeping his pay while others are denied theirs), Nebraska as a whole is a ruby-red State...as former Sen. Bob Kerrey's (D-NE) failed comeback attempt last year showed. He got pasted.

But enough of the threadjack. This thread isn't about the 2014 Senate elections.

[Distruzio]

We're to blame. The political system is to blame. Republicans and Democrats alike are to blame. Everyone is to blame.

This has been coming for years; as both sides of the bipartisan political landscape continue to polarize, compromise becomes decreasingly feasible.

Even if we do work through the current shutdown, this will happen again, and will continue to happen, unless we make a conscious effort to throw out the asshats currently polluting our Congress and bring in some new life. Unfortunately, even that might not fix anything, since it's pretty likely that the only candidates to vote for will just be new generations of asshattery.

Bipartisanship: not even once.

We?

Nope. Don't blame me. I don't vote. The democratists of the nation put the asshats in office. I agitated for ambivalence and rejection.

[Neu California]

You've already got one of those. It's called the Democratic Party.

...and a left-winger as always comes to the rescue, bearing the flag of Perfection Itself, the party that is never to be blamed for anything, in whole or in the smallest part.

It doesn't fit the criteria of "sane" or "center-right".

I'm not seeing any of the things you claim are being said in the first paragraph in this thread. At all.

[New Chalcedon]

We're to blame. The political system is to blame. Republicans and Democrats alike are to blame. Everyone is to blame.

This has been coming for years; as both sides of the bipartisan political landscape continue to polarize, compromise becomes decreasingly feasible.

Even if we do work through the current shutdown, this will happen again, and will continue to happen, unless we make a conscious effort to throw out the asshats currently polluting our Congress and bring in some new life. Unfortunately, even that might not fix anything, since it's pretty likely that the only candidates to vote for will just be new generations of asshattery.

Bipartisanship: not even once.

What a load of tosh. Bipartisanship was been the heart of everything the Democrats have tried to do - at every turn, they've watered down and compromised bills, even when they had large majorities in both Chambers, in an effort to attract at least a few Republican votes.

The problem is that bipartisanship is a game that takes two to play, and from the moment Obama was elected, the GOP decided to take a leaf from Nancy Reagan's book and "just say no!" to everything and anything that Democrats offered....even if it was based upon their own policy proposals.

[YellowApple]

Nope. Don't blame me. I don't vote.

Then unless you're not an American (if that's the case, then feel free to ignore this post), you're at fault, too.

It's a lose-lose situation; you either vote from yet another selection of incompetent brats who know everything about getting elected but nothing about actually doing something useful with their positions, or you don't vote at all, providing less resistance against said incompetent brats as they scoop up gullible voters. And of course the media plays along, too, with excuses like "hurr durr turrurrusts" or "hurr durr urburmur's burth curturfurcurt" or "hurr durr surndy hurk" or "hurr durr urburturn urs murdur" or "hurr durr durth tur thur guyrs" or "hurr durr trurvurn murturn" or whatever other half-baked sensationalist crap they vomit out while shitting all over proper journalism for the sake of profit.

You're at fault. I'm at fault. Dorothy's little dog is at fault. Everyone's at fault.

[Distruzio]

Nope. Don't blame me. I don't vote.

Then unless you're not an American (if that's the case, then feel free to ignore this post), you're at fault, too.

It's a lose-lose situation; you either vote from yet another selection of incompetent brats who know everything about getting elected but nothing about actually doing something useful with their positions, or you don't vote at all, providing less resistance against said incompetent brats as they scoop up gullible voters. And of course the media plays along, too, with excuses like "hurr durr turrurrusts" or "hurr durr urburmur's burth curturfurcurt" or "hurr durr surndy hurk" or "hurr durr urburturn urs murdur" or "hurr durr durth tur thur guyrs" or "hurr durr trurvurn murturn" or whatever other half-baked sensationalist crap they vomit out while shitting all over proper journalism for the sake of profit.

You're at fault. I'm at fault. Dorothy's little dog is at fault. Everyone's at fault.

I'm still not seeing how I'm a part of the we you mentioned...

then again, Grave-n-Idle would point out that I don't see this because I am, regardless of my anti-democratism and pro-monarchism, an irresponsible democratist. Which is, according to him, quite offensive and disappointing.

[New Chalcedon]

You've already got one of those. It's called the Democratic Party.

...and a left-winger as always comes to the rescue, bearing the flag of Perfection Itself, the party that is never to be blamed for anything, in whole or in the smallest part.

It doesn't fit the criteria of "sane" or "center-right".

And a right-winger, as always, claims that the shutdown is the Democrats' fault, despite the fact that Reid tried to enter conference committee nineteen separate times with Boehner, only to be rejected, despite the fact that the Democrats are willing to compromise around the edges, despite the fact that Boehner is flat-out lying when he says that a clean CR would fail in the House (enough Republicans have publicly stated that they'll vote for a clean CR to ensure its passage if the Dems support it, and they will).

The Republicans did this, you may recall, the moment they took the House in 2011. Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) even remarked after the last "deal" that the debt ceiling was "a hostage worth ransoming", foreshadowing the present crisis......and you say it's the Democrats' fault?

Yeah, right. Whatever.

[Trotskylvania]

The Citizens of the United States are to blame for the shutdown, and the impending default. We continue to vote these fools into office every election cycle, then look at each other utterly dumbfounded when the broken system continues to be broken.

I suspect that is a product of the First Past the Post system offering little more than two types of political dung, Republican and Democrat.

No, absent some other substantive reforms in the way the legislative and executive branches work together, abandoning first past the post would likely make the problem worse, because it would jeopardize the ability for any party to have a working majority in Congress.

[Ashmoria]

did you watch that 60minutes piece and, if so, did your head explode?

I would really like it if you would all stop scaring and upsetting me.

The worst part is, I used to be very conservative. Almost libertarian.

And now, thanks to Republicans and their actions/statements, I'm honestly wanting to become an outright socialist.

I read Engel and Marx, and was unconvinced.

I hear Limbaugh and Coulter, and I'm down with Che (minus the anti-gay stuff).

it IS scary. its so scary that I LONG for the days when republicans were just conservative. where did those people go?

[DogDoo 7]

I suspect that is a product of the First Past the Post system offering little more than two types of political dung, Republican and Democrat.

No, absent some other substantive reforms in the way the legislative and executive branches work together, abandoning first past the post would likely make the problem worse, because it would jeopardize the ability for any party to have a working majority in Congress.

You know, California switched to jungle primaries last year, and the state legislature actually appears to be governing. Maybe the Feds should take notice of this.

[Ashmoria]

Probably not the best thing to think...but...I'm starting to think the Democrats should just give into the GOP's demands...I mean the GOP played the game of politics, and have won. Sure it's wrong a minority party is able to outplay the clear governmental majority but they did.

the other problem is that they have no demands. mr Boehner cant get his own bill passed by the house.

[Ashmoria]

did you watch that 60minutes piece and, if so, did your head explode?

No, I haven't heard anything about it. Do you have a link?

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50156574n

its a tad one-sided.

[Ashmoria]

Then what are they?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... ions,_2012

I'd say the problem isn't with a lot of the incumbents, though there are a fair few shitty incumbents, but with the new Tea Party assholes in Congress.

its more the tea party assholes outside of congress. the rational republican reps are afraid of being primaried. it turns out that the on-the-ground republican activists are tea partiers in most highly republican districts. they cant get elected without them. (or maybe they would have to do some actual campaigning and convince non-teaparty republicans to vote in the primary. but that would mean work. *shudder*)

[Ashmoria]

Every part of this government is to blame for different aspects of the shutdown. House republicans are responsible for the shutdown itself after rejecting numerous bills from the senate, Senate democrats are responsible for its continuation by rejecting numerous bills from the House, and the executive branch (and accordingly Obama) is responsible for the petty ways in which the shutdown has been made manifest, through the closing and barricading of memorials and cemeteries, the removal of water fountain handles along jogging trails, the closure of entire stretches of open ocean, etc.

I vote for tossing them ALL out and starting over fresh.

lol the numerous bills from the house.....43 bills defunding obamacare, numerous ones banning abortion or defunding planned parenthood, a few post offices being named, and a demand that the rest of government capitulate to all of the above plus a varying laundry list of other crap or face economic destruction.

"the petty ways" is what has to happen when you no longer have people doing their jobs. you cant just walk away without locking up.

[Jamjai]

You know, California switched to jungle primaries last year, and the state legislature actually appears to be governing. Maybe the Feds should take notice of this.

So it means if I default, California has a good chance to secede and run their own government

[Destiny Island]

You know, California switched to jungle primaries last year, and the state legislature actually appears to be governing. Maybe the Feds should take notice of this.

So it means if I default, California has a good chance to secede and run their own government

Yes. And I might join said government.

[Nigerian Kenya]

You know, California switched to jungle primaries last year, and the state legislature actually appears to be governing. Maybe the Feds should take notice of this.

So it means if I default, California has a good chance to secede and run their own government

The only reason CA government is working is because the democrats have supermajorities in both houses of the california legislature. Not just majorities. Supermajorities. Meaning that the Republicans are so few in number that it makes no difference (legislatively) whether they are there or not.

[HappyShark]

Nope. Don't blame me. I don't vote.

Then unless you're not an American (if that's the case, then feel free to ignore this post), you're at fault, too.

It's a lose-lose situation; you either vote from yet another selection of incompetent brats who know everything about getting elected but nothing about actually doing something useful with their positions, or you don't vote at all, providing less resistance against said incompetent brats as they scoop up gullible voters. And of course the media plays along, too, with excuses like "hurr durr turrurrusts" or "hurr durr urburmur's burth curturfurcurt" or "hurr durr surndy hurk" or "hurr durr urburturn urs murdur" or "hurr durr durth tur thur guyrs" or "hurr durr trurvurn murturn" or whatever other half-baked sensationalist crap they vomit out while shitting all over proper journalism for the sake of profit.

You're at fault. I'm at fault. Dorothy's little dog is at fault. Everyone's at fault.

but but ...but you have to believe...

Democrats

I really laughed hard when I saw this one

----------------------
Republicans

----------------------
American Citizens

----------------------
What it more or less feels like

[Destiny Island]

Then unless you're not an American (if that's the case, then feel free to ignore this post), you're at fault, too.

It's a lose-lose situation; you either vote from yet another selection of incompetent brats who know everything about getting elected but nothing about actually doing something useful with their positions, or you don't vote at all, providing less resistance against said incompetent brats as they scoop up gullible voters. And of course the media plays along, too, with excuses like "hurr durr turrurrusts" or "hurr durr urburmur's burth curturfurcurt" or "hurr durr surndy hurk" or "hurr durr urburturn urs murdur" or "hurr durr durth tur thur guyrs" or "hurr durr trurvurn murturn" or whatever other half-baked sensationalist crap they vomit out while shitting all over proper journalism for the sake of profit.

You're at fault. I'm at fault. Dorothy's little dog is at fault. Everyone's at fault.

but but ...but you have to believe...

Democrats

I really laughed hard when I saw this one

----------------------
Republicans

----------------------
American Citizens

----------------------
What it more or less feels like

Is that what republicans really think Obama is like? They clearly haven't seen a mirror in a loooooooong time.

[Ashmoria]

Then unless you're not an American (if that's the case, then feel free to ignore this post), you're at fault, too.

It's a lose-lose situation; you either vote from yet another selection of incompetent brats who know everything about getting elected but nothing about actually doing something useful with their positions, or you don't vote at all, providing less resistance against said incompetent brats as they scoop up gullible voters. And of course the media plays along, too, with excuses like "hurr durr turrurrusts" or "hurr durr urburmur's burth curturfurcurt" or "hurr durr surndy hurk" or "hurr durr urburturn urs murdur" or "hurr durr durth tur thur guyrs" or "hurr durr trurvurn murturn" or whatever other half-baked sensationalist crap they vomit out while shitting all over proper journalism for the sake of profit.

You're at fault. I'm at fault. Dorothy's little dog is at fault. Everyone's at fault.

but but ...but you have to believe...

Democrats

I really laughed hard when I saw this one

----------------------
Republicans

----------------------
American Citizens

----------------------
What it more or less feels like

I liked the "American citizens" one the best.