US Government Shutdown? Not any more!

[Nigerian Kenya]

It's Official. If the debt ceiling isn't raised in time, the united states will run out of extraordinary measures at 12:00:01 AM on October 18th, 2013 (The new debt ceiling 'X' date) . The Treasury will have about $30 Billion on hand then, plus revenue coming in, but no ability to borrow money. This is insufficient since daily bills can sometimes be as high as $60 Billion. We will be forced to either prioritize some bills above others, or literally default on some of our obligations to free up room below the debt ceiling.

So, what do we do? Well, if 2011 is any indication, working out a large agreement to reduce the budget deficit takes months, and we have less than 25 days to go. Here's a simple three step process to resolve this crisis without defaulting.

1. Keep the government running through the end of January, with ObamaCare in place. Ensure that until a deal is reached to avoid this, the remaining 9 years of sequester cuts are implemented.

2. Raise the debt ceiling to $17,300,000,000,000.00 , and attach it to construction of the Keystone Pipeline, but nothing else. Democrats will look bad if they oppose such a lenient condition for $600,578,904,326.40 of additional headroom, especially when we're so close to the X date, and it will pass.

3. Now that you've got some time, begin negotiating how to balance the budget by the end of fiscal 2030. Democrats have stated willingness to negotiate on the budget when we're not in a debt ceiling crisis - so negotiations will actually start. However, as a rule, raise the debt ceiling as little as possible above the 17.3 trillion level until a deal is reached for balancing the budget by the end of fiscal 2030.

Oh, almost forgot. Source for the new X date: http://www.treasury.gov/Documents/Debt% ... oehner.pdf

[Greed and Death]

And yet I heard some guy on talk radio this evening talking about how afraid Democrats are of Ted Cruz and how they want to silence him.

lol

I think hes gonna go nowhere. he is too much of a demagogue and too little of a team player.

He is most certainly not Presidential material.

[Greed and Death]

It is better than the alternative.

Consider the last time we had a government shut down, in 1995. All non-essential services were cut automatically.

and I would prefer this go on long enough that even essential services are cut.

[Divair]

It's Official. If the debt ceiling isn't raised in time, the united states will run out of extraordinary measures at 12:00:01 AM on October 18th, 2013 (The new debt ceiling 'X' date) . The Treasury will have about $30 Billion on hand then, plus revenue coming in, but no ability to borrow money. This is insufficient since daily bills can sometimes be as high as $60 Billion. We will be forced to either prioritize some bills above others, or literally default on some of our obligations to free up room below the debt ceiling.

So, what do we do? Well, if 2011 is any indication, working out a large agreement to reduce the budget deficit takes months, and we have less than 25 days to go. Here's a simple three step process to resolve this crisis without defaulting.

1. Keep the government running through the end of January, with ObamaCare in place. Ensure that until a deal is reached to avoid this, the remaining 9 years of sequester cuts are implemented.

2. Raise the debt ceiling to $17,300,000,000,000.00 , and attach it to construction of the Keystone Pipeline, but nothing else. Democrats will look bad if they oppose such a lenient condition for $600,578,904,326.40 of additional headroom, especially when we're so close to the X date, and it will pass.

3. Now that you've got some time, begin negotiating how to balance the budget by the end of fiscal 2030. Democrats have stated willingness to negotiate on the budget when we're not in a debt ceiling crisis - so negotiations will actually start. However, as a rule, raise the debt ceiling as little as possible above the 17.3 trillion level until a deal is reached for balancing the budget by the end of fiscal 2030.

Oh, almost forgot. Source for the new X date: http://www.treasury.gov/Documents/Debt% ... oehner.pdf

Yaaaay

[Starkiller101]

Might they will shutdown regardless of what they do

[Nigerian Kenya]

Consider the last time we had a government shut down, in 1995. All non-essential services were cut automatically.

and I would prefer this go on long enough that even essential services are cut.

Under any government shutdown, all essential services remain. Even if a shutdown goes on for a year or more, all essential services are still there, because they are part of mandatory spending - spending that is on autopilot until the end of time unless congress votes to amend it. The services that are cut or furloughed during a shutdown are all within discretionary spending - spending that must be re-approved each and every fiscal year.

[Greed and Death]

and I would prefer this go on long enough that even essential services are cut.

Under any government shutdown, all essential services remain. Even if a shutdown goes on for a year or more, all essential services are still there, because they are part of mandatory spending - spending that is on autopilot until the end of time unless congress votes to amend it. The services that are cut or furloughed during a shutdown are all within discretionary spending - spending that must be re-approved each and every fiscal year.

yeah lets vote to shut down tax collection and see how long that last.

[Nigerian Kenya]

Under any government shutdown, all essential services remain. Even if a shutdown goes on for a year or more, all essential services are still there, because they are part of mandatory spending - spending that is on autopilot until the end of time unless congress votes to amend it. The services that are cut or furloughed during a shutdown are all within discretionary spending - spending that must be re-approved each and every fiscal year.

yeah lets vote to shut down tax collection and see how long that last.

Tax Collection would slow down during a shutdown. It wouldn't stop though, since it's considered an essential service.

[Antheiopia]

It won't happen, they were panicking last year about a shutdown but nothing happened.

[Greed and Death]

yeah lets vote to shut down tax collection and see how long that last.

Tax Collection would slow down during a shutdown. It wouldn't stop though, since it's considered an essential service.

We need to change that mostly because I am curious what would happen.

[Phalnia]

It won't happen, they were panicking last year about a shutdown but nothing happened.

They seem to do it every year and they've actually shut down before.

[Greed and Death]

It won't happen, they were panicking last year about a shutdown but nothing happened.

They seem to do it every year and they've actually shut down before.

The Republicans will get 98% of what they want and everything will go to normal for 4 months.

[The Black Forrest]

Common sense:
Regulations, by their very definition, restrict freedom. An absence of regulation, by its very definition, leaves freedom be.

I don't want a convoluted argument that may or may not be right. This isn't ancient Greece. I require a higher standard of evidence than speculative arguments.

See the edit. Evidence of how this happens was provided.

Yes, regulations restrict freedom. And cost money to comply with, as I already said.

Absence of regulations, means the government will not be controlled by corporations.

Fun fact. One of the first taxes Obama raised as president was the tobacco tax. The move was widely supported by Altria.

Explain to me why a manufacturer would support an increase in their product, without any of the extra revenue going to them, but instead, the federal government?

You mean regulations like this?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/ ... rc=nl_tech

How is that a bad idea?

[The Black Forrest]

Tax Collection would slow down during a shutdown. It wouldn't stop though, since it's considered an essential service.

We need to change that mostly because I am curious what would happen.

I would be more interested in stopping congresses pay during a shutdown......

[Ashmoria]

It's Official. If the debt ceiling isn't raised in time, the united states will run out of extraordinary measures at 12:00:01 AM on October 18th, 2013 (The new debt ceiling 'X' date) . The Treasury will have about $30 Billion on hand then, plus revenue coming in, but no ability to borrow money. This is insufficient since daily bills can sometimes be as high as $60 Billion. We will be forced to either prioritize some bills above others, or literally default on some of our obligations to free up room below the debt ceiling.

do you suppose that 18 days is enough time for people to be able to log onto the exchanges and get rates for insurance, tell their family and friends about it and have that info spread throughout the general population enough for it to register that obamacare is just INSURANCE and that it saves people a ton of money?

its the only thing the republicans want to use the debt ceiling for.

[Sibirsky]

See the edit. Evidence of how this happens was provided.

Yes, regulations restrict freedom. And cost money to comply with, as I already said.

Absence of regulations, means the government will not be controlled by corporations.

Fun fact. One of the first taxes Obama raised as president was the tobacco tax. The move was widely supported by Altria.

Explain to me why a manufacturer would support an increase in their product, without any of the extra revenue going to them, but instead, the federal government?

Lol, no reply. But what do you expect from liberals when presented with evidence and logic that contradicts their ideology?

Exactly what happened. Most of the time.

[Sibirsky]

See the edit. Evidence of how this happens was provided.

Yes, regulations restrict freedom. And cost money to comply with, as I already said.

Absence of regulations, means the government will not be controlled by corporations.

Fun fact. One of the first taxes Obama raised as president was the tobacco tax. The move was widely supported by Altria.

Explain to me why a manufacturer would support an increase in their product, without any of the extra revenue going to them, but instead, the federal government?

You mean regulations like this?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/ ... rc=nl_tech

How is that a bad idea?

What gave you that idea? I linked to regulatory capture which includes some specific examples.

[Sibirsky]

It's Official. If the debt ceiling isn't raised in time, the united states will run out of extraordinary measures at 12:00:01 AM on October 18th, 2013 (The new debt ceiling 'X' date) . The Treasury will have about $30 Billion on hand then, plus revenue coming in, but no ability to borrow money. This is insufficient since daily bills can sometimes be as high as $60 Billion. We will be forced to either prioritize some bills above others, or literally default on some of our obligations to free up room below the debt ceiling.

The US government has more than $3 trillion in assets, including over $1 trillion in financial assets.

If for some reason, the debt ceiling was not raised, they could sell them off, to fund operations and spending.

But it will be raised.

[Death Metal]

And the Senate has voted down the AHCA defunding measure.

And guess how many yays it got?

Go on, guess. Say the number to yourself before opening the spoiler below.

If you guess ZERO yays? You were right. Even TED CRUZ voted nay.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/25/politics/ ... index.html

Some faith in humanity has been restored!

[Agritum]

And the Senate has voted down the AHCA defunding measure.

And guess how many yays it got?

Go on, guess. Say the number to yourself before opening the spoiler below.

If you guess ZERO yays? You were right. Even TED CRUZ voted nay.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/25/politics/ ... index.html

Some faith in humanity has been restored!

So nothing happened? Oh.

[The New World Oceania]

As if watching Congress isn't painful enough, reading the voices of extremists on the Internet is pure masochism.

[Divair]

And the Senate has voted down the AHCA defunding measure.

And guess how many yays it got?

Go on, guess. Say the number to yourself before opening the spoiler below.

If you guess ZERO yays? You were right. Even TED CRUZ voted nay.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/25/politics/ ... index.html

Some faith in humanity has been restored!

What the hell just happened. The Senate voted unanimously? That must be some kind of record.

[Death Metal]

And the Senate has voted down the AHCA defunding measure.

And guess how many yays it got?

Go on, guess. Say the number to yourself before opening the spoiler below.

If you guess ZERO yays? You were right. Even TED CRUZ voted nay.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/25/politics/ ... index.html

Some faith in humanity has been restored!

What the hell just happened. The Senate voted unanimously? That must be some kind of record.

Even the GOP is sick of the GOP's crap.

[Downeistan]

Since the debt ceiling and the shutdown are monetarily farcical anyway, just mint about 20 trillion dollar coins and tell the Republicans to sit on it and spin.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/11/opini ... azies.html

[Nigerian Kenya]

And the Senate has voted down the AHCA defunding measure.

And guess how many yays it got?

Go on, guess. Say the number to yourself before opening the spoiler below.

If you guess ZERO yays? You were right. Even TED CRUZ voted nay.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/25/politics/ ... index.html

Some faith in humanity has been restored!

What the hell just happened. The Senate voted unanimously? That must be some kind of record.

Well, that was a surprise. I was expecting it to be narrow approval of cloture, in the low to mid sixties, maybe high sixties if reid was lucky. But 100 votes? This is better than anyone in the world expected, and I applaud Senate Republicans, and Democrats who face tough reelection battles, for accepting ObamaCare as the law of the land.