1950s America: A Utopia?

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Of anytime.

Americans of the Northeast and the West Coast are centre to me. The others are all right-wing to far-right.

I seem to be an exception.

You have the values of the average Californian or West Coast resident?

[Scholencia]

Has anyone ever watched video clips from the 1950s, or listened to any sort of audio from the 1950s? Because when you do, you may notice that the accents sound quite different to the accents we* here today.

*I'm talking about Americans and Canadians mainly.

Did people in the 1950s actually sound different or is that just the "TV" or "Transatlantic" accent that we hear?

Either way, I think it's a cool accent.

Yes, accents are changing through time. Also, Pennsypvania was bilingual at that time.

[Libertarian California]

I seem to be an exception.

You have the values of the average Californian or West Coast resident?

You never mentioned average.

Also, the when it comes to political views, Californians are actually very varied. Most of the states interior is conservative, and its northern regions are similar to the Mountain states.

The whole state is not just San Francisco and Los Angeles.

[Tulmania]

1950's for my family was neither good nor bad. We are mostly agriculturally centered with focus on livestock. Up until the depression and dust bowl though my family was considered landed gentry in Texas. Afterwards we were and still are landed just not rich.

[Mushet]

I would have loved the 50's, back when a college degree actually had worth because relatively few people went to college or needed a degree for decent waged jobs.

And back then, someone would have a much easier time putting themselves through college.

Unless they weren't white or male, then they would have a tough time getting in in the first place.

[The Parkus Empire]

You have the values of the average Californian or West Coast resident?

You never mentioned average.

Also, the when it comes to political views, Californians are actually very varied. Most of the states interior is conservative, and its northern regions are similar to the Mountain states.

The whole state is not just San Francisco and Los Angeles.

Yeah, San Diego, the Inland Empire, Orange County, that's some fucking conservative territory. Straight competing with the Bible Belt.

[Grenartia]

One word: McCarthyism. *shudders*

1. McCarthyism was a great institution that focused on 2. vetting people who were traitors and spies in their own nation. It was a commendable effort and I am saddened to see that people today look back and see it just as bad as slavery.

1. Only if you think sham trials are a good thing.

2. Yet not a single person called to the HUAC (quite ironic, in that it itself was un-American) was found guilty. To say nothing of the fact that you could be called to the HUAC without ANY hard evidence of any crime, and could even be called up for being suspected or found to be a friend or relative of somebody previously called up to it. Complete disregard for the American justice system that needlessly ruined many people's lives. In short, it has the reputation it has because it DESERVES that reputation.

It was a real nice time, but no era has been 'utopian'. I like Ike, but he continued the New Deal and didn't cut the exorbitant taxation rates that FDR emplaced. As for greatest decades of the 20th Century, I'd rank it third behind the 1920s and the 1980s.

Ah, yes, two of the worst times for people who didn't win the coinflip to make them rich, white, heterosexual, cisgendered men.

The 20s sucked ass and the only good thing about the 1980s was the heavy metal and the AHNALD movies.

I'm pretty sure the 1950s had the greatest economic growth of any decade in American history.

I, as a socialist, like Ike. You know you're a good president when even as a capitalist, you get a socialist's seal of approval.

The 20s sucked ass...

No. It was an era of inventions, of consumerism, of prices falling, of a heavier tax burden being placed on the rich through fewer taxes... Although I assume you're hooked on the baseless 'under-consumption' thesis and the 'herpdercapitalismcausedtehgreatdepressionherpderp' theory that's popular with ill-informed socialists. I'd go more into this issue, but it's real late for and I'll post a thread about this sooner or later.

and the only good thing about the 1980s was the heavy metal and the AHNALD movies.

The cultural quality was excellent. I love everything 80s in that regard: fashion, movies, music, technology. The Reagan Revolution brought computers, mobile phones, more gadgets, etc. Consumerism, basically, that fuelled the Dot-Com Bubble and the Clinton Boom.

Fairly sure that shit would've happened without Reagan. Besides, there'd probably be vast increases in civil rights and social equality. Hell, we'd probably have excellent healthcare, the poor wouldn't be starving in the streets, there'd be full LGBT rights and equality, etc.

Utopic? Nah...

I could probably pass as the dominate social class though. Depends how much they accepted integrated Slavs.

As somebody having some form of an Eastern European/Russian accent, and without some sort of verification that you've defected or gotten some form of political asylum, you'd have probably been one of the first people to get called a Soviet infiltrator/spy.

Depending on how "Eastern", as in Soviet Bloc, your name is you'd probably be harassed. Maybe even firebombed by radical reactionaries.

I think that's taken out of proportion. Being firebombed for a last name, despite total integration, sounds a bit extreme.

If a church can get firebombed and 4 little girls killed, simply because of race, I don't think firebombing a house because of a last name is at all out of the question.

If you only emphasize unemployment. Combine the two and 1938 was the return year, with a minimal bust in 1939, a recovery in 1940, another bust during the war (42 I think) with a recovery that was hampered by mass unemployment after WWII (because, again, the skilled workforce were fighting the war, replacing more than a few jobs with women who weren't regularly part of the American workforce at the time, and there just wasn't enough jobs to go around).

Alright, I'll give you that. But my point was that FDR's regressive taxes and destructive programs exacerbated what could have been a short recession. It could've been over a helluva lot sooner.

Prove that load of bullshit.

Alright, I'll give you that. But my point was that FDR's regressive taxes and destructive programs exacerbated what could have been a short recession.

Hardly. It was because of the New Deal that it was over as early as it was. It's true most of the New Deal jobs were essentially welfare, but this gave Americans a paycheck, and with that paycheck came the means to consume products more readily than they were before. The real reason the Depression lasted as long as it did was because during the Hoover era, consumerism was so dismally low because the working class couldn't afford to be consumers. FDR reversed that trend.

This.

It was great so long as you were white, upper class, Christian, not a ebul commie, had "family values" and weren't homosexual it would've been great for you.

Otherwise life would probably suck for you.

In other words, if you were a Lesbian arabic anarcho-communist free-love muslim woman, you're screwed.

More or less. Doubly so if you were a transwoman.

In other words, if you were a Lesbian arabic anarchho-communist free-love muslim woman, you're screwed.

Pretty much.

Really the best thing about the 50s was that MacCarthay's trying too hard ended up neutering the HUAC as well.

Indeed.

[The Batorys]

So NSG, I got to do some of that dangerous late-night thinking, and I thought about what it would be like to live in the 1950s, a time portrayed as somewhat of a Golden Age in American history. The time of sock hops and pink carnations, the 1950s economically and somewhat socially a prosperous time for America, after victories over Nazism and Imperial Japan, emerging out of the Great Depression as a world superpower.

The 1950s are generally portrayed as peaceful, carefree, and wonderful time in the media, when most everyone lived by the same ethics and standards. I personally do not think of the 1950s America as a Utopia, going by exact definition, given the social policies of the US and the looming threat of a nuclear war, but I'm curious to see NSG's opinion.

So, what is it? A Utopia, or just a period of prosperity in American history?

Well, it was hardly utopian for women or for Americans who weren't white, or middle class, so no. Not even close to a utopia.

[Dakini]

Of course, you just said that they were helping the Allies and neglected that they were also hurting the Allies.

And? Their net contribution to the Allies was still positive.

And what the fuck is the relevance of that?

Considering that we started on this tangent because you acted like Canada (or the UK or France or the Allies who were in it before your country got off its collective ass) didn't matter, do you think the USSR is relevant here?

The relevance is that I was making a comparison to the Russians.


And are you really that dense? I thought that repeated use of 's would imply that I was joking when making comments about Canada and such.

Did you seriously get mad over what was obviously a sarcastic comment? You actually believe that I think the UK and Canada did not contribute?


Wow...

It might surprise you to learn this, but much like jokes about how women should make you a sandwich, jokes about how the US is the only country that matters aren't especially funny.

[Immoren]

It was only utopia with rosetinted glasses and in certain part of society.

[Arglorand]

Yeah, no, not even remotely.

Give me West Germany when Willy Brandt was around anyday.

[Bojikami]

lolnope

[Avaerilon]

Not if you were black, liberal, a native American... the list is quite long. But, from the point of view of fairly average (white) Americans who could afford most things, times were good, I suppose.

[Rurmastadt]

No more than any other time. The rose tinted glasses of history tend to make older times seem far better than they were, remembering the good parts and forgetting the bad. Besides, in most parts of the globe the modern world is infinitely superior to any past era in just about every way.

[Neo-Mlytoria]

"A utopia /juːˈtoʊpiə/ is a community or society possessing highly desirable or perfect qualities."

Everything's highly desirable/perfect for someone. Freaking Syria is a utopia in some eyes.

[Grenartia]

"A utopia /juːˈtoʊpiə/ is a community or society possessing highly desirable or perfect qualities."

Everything's highly desirable/perfect for someone. Freaking Syria is a utopia in some eyes.

Despite all logic and reason, indeed.

[Pacifornia]

"A utopia /juːˈtoʊpiə/ is a community or society possessing highly desirable or perfect qualities."

Everything's highly desirable/perfect for someone. Freaking Syria is a utopia in some eyes.

The 90s were a utopia for me. Others may beg to differ.

[New Chalcedon]

So NSG, I got to do some of that dangerous late-night thinking, and I thought about what it would be like to live in the 1950s, a time portrayed as somewhat of a Golden Age in American history. The time of sock hops and pink carnations, the 1950s economically and somewhat socially a prosperous time for America, after victories over Nazism and Imperial Japan, emerging out of the Great Depression as a world superpower.

The 1950s are generally portrayed as peaceful, carefree, and wonderful time in the media, when most everyone lived by the same ethics and standards. I personally do not think of the 1950s America as a Utopia, going by exact definition, given the social policies of the US and the looming threat of a nuclear war, but I'm curious to see NSG's opinion.

So, what is it? A Utopia, or just a period of prosperity in American history?

Looking back at the 1950s, here's what stands out to my Gen Y ass:

(1) Hope. The 1950s were an era of hope, something that's vanishingly rare in mainstream culture today. Most of the people then acknowledged that their society wasn't perfect (although they different on what its flaws were), but they all expected that it would be better tomorrow.

(2) Short-sightedness. The 1950s were, in fact, pretty near - as long as you were white, cisgendered and either male or female and willing to accept traditional gender roles. In most regards, nonwhites were discriminated heavily against, same-sex sexual activity was a crime and women who entered the workforce were rare (although not unheard of, unlike previous eras - Rosie the Riveter dealt a terminal blow to the idea that women should only be in the home - after all, if women could work in "male" jobs during wartime, why not afterwards?). What's more, very few of the "privileged" (to be fair, the category for "privilege" was broader than in any previous time) were even aware of the injustices routinely endured by the non-privileged.

(3) Mobility. Specifically, economic mobility. In the 1950s, having rich parents gave you an advantage in life - but it wasn't the single biggest factor that would determine your lifetime socio-economic status. Unlike, say, today.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

"A utopia /juːˈtoʊpiə/ is a community or society possessing highly desirable or perfect qualities."

Everything's highly desirable/perfect for someone. Freaking Syria is a utopia in some eyes.

The 90s were a utopia for me. Others may beg to differ.

Being a child or teen in the nineties was probably awesome.

A toddler was meh and a sexual minority adult would probably be horrible, though.

[Arglorand]

The 90s were a utopia for me. Others may beg to differ.

Being a child or teen in the nineties was probably awesome.

A toddler was meh and a sexual minority adult would probably be horrible, though.

I loved the 90s as a toddler, tbh.

[Nevanmaa]

Economic policies practiced in the 1950s were awful, the top 1% tax bracket was somewhere around 90% and the regulation was just awful. FDR's legacy on entitlement still hovered over America like a poisonous cloud as well.

Society-wise, I see the 1950s as an ideal time. Values like family, tradition and anti-communism were respected, and those are the values that we need now more than ever to combat the degeneracy of the 21st century society. If only there was a way to restore 1950s cultural values..

In my ideal society, the cultural values would be from the 50s and economic policies would be from the 80s.

[Bloco De Esquerda]

Economic policies practiced in the 1950s were awful, the top 1% tax bracket was somewhere around 90% and the regulation was just awful. FDR's legacy on entitlement still hovered over America like a poisonous cloud as well.

Society-wise, I see the 1950s as an ideal time. Values like family, tradition and anti-communism were respected, and those are the values that we need now more than ever to combat the degeneracy of the 21st century society. If only there was a way to restore 1950s cultural values..

In my ideal society, the cultural values would be from the 50s and economic policies would be from the 80s.

Thank good those policies won't be applied at the same time .

You must be some White Heterosexual and middle - class or higher because those times the ones who weren't whites or middle class had a bad life .

If you are ok with racism that's up to you .

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Being a child or teen in the nineties was probably awesome.

A toddler was meh and a sexual minority adult would probably be horrible, though.

I loved the 90s as a toddler, tbh.

TV was good, toys too, using a PC too, Niterói was as beautiful and much more peaceful, but there were too many things happening in my life I couldn't comprehend, including directly personal problems I was too young to appropriately deal with.

Also autism, meaning socializing with other children for me was some complete disaster.

[Trotskylvania]

ITT: Nostalgia for an age that never existed

Let me put it to you this way: for all this talk of greater economic opportunities, the real truth was that there were more major strikes involving more people in the 1950s than in any other decade. I'd hardly call this evidence of people who were happy with their economic station, or a system that afforded opportunities. At best, even a white heterosexual male had to fight tooth and nail for those opportunities.

[Nazis in Space]

• 1950s Elvis
• 2010s Bieber