Side effects may include...Gun violence?!

[West Florida]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/ ... BW20110215

Cool story, Mayo clinic. You know what else modulates serotonin? MDMA. People who take MDMA recreationally may die from any number of circumstances - least among them rubbing up on fuzzy surfaces while dancing to dubstep. Never mind that norepinephrine and dopamine are all changed by MDMA. Temporary changes or perhaps "imbalances" too much or too little, of these hormones didn't cause me or my friends to become mentally ill.

[Wikkiwallana]

Could you at least try to read what's been said? Might make you look less stupid.

Or you could realize I am in no way attempting to look serious.

I did. You still got it wrong, and in an incredibly offensive manner.

[West Florida]

Can we just settle on the fact that while the decision should be made on a case by case basis as no two mental patients are the same (being people and all) there is still probable cause to at the very least put effort into trying to make that judgment in the first place?

I don't disagree with this. But certain disorders when mixed with certain drugs are more influential at making patients prone to violence or suicide.

Ever seen a warning label on a psychotropic drug?

[Distruzio]

He is mistaking correlation for causation.

While its true that many of the acts of gun violence brought to national attention were perpetuated by those afflicted with mental illnesses, the treatment did not lead to the violence. Or, at least, the exceptions dont prove the rule. Millions are helped by psychiatric drugs (myself included. My depression, ptsd, and bipolar 2 resulted in violent thouvhts indeed, however, the drugs ameliorated my thoughts to such an extent that they were reduced to mere thoughts towards violence directed at myself). Those individuals brought to national attention were caught in a cycle that drugs and otger treatments were unable to correct or dispel.

Hes also convinced that immunization leads to nonsense.

[Wikkiwallana]

Can we just settle on the fact that while the decision should be made on a case by case basis as no two mental patients are the same (being people and all) there is still probable cause to at the very least put effort into trying to make that judgment in the first place?

I don't disagree with this. But certain disorders when mixed with certain drugs are more influential at making patients prone to violence or suicide.

Ever seen a warning label on a psychotropic drug?

"Psychotropic" is a huge category, and heavily loaded. It's like saying "painkiller", talking about how dangerous they are, and glossing over the fact that the label covers everything from aspirin to heroin.

[Lordieth]

He is mistaking correlation for causation.

While its true that many of the acts of gun violence brought to national attention were perpetuated by those afflicted with mental illnesses, the treatment did not lead to the violence. Or, at least, the exceptions dont prove the rule. Millions are helped by psychiatric drugs (myself included. My depression, ptsd, and bipolar 2 resulted in violent thouvhts indeed, however, the drugs ameliorated my thoughts to such an extent that they were reduced to mere thoughts towards violence directed at myself). Those individuals brought to national attention were caught in a cycle that drugs and otger treatments were unable to correct or dispel.

Hes also convinced that immunization leads to nonsense.

I made the correlation/causation point, but people want to see conspiracy theories everywhere, and it's all too easy to stigmatise the mentally ill and imagine crazy people out of their minds on crazy pills axing people down in the streets, while foaming at the mouth.

[Individuality-ness]

You know that a thread has gone wrong when you cite NaturalNews, Free Republic, and InfoWars as a source without irony.

Anti-psycharitry and anti-science much?

[Purpelia]

Can we just settle on the fact that while the decision should be made on a case by case basis as no two mental patients are the same (being people and all) there is still probable cause to at the very least put effort into trying to make that judgment in the first place?

I don't disagree with this. But certain disorders when mixed with certain drugs are more influential at making patients prone to violence or suicide.

Ever seen a warning label on a psychotropic drug?

Yes, and no. In that order. That is why I think that just having a certain mix of disorder + drug is not enough to warrant action, but enough to warrant investigation. And this investigation might in turn end with action if the patients particular condition, personality and history warrant it. After all there will always be that 1% of people for whom the underlying problems that lead to needing medication in the first place should disqualify them anyway. And this is the best way to find them.

[Ifreann]

As long as we don't even consider the laws around guns. Anything else. Talking about guns is the first step towards Obama coming to take them all.

I am not sure what you mean by that. Seriously I am not.

That this story and stories like them are a deliberate attempt to distract from and prevent any national dialogue about guns generally in the US.

---

You know that a thread has gone wrong when you cite NaturalNews, Free Republic, and InfoWars as a source without irony.

Anti-psycharitry and anti-science much?

Lab coats cause violence *nods*

[Occupied Deutschland]

I am not sure what you mean by that. Seriously I am not.

That this story and stories like them are a deliberate attempt to distract from and prevent any national dialogue about guns generally in the US.

...We've had this discussion. In fact, we're STILL having it. All the goddamned time whenever there's any semi-dramatic case of a gun being used irresponsibly.

Perhaps we should also try to address other issues which may be connected to the violence in society? Since, y'know, guns aren't really a primary cause of violence in society.

[Individuality-ness]

You know that a thread has gone wrong when you cite NaturalNews, Free Republic, and InfoWars as a source without irony.

Anti-psycharitry and anti-science much?

Lab coats cause violence *nods*

Safety glasses are hypnotic devices. *nod*

[Occupied Deutschland]

Lab coats cause violence *nods*

Safety glasses are hypnotic devices. *nod*

Experimentation is theft?
Bottle for President 2017?
Am I doing it right?

[Ifreann]

That this story and stories like them are a deliberate attempt to distract from and prevent any national dialogue about guns generally in the US.

...We've had this discussion. In fact, we're STILL having it. All the goddamned time whenever there's any semi-dramatic case of a gun being used irresponsibly.

Did I say it was working?

[Nailed to the Perch]

Those are some super stupid scare-quotes right there. Contrary to what wacky conspiracy theorists have to say on the subject, mental illnesses are not actually caused by magical space-demons and/or fluoride in the water supply, but rather by the exact same sorts of things that cause illnesses in other parts of the body. Treating depression with SSRIs should be exactly as controversial as treating diabetes with insulin injections - and they are both about equally likely to cause people to be violent, which is to say, not likely at all.

Barring anyone being treated for any mental illness from owning a gun is inane, since the vast majority of mental illnesses do not cause people to be violent. All that will do is discourage mentally ill gun owners from seeking treatment, which is an awful goal, to say the least. It makes vastly more sense to bar people who have an actual history of violent behavior, or a doctor's determination that they present a danger to themselves or others, rather than deciding that anyone who takes a freaking antidepressant is somehow a terrible risk to society.

It's becoming more and more evident that disorders are invented so that big-pharma can make a fortune.

Other things that are becoming "more and more evident":

- Aliens built the Egyptian pyramids.
- The Illuminati control the world.
- The moon landings were staged.
- You have no idea what you're talking about.

(And one of those things is even true!)

[Distruzio]

He is mistaking correlation for causation.

While its true that many of the acts of gun violence brought to national attention were perpetuated by those afflicted with mental illnesses, the treatment did not lead to the violence. Or, at least, the exceptions dont prove the rule. Millions are helped by psychiatric drugs (myself included. My depression, ptsd, and bipolar 2 resulted in violent thouvhts indeed, however, the drugs ameliorated my thoughts to such an extent that they were reduced to mere thoughts towards violence directed at myself). Those individuals brought to national attention were caught in a cycle that drugs and otger treatments were unable to correct or dispel.

Hes also convinced that immunization leads to nonsense.

I made the correlation/causation point, but people want to see conspiracy theories everywhere, and it's all too easy to stigmatise the mentally ill and imagine crazy people out of their minds on crazy pills axing people down in the streets, while foaming at the mouth.

Indeed. Hell, my antidepressant is the same one used by one of the columbine shpoters. Im on a higher dose as well. No desire to hurt anyone here.... Well, not any longer.

[Occupied Deutschland]

...We've had this discussion. In fact, we're STILL having it. All the goddamned time whenever there's any semi-dramatic case of a gun being used irresponsibly.

Did I say it was working?

Strangely enough, people are capable of addressing more than one issue at a time. We can talk about guns while talking about the war on drugs.
In fact, we can talk about guns, and the war on drugs, and the situation in Syria.
In fact, we can talk about guns, the war on drugs, the situation in Syria, and the status of privacy in relation to US government agencies.
In fact, we can talk about all those things, and many other things, at the same time.

[Ifreann]

Did I say it was working?

Strangely enough, people are capable of addressing more than one issue at a time. We can talk about guns while talking about the war on drugs.
In fact, we can talk about guns, and the war on drugs, and the situation in Syria.
In fact, we can talk about guns, the war on drugs, the situation in Syria, and the status of privacy in relation to US government agencies.
In fact, we can talk about all those things, and many other things, at the same time.

Lovely. Not really anything to do with what I said, but lovely none the less.

[West Florida]

He is mistaking correlation for causation.

While its true that many of the acts of gun violence brought to national attention were perpetuated by those afflicted with mental illnesses, the treatment did not lead to the violence. Or, at least, the exceptions dont prove the rule. Millions are helped by psychiatric drugs (myself included. My depression, ptsd, and bipolar 2 resulted in violent thouvhts indeed, however, the drugs ameliorated my thoughts to such an extent that they were reduced to mere thoughts towards violence directed at myself). Those individuals brought to national attention were caught in a cycle that drugs and otger treatments were unable to correct or dispel.

Hes also convinced that immunization leads to nonsense.

I made the correlation/causation point, but people want to see conspiracy theories everywhere, and it's all too easy to stigmatise the mentally ill and imagine crazy people out of their minds on crazy pills axing people down in the streets, while foaming at the mouth.

Logical fallacy aside, and the fact that I'm advocating for better treatment of the mentally ill, what are we supposed to do? The status quo is ok? And psychiatry is curing people left and right apparently? Or at the very least treating them effectively? Ask the loved ones whose families have been victimized. Or are you going to ignore them like the GOP did when the Sandy Hook families visit Capitol Hill?

These two big problems - lax gun laws and a fundamental misunderstanding of the brain in medicine/science - are contributing to a culture which is far less and below the potential for humans.

[West Florida]

(And one of those things is even true!)

Speaking of the truth...
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/MindMoodNe ... d=15909673

This is what I mean. So half of us are mentally ill by the DSM standards? Probably 2% of the population has an ailment which would distort their reality enough to bar them from being able to make sense of right and wrong. A pretty viable litmus test as to whether you can operate a gun safely.

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_an ... ation.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/07/healt ... d=all&_r=0

This is the mental health standard we have to put up with? No wonder the US has a mass shooting every 90 days.

[Blasveck]

Honestly people.

Why do we blame these attacks on guns being (easily to moderately) available to the public?

Why don't we focus on the things that cause people to become violent or resort to violence, instead of restricting guns?

Helping the mentally ill, instead of demonizing them.
Working to fight poverty and crime.
Giving people more options than just resorting to violence.

But that's just my opinion on the matter.

[Ethel mermania]

Correlation does not imply causation. SSRIs are given to people with clinical depression.

I was on SSRIs for over a year, and they do not make you violent.

if they work they dont, but drugs like welbutrin, and tha atypical antipsychotixs can make the problems much worse and lead to violence and suicide. attempting to fix brain chemistry brings relief to many, it brings great pain to a few.

[Risottia]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3068090/posts?page=76



Headlines like this too are really a let down to journalism. Was Lee Harvey Oswald or John Wilkes Booth, both well known assassins, linked to their respective faiths? How about Timothy McVeigh?

NOPE! Only when the religion isn't some derivative of Christianity does the media find it fit to mention faith. How convenient. And objective too

Damn those Buddhists assassins. You never hear them Om'ing.

Beware of om'ing missiles and of in'om'ing fire, btw.

[Risottia]

Honestly people.

Why do we blame these attacks on guns being (easily to moderately) available to the public?

Why don't we focus on the things that cause people to become violent or resort to violence, instead of restricting guns?

Helping the mentally ill, instead of demonizing them.
Working to fight poverty and crime.
Giving people more options than just resorting to violence.

But that's just my opinion on the matter.

A good idea to help people could be preventing the mentally ill from operating guns or other dangerous tools.
But of course that's oppressive, I guess.

[Lordieth]

Damn those Buddhists assassins. You never hear them Om'ing.

Beware of om'ing missiles and of in'om'ing fire, btw.

And the improvised 'oms.

[Distruzio]

I made the correlation/causation point, but people want to see conspiracy theories everywhere, and it's all too easy to stigmatise the mentally ill and imagine crazy people out of their minds on crazy pills axing people down in the streets, while foaming at the mouth.

Logical fallacy aside, and the fact that I'm advocating for better treatment of the mentally ill, what are we supposed to do? The status quo is ok? And psychiatry is curing people left and right apparently? Or at the very least treating them effectively? Ask the loved ones whose families have been victimized. Or are you going to ignore them like the GOP did when the Sandy Hook families visit Capitol Hill?

These two big problems - lax gun laws and a fundamental misunderstanding of the brain in medicine/science - are contributing to a culture which is far less and below the potential for humans.

Nonsense. Gun control is not lax but very effective. Criminals have a tendency, bare with me here, to violate laws. Restricting.legal ownership does nothing to address criminality.