23% of men in parts of Asia admit to rape

[Aurora Novus]

And? When someone says no, you say "Alright." and go to sleep, or go home, or whatever works.

Hardly. You have a poor grasp of reality if you think initial responses should always just be accepted. As if people never, upon thinking a second time, change their minds. As if it's somehow a crime or wrong to ask again.


There is no harm in asking again, to be certain that is what someone desires. It is childish and servile to think otherwise.

EDIT: Not to mention, regardless of your views of asking again, it still doesn't make it rape.

[New England and The Maritimes]

And? When someone says no, you say "Alright." and go to sleep, or go home, or whatever works.

Hardly. You have a poor grasp of reality if you think initial responses should always just be accepted. As if people never, upon thinking a second time, change their minds. As if it's somehow a crime or wrong to ask again.


There is no harm in asking again, to be certain that is what someone desires. It is childish and servile. to think otherwise.

You're creepy as fuck. If someone tells you "No, I do not want to have sex with you" they have made their decision and you're a fucking weirdo for thinking otherwise. Seriously, is this how people really think?

[Ifreann]

"Have you ever had sex with your partner when you knew she didn't want to but you thought she should agree because she's your wife/ partner?"

If these are the kinds of questions they are asking, I'm skeptical of the results. After all, by this question, a man who's wife initially says no, but then changes her mind after he asks again, has just been raped.

The question says no such thing.

[Aurora Novus]

You're creepy as fuck.

There's that nonsense term I know you people love to throw about.

If someone tells you "No, I do not want to have sex with you" they have made their decision and you're a fucking weirdo for thinking otherwise. Seriously, is this how people really think?

Hardly. First of all, you're completely ignoring a whole facet of communication that involves playing coy or giving responses that one does not actually mean, in the hopes that someone will ask again and try to lull them into something. Whether or not you wish to accept it, that is a real behavioral act by some people. They want someone to try and convince them to say yes, so they say no initially. This doesn't just apply to sex. It can be anything. I've done it in the past myself.

Secondly, you're also ignoring the fact that people often don't have their minds made up when they give their initial response. People very often will give an initial response, but then think about things for a moment, and declare something different from what their initial statement was. Happens all the time.

Finally, you're acting as if trying to change someone's mind is a bad thing. Which is a ridiculously servile notion.

[Saveyou Island]

"Have you ever had sex with your partner when you knew she didn't want to but you thought she should agree because she's your wife/ partner?"

If these are the kinds of questions they are asking, I'm skeptical of the results. After all, by this question, a man who's wife initially says no, but then changes her mind after he asks again, has just been raped.

I have a feeling this questionnaire was biased in the way it asked it's questions. Which isn't uncommon for rape surveys unfortunately.

The question says "Did you have sex with her, even when she rejected?"
Not "When you asked ,Did your wife say no but then change her mind?"

[The Parkus Empire]

"Have you ever had sex with your partner when you knew she didn't want to but you thought she should agree because she's your wife/ partner?"

If these are the kinds of questions they are asking, I'm skeptical of the results. After all, by this question, a man who's wife initially says no, but then changes her mind after he asks again, has just been raped.

I have a feeling this questionnaire was biased in the way it asked it's questions. Which isn't uncommon for rape surveys unfortunately.

It didn't ask if she changed her mind, it said she DID NOT WANT TO but YOU thought she should and so had sex with her anyway.

[Aurora Novus]

"Have you ever had sex with your partner when you knew she didn't want to but you thought she should agree because she's your wife/ partner?"

If these are the kinds of questions they are asking, I'm skeptical of the results. After all, by this question, a man who's wife initially says no, but then changes her mind after he asks again, has just been raped.

I have a feeling this questionnaire was biased in the way it asked it's questions. Which isn't uncommon for rape surveys unfortunately.

The question says "Did you have sex with her, even when she rejected?"

Not quite. It says "did you have sex with her, when you knew she didn't want to". Someone who may not want to have sex, but is willing to have sex for the benefit of the other partner, out of love, a deal, ect., fits this category. That's not rape.

[Aurora Novus]

"Have you ever had sex with your partner when you knew she didn't want to but you thought she should agree because she's your wife/ partner?"

If these are the kinds of questions they are asking, I'm skeptical of the results. After all, by this question, a man who's wife initially says no, but then changes her mind after he asks again, has just been raped.

I have a feeling this questionnaire was biased in the way it asked it's questions. Which isn't uncommon for rape surveys unfortunately.

It didn't ask if she changed her mind, it said she DID NOT WANT TO but YOU thought she should and so had sex with her anyway.

"Did not want to" does not mean "did not consent".

[Saveyou Island]

The question says "Did you have sex with her, even when she rejected?"

Not quite. It says "did you have sex with her, when you knew she didn't want to". Someone who may not want to have sex, but is willing to have sex for the benefit of the other partner, out of love, a deal, ect., fits this category. That's not rape.

No.
The question says "DID YOU HAVE SEX WITH HER AGAINST HER OWN WILL?"
If she is willing to have sex she GIVES HER CONSENT!

[The Parkus Empire]

It didn't ask if she changed her mind, it said she DID NOT WANT TO but YOU thought she should and so had sex with her anyway.

"Did not want to" does not mean "did not consent".

What does equal "did not consent" exactly?

[Saveyou Island]

"Did not want to" does not mean "did not consent".

What does equal "did not consent" exactly?

I'm wondering the same thing here.

[The Rich Port]

Oh... God... I... Jeez...

... I feel dirty.

[Aurora Novus]

Not quite. It says "did you have sex with her, when you knew she didn't want to". Someone who may not want to have sex, but is willing to have sex for the benefit of the other partner, out of love, a deal, ect., fits this category. That's not rape.

No.
The question says "DID YOU HAVE SEX WITH HER AGAINST HER OWN WILL?"

No, that's not what it asked. It asked, word for word, what I just typed. I literally used copy/paste.

"Didn't want to" does not mean "did not consent".

[Greater Vayland]

F***ing hell. Although I'm disinclined to generalize, could it be because a large chunk of the developing third world is there? (crappy education or complete lack thereof, etc. etc. etc.)

[Saveyou Island]

F***ing hell. Although I'm disinclined to generalize, could it be because a large chunk of the developing third world is there? (crappy education or complete lack thereof, etc. etc. etc.)

Y'know, not all of foreign countries are a wasteland.

[Aurora Novus]

"Did not want to" does not mean "did not consent".

What does equal "did not consent" exactly?

Someone can "not want" to do something, but still do it for the enjoyment of someone else.

As an example, I may "not want" to go shopping with my spouse, but that doesn't mean I did not consent to go shopping with her if I choose to willingly and informedly go with her to the mall for that purpose, because I knew it would make her happy to have me along. I may not "like" shopping, but that doesn't mean she's kidnapped me or holding me hostage.

[The Parkus Empire]

What does equal "did not consent" exactly?

Someone can "not want" to do something, but still do it for the enjoyment of someone else.

As an example, I may "not want" to go shopping with my spouse, but that doesn't mean I did not consent to go shopping with her if I choose to willingly and informedly go with her to the mall for that purpose, because I knew it would make her happy to have me along. I may not "like" shopping, but that doesn't mean she's kidnapped me or holding me hostage.

So you're not going to answer my question.

[Saveyou Island]

No.
The question says "DID YOU HAVE SEX WITH HER AGAINST HER OWN WILL?"

No, that's not what it asked. It asked, word for word, what I just typed. I literally used copy/paste.

"Didn't want to" does not mean "did not consent".

What's your point?
Did not consent= She was against having sexual intercourse with you, at that time, and doing so would be considered rape. Just like if it was a random person.

[Saveyou Island]

What does equal "did not consent" exactly?

Someone can "not want" to do something, but still do it for the enjoyment of someone else.
.

Then they're allowing them to do so, which means giving consent.

[Aurora Novus]

:oops:

Someone can "not want" to do something, but still do it for the enjoyment of someone else.

As an example, I may "not want" to go shopping with my spouse, but that doesn't mean I did not consent to go shopping with her if I choose to willingly and informedly go with her to the mall for that purpose, because I knew it would make her happy to have me along. I may not "like" shopping, but that doesn't mean she's kidnapped me or holding me hostage.

So you're not going to answer my question.

...I just answered it. Literally in the post you just quoted. Unless I'm missing something, you're asking me to justify my distinction between "wanting/liking" something, and "consenting" to something. Well...there it is. Right there. You just quoted it.

[Mizrah]

Different peoples have different cultures have different views. It is what it is.

[Saveyou Island]

Different peoples have different cultures have different views. It is what it is.

So, are you saying rape is fucking acceptable in other cultures?
What... Please tell me I misunderstood that...

[Aurora Novus]

Someone can "not want" to do something, but still do it for the enjoyment of someone else.
.

Then they're allowing them to do so, which means giving consent.

...Exactly. That's my point.

But by the wording of the question, according to the survey, this factors into their percentage of men who have "raped" someone. Hence my complaint and distrust of the results. My point is the survey tried to equate "lack of desire" to "lack of consent". Which is false.

[The Parkus Empire]

:oops:
So you're not going to answer my question.

...I just answered it. Literally in the post you just quoted. Unless I'm missing something, you're asking me to justify my distinction between "wanting/liking" something, and "consenting" to something. Well...there it is. Right there. You just quoted it.

No, you did not. You said what you think giving consent is, but you did not illustrate what you think not giving consent is.

[Des-Bal]

I suspect this is an issue for self proclaimed feminists to address after they've finally defeated the benign rape joke.