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Transgender-ism and Pronouns

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Should we call transgender persons 'it'

Yes
36
24%
No
106
71%
Not sure
8
5%
 
Total votes : 150

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Phocidaea
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Postby Phocidaea » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:12 pm

Soldati senza confini wrote:
Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:Who cares, in the global language of the time it will be décimo quinto.


VIGESIMO quinto.

Sweet Jesus.

No sabe hablar español y tampoco sé.

Spanish is an annoying language :P
Call me Phoca.
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Euroslavia
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Postby Euroslavia » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:12 pm

Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:Yeah, right. Cultural marxists and self-hating anti-white Western liberals had nothing to do with it. Nooo sir.

If gender identity disorder isn't a disorder, then pedophilia isn't either.

Anti-white?

Go fuck yourself with a 30cm dildo, dude, seriously.

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Knock it off. Responding in this manner does nothing to help the situation either.
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Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro
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Postby Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:13 pm

Phocidaea wrote:
Soldati senza confini wrote:
VIGESIMO quinto.

Sweet Jesus.

No sabe hablar español y tampoco sé.

Spanish is an annoying language :P

Isso é português/italiano, seu cabeça-de-vento n00b. :lol:
Aequalitia's bromancey mancrush.
Test: Seemingly, libertarian communism was renamed "social democracy"
Compass: economic left -9.85, social libertarian -8.97
Socio-Economic Ideology: Democratic Socialist (92% ditto/Marxist, 75% Anarchist/Social democrat, 0% etc)

Born 12/94. Weird in all senses starting at 07/2000. NSG's resident euro-carioca bara-fudanshi useless lazy perv. Agnostic atheist (not anti-religious), bi-affective homosexual/demiheterosexual (and bi-curious i.e. chronologically 95% bisexual-ish but 5% true bi), slightly more masculine of both tad neutral and tad ambiguous gender (human-/oneself-identified genderqueer; he, xe or ou, your preference), naturist, "worker" class, mildly hipster/japanophile, etc.

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Conscentia
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Postby Conscentia » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:14 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:Hippo, riddle me this. You accept gays, right? Well, why? Cultural marxism is what made them acceptable. You accept women, right? Why? Cultural marxism is what gave them the right to vote. You accept black people, right? Why? Cultural marxism gave them freedom. You accept anyone who isn't a while, land owning male, right? Why? YOU ARE A CULTURAL MARXIST, YOU LEFTIST PIG.

Because homosexuality doesn't harm anyone, two people in a stable family are perfectly capable of raising a child. Women can make just as intelligent decisions as men can, same with blacks. Homosexuals, women and blacks are perfectly capable of participating in various areas of the society while respecting its traditions and foundations.

This is where transsexuals come in. Unlike women, blacks and homosexuals, transsexuals cannot exist as long as traditional male/divide is in place and as such they are forced to deconstruct it, which I oppose. Homosexuals, women and blacks can act within the boundaries of male/female divide. Transsexuals cannot.

This is why I support gay rights, but not transsexual rights.

Why is this "male/female divide" so important to you?

Feminine males & masculine females are perfectly capable of participating in various areas of the society while respecting its traditions and foundations.
Last edited by Conscentia on Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Nevanmaa
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Postby Nevanmaa » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:14 pm

Condunum wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:Because homosexuality doesn't harm anyone, two people in a stable family are perfectly capable of raising a child. Women can make just as intelligent decisions as men can, same with blacks. Homosexuals, women and blacks are perfectly capable of participating in various areas of the society while respecting its traditions and foundations.

This is where transsexuals come in. Unlike women, blacks and homosexuals, transsexuals cannot exist as long as traditional male/divide is in place and as such they are forced to deconstruct it, which I oppose. Homosexuals, women and blacks can act within the boundaries of male/female divide. Transsexuals cannot.

This is why I support gay rights, but not transsexual rights.

How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?
Call me Hippo
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:14 pm

Condunum wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:Because homosexuality doesn't harm anyone, two people in a stable family are perfectly capable of raising a child. Women can make just as intelligent decisions as men can, same with blacks. Homosexuals, women and blacks are perfectly capable of participating in various areas of the society while respecting its traditions and foundations.

This is where transsexuals come in. Unlike women, blacks and homosexuals, transsexuals cannot exist as long as traditional male/divide is in place and as such they are forced to deconstruct it, which I oppose. Homosexuals, women and blacks can act within the boundaries of male/female divide. Transsexuals cannot.

This is why I support gay rights, but not transsexual rights.

How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

They're having an opinion that Hippo doesn't hold. How could that be anything other than a blatant attack on the very foundations of Western society?
He/Him

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Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro
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Postby Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:15 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?

Hmmm, wonder why race would be so important.

And I thought we started to try to destroy this concept since at least the early 19th century...
Aequalitia's bromancey mancrush.
Test: Seemingly, libertarian communism was renamed "social democracy"
Compass: economic left -9.85, social libertarian -8.97
Socio-Economic Ideology: Democratic Socialist (92% ditto/Marxist, 75% Anarchist/Social democrat, 0% etc)

Born 12/94. Weird in all senses starting at 07/2000. NSG's resident euro-carioca bara-fudanshi useless lazy perv. Agnostic atheist (not anti-religious), bi-affective homosexual/demiheterosexual (and bi-curious i.e. chronologically 95% bisexual-ish but 5% true bi), slightly more masculine of both tad neutral and tad ambiguous gender (human-/oneself-identified genderqueer; he, xe or ou, your preference), naturist, "worker" class, mildly hipster/japanophile, etc.

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Condunum
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Postby Condunum » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:15 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?

Don't use a slippery slope. I want you to tell me how it is bad that they are slightly altering societal norms.

I'm going to give you a really big tip here. You can accept trasngender people without having to change a single other aspect of your life. It is that simple. You change a fucking word, hippo. You aren't being asked to build a billion needle towers. You aren't being asked to completely reconstruct your government. You're being asked to be a decent fucking human being. If you can't do that, then I'm sorry, you're worse for human society than a trans* folk ever could be.
Last edited by Condunum on Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Soldati Senza Confini
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:16 pm

Condunum wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:Because homosexuality doesn't harm anyone, two people in a stable family are perfectly capable of raising a child. Women can make just as intelligent decisions as men can, same with blacks. Homosexuals, women and blacks are perfectly capable of participating in various areas of the society while respecting its traditions and foundations.

This is where transsexuals come in. Unlike women, blacks and homosexuals, transsexuals cannot exist as long as traditional male/divide is in place and as such they are forced to deconstruct it, which I oppose. Homosexuals, women and blacks can act within the boundaries of male/female divide. Transsexuals cannot.

This is why I support gay rights, but not transsexual rights.

How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.


It doesn't really do anything to the fabric of nature or society in the big picture.

Honestly, look at homosexuals. They act as one being female and another being male, there is nothing wrong about that.

In nature and in society, men and women have distinct boundaries on the feminine/masculine divide, even if they are transexual, they are acting in accordance to their gender anima, but they take it one step further from Homosexuals by actually performing sex transformation surgeries.

Therefore, it is safe to say that Hippo's statement is full of shit.
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Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

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Phocidaea
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Postby Phocidaea » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:16 pm

Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:
Phocidaea wrote:No sabe hablar español y tampoco sé.

Spanish is an annoying language :P

Isso é português/italiano, seu cabeça-de-vento n00b. :lol:

I hate how Spanish tends to have like five different verbs that equate to slightly different shades of meaning one English verb. How the fuck the Spaniards came to have two different and unrelated verbs for the fucking copula I will never understand.
Call me Phoca.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:16 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?

If people are allowed to disagree with you about gender, then they might disagree with you about anything! Oh the horror, the horror!
He/Him

beating the devil
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Free United States
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Postby Free United States » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:17 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?


Define 'roles in society'? Gender roles have been different over the course of a thousand years.

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Torcularis Septentrionalis
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Postby Torcularis Septentrionalis » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:17 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:How do trans* folk break anything down? In what way can they not work in society that would make it fail, or even stutter? Oh, wait, they don't harm society at all. You just say they are and can never prove it.

This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?

Explain to me why traditional gender roles are good.
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Lost heros
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Postby Lost heros » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:17 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
Condunum wrote:Hippo, riddle me this. You accept gays, right? Well, why? Cultural marxism is what made them acceptable. You accept women, right? Why? Cultural marxism is what gave them the right to vote. You accept black people, right? Why? Cultural marxism gave them freedom. You accept anyone who isn't a while, land owning male, right? Why? YOU ARE A CULTURAL MARXIST, YOU LEFTIST PIG.

Because homosexuality doesn't harm anyone, two people in a stable family are perfectly capable of raising a child.

So can a trans* person.
Women can make just as intelligent decisions as men can,
So can a trans* person
same with blacks
Same with a trans* person
. Homosexuals, women and blacks are perfectly capable of participating in various areas of the society while respecting its traditions and foundations.
So can a trans* person.

This is where transsexuals come in.

No it isn't.
Unlike women, blacks and homosexuals, transsexuals cannot exist as long as traditional male/divide is in place and as such they are forced to deconstruct it, which I oppose

You oppose people being true to themselves like homosexuals. You oppose people who can't change who they are like blacks.
. Homosexuals, women and blacks can act within the boundaries of male/female divide. Transsexuals cannot.

I don't even know what this divide you say is. Probably because it doesn't exist.

This is why I support gay rights, but not transsexual rights.

So for no reason whatsoever, good to know.
Last edited by Lost Heros on Sun Mar 6, 2016 12:00, edited 173 times in total.


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Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro
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Postby Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:17 pm

Phocidaea wrote:
Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:Isso é português/italiano, seu cabeça-de-vento n00b. :lol:

I hate how Spanish tends to have like five different verbs that equate to slightly different shades of meaning one English verb. How the fuck the Spaniards came to have two different and unrelated verbs for the fucking copula I will never understand.

Cópula?

Foder/transar/fazer amor/tchaca tchaca na butchaca? :lol:
Aequalitia's bromancey mancrush.
Test: Seemingly, libertarian communism was renamed "social democracy"
Compass: economic left -9.85, social libertarian -8.97
Socio-Economic Ideology: Democratic Socialist (92% ditto/Marxist, 75% Anarchist/Social democrat, 0% etc)

Born 12/94. Weird in all senses starting at 07/2000. NSG's resident euro-carioca bara-fudanshi useless lazy perv. Agnostic atheist (not anti-religious), bi-affective homosexual/demiheterosexual (and bi-curious i.e. chronologically 95% bisexual-ish but 5% true bi), slightly more masculine of both tad neutral and tad ambiguous gender (human-/oneself-identified genderqueer; he, xe or ou, your preference), naturist, "worker" class, mildly hipster/japanophile, etc.

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Soldati Senza Confini
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:17 pm

Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:
Phocidaea wrote:No sabe hablar español y tampoco sé.

Spanish is an annoying language :P

Isso é português/italiano, seu cabeça-de-vento n00b. :lol:


El espaniol es casi igual :lol2:

Seriously, Latin languages are not that hard across each other. They use the same syntax and verb structure so it's relatively easy to translate between one another.
Soldati senza confini: Better than an iPod in shuffle more with 20,000 songs.
Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

"When it’s a choice of putting food on the table, or thinking about your morals, it’s easier to say you’d think about your morals, but only if you’ve never faced that decision." - Anastasia Richardson

Current Goal: Flesh out nation factbook.


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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:18 pm

Torcularis Septentrionalis wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?

Explain to me why traditional gender roles are good.

Because Hippo likes them and he is the only person anywhere who matters. How dare you question his supremacy over all lesser beings?!
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Condunum
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Postby Condunum » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:19 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:[...] what's next? Races? National identities?

There are no such thing as races Hippo.
http://www.nowpublic.com/world/human-genome-project-announces-race-does-not-exist
http://wupa.wustl.edu/record_archive/1998/10-15-98/articles/races.html

Don't perpetuate the malicious inventions of imperialist racists.

God dammit don't feed his slippery slope.
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The Carlisle
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Postby The Carlisle » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:19 pm

Nevanmaa wrote:
The Carlisle wrote:Stop lying. You are not sorry for me. You have no sympathy towards transgender people at all. Admit it, your a transphobe.

I'm a transphobe as much as I'm an autistphobe or a schitzophreniaphobe. I don't like any medically diagnosed disorders.

So my Gender Dysphoria is as bad as autism and schizophrenia?! And you dislike autistic and schizophrenic people?!
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Phocidaea
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Postby Phocidaea » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:19 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:[...] what's next? Races? National identities?

There are no such thing as races Hippo.
http://www.nowpublic.com/world/human-genome-project-announces-race-does-not-exist
http://wupa.wustl.edu/record_archive/1998/10-15-98/articles/races.html

Don't perpetuate the malicious inventions of imperialist racists.

B-b-but CULTURAL MARXISM!

And as for national identities, isn't it a tad ironic that a Finn who thinks he's American thinks hard-defined national identities are good?
Call me Phoca.
Senator [Unknown] of the Liberal Democrats in NSG Senate.
Je suis Charlie: Because your feels don't justify murder.

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Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro
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Postby Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:20 pm

Soldati senza confini wrote:El espaniol es casi igual :lol2:

Seriously, Latin languages are not that hard across each other. They use the same syntax and verb structure so it's relatively easy to translate between one another.

Just learn Portuguese before Spanish and everything is fine.

I hate the accent of foreigners (especially Anglophones) who seem to think Portuguese is just some kind of Spanish. Perhaps the worst I've ever come across.
Aequalitia's bromancey mancrush.
Test: Seemingly, libertarian communism was renamed "social democracy"
Compass: economic left -9.85, social libertarian -8.97
Socio-Economic Ideology: Democratic Socialist (92% ditto/Marxist, 75% Anarchist/Social democrat, 0% etc)

Born 12/94. Weird in all senses starting at 07/2000. NSG's resident euro-carioca bara-fudanshi useless lazy perv. Agnostic atheist (not anti-religious), bi-affective homosexual/demiheterosexual (and bi-curious i.e. chronologically 95% bisexual-ish but 5% true bi), slightly more masculine of both tad neutral and tad ambiguous gender (human-/oneself-identified genderqueer; he, xe or ou, your preference), naturist, "worker" class, mildly hipster/japanophile, etc.

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Soldati Senza Confini
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Postby Soldati Senza Confini » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:20 pm

Torcularis Septentrionalis wrote:
Nevanmaa wrote:This, my friend, is cultural marxism. What they're trying to deconstruct is the traditional roles of society that have existed for a millenia, and a good reason. If destroying the concept of gender is first, what's next? Races? National identities?

Explain to me why traditional gender roles are good.


Gender identification is good Torcularis.

What is not good is box yourself into what it is portrayed as the Ideal Alpha Male or the Ideal Beta Woman.

These idealizations are mere ideals, and nobody eats out of ideals. So I would say that, while gender roles and identification is good to a certain extent, it is a fine line between being a perfectly normal individual and a psychotic, restrictive, and bitter individual who lives in a very narrow dimension of their potential.
Soldati senza confini: Better than an iPod in shuffle more with 20,000 songs.
Tekania wrote:Welcome to NSG, where informed opinions get to bump-heads with ignorant ideology under the pretense of an equal footing.

"When it’s a choice of putting food on the table, or thinking about your morals, it’s easier to say you’d think about your morals, but only if you’ve never faced that decision." - Anastasia Richardson

Current Goal: Flesh out nation factbook.

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Condunum
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Postby Condunum » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:20 pm

Has Hippo ever read any of the reports on how trans* folk tend to be happier when they identify as they want to and how many who are reassigned live happier after the surgery than before?

Because I have a feeling he hasn't.
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Phocidaea
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Postby Phocidaea » Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:21 pm

Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro wrote:
Phocidaea wrote:I hate how Spanish tends to have like five different verbs that equate to slightly different shades of meaning one English verb. How the fuck the Spaniards came to have two different and unrelated verbs for the fucking copula I will never understand.

Cópula?

Foder/transar/fazer amor/tchaca tchaca na butchaca? :lol:

I forgot, Spanish technically has three words for "be" if you count the third person of "haber".
Call me Phoca.
Senator [Unknown] of the Liberal Democrats in NSG Senate.
Je suis Charlie: Because your feels don't justify murder.

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