Atheist Discussion Thread

[Pandeeria]

What about how the bible supports killing gays?

The bible is metaphorical to me. And sometimes I feel like the people who wrote it put their own agendas in it.

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

This seems pretty literal to me. All well, at least your not a ignorant and bigoted Christian

[Pensalum]

Not really much to do with Theism....

He said he like the ideas from Catholicism, so I'm just asking him a few questions about it.

What I meant by that is the turn the other cheek philosophy. I like the peace that Catholicism preaches, despite the fact that few follow it.

[Menassa]

I don't yell.

You are rather moderate in comparison to some people I have seen.

Come now.

The bible is metaphorical to me. And sometimes I feel like the people who wrote it put their own agendas in it.

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

This seems pretty literal to me. All well, at least your not a ignorant and bigoted Christian

Context is key.

The religion formed the culture, who today keeps the culture? Those whose parents kept it? Why did they keep it? They probably were religious... the culture comes from the religion not the other way around.

Things refraining from certain actions on the Sabbath all of these actions are not in the Bible, they come from the Oral Law another part of the religion that most people keep (usually over the written Law, but eh.)

Languages, are another thing to notice.

Kippot and not mixing milk and meat aren't in the Bible itself, it comes from the Oral Law, the Oral part of our religion... perhaps this is the 'culture' of which you speak?

I'm not versed enough to debate you on this, also I'm really tired and don't care enough, so I'll take your words into consideration about culture stemming from religion and not vice versa.
Yes majority of the traditions stem from oral law, but some stem from written law, for example Passover and all the things done during Passover.
Regardless, this is a threadjack and we should stop. I'll probably TG you sometime in the near future about this subject.

Indeed, the Oral Law instructs us how to keep what we are commanded to keep in the written Law.

I feel I'm pretty extreme and some people think I am...

How so?

That would depend on the person, to some people me praying 3 times a day is extreme... to others it's rather liberal.

[Pandeeria]

He said he like the ideas from Catholicism, so I'm just asking him a few questions about it.

What I meant by that is the turn the other cheek philosophy. I like the peace that Catholicism preaches, despite the fact that few follow it.

That's what I don't understand. The bible also preaches a lot of violence and hate. You could argue that it's metaphorical, but there is quite a lot of it, and it seems really literal. You could argue it's just that ignorant and bad people put it into the bible, but then why follow the bible and religion? It's still in the bible.

If I can ask, why do you need religion for morals and peace?

[Floating mountain]

You are rather moderate in comparison to some people I have seen.

Come now.

If you can beat not being able to go two sentences without a "Praise Jesus" than you are extreme. I did actual know someone like that and then they moved.

[Genivaria]

You're hardly extreme.
If you want extreme go to Fundies Say the Darndest Things.com for some real nausea.

I feel I'm pretty extreme and some people think I am...

(CNN) -- A Maryland woman involved with a group described as a religious cult pleaded guilty in the starvation death of her son, but insisted that the charges be dropped when he is resurrected.

The condition was made a part of Ria Ramkissoon's plea agreement, officials said. She entered the plea Monday in Baltimore, Maryland, to a first-degree felony count of child abuse resulting in death, her attorney, Steven Silverman, said Tuesday.

Ramkissoon, a member of a group called One Mind Ministries, believes Javon Thompson, her year-old son, will rise again, and as part of her plea agreement, authorities agreed to the clause.

That's extreme. You're not that.

[Pandeeria]

Come now.

If you can beat not being able to go two sentences without a "Praise Jesus" than you are extreme. I did actual know someone like that and then they moved.

How extreme would you think I am?

[Menassa]

Come now.

If you can beat not being able to go two sentences without a "Praise Jesus" than you are extreme. I did actual know someone like that and then they moved.

So only Christians can be fundamentalists

[Pensalum]

The bible is metaphorical to me. And sometimes I feel like the people who wrote it put their own agendas in it.

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

This seems pretty literal to me. All well, at least your not a ignorant and bigoted Christian

That quote still makes me cringe. I'm pro gay marriage and pro choice. It might be blasphemous, but all people are people right?

[Neo Rome Republic]

If you can beat not being able to go two sentences without a "Praise Jesus" than you are extreme. I did actual know someone like that and then they moved.

So only Christians can be fundamentalists

Nah, only Christians AND Muslims.

[Menassa]

I feel I'm pretty extreme and some people think I am...

(CNN) -- A Maryland woman involved with a group described as a religious cult pleaded guilty in the starvation death of her son, but insisted that the charges be dropped when he is resurrected.

The condition was made a part of Ria Ramkissoon's plea agreement, officials said. She entered the plea Monday in Baltimore, Maryland, to a first-degree felony count of child abuse resulting in death, her attorney, Steven Silverman, said Tuesday.

Ramkissoon, a member of a group called One Mind Ministries, believes Javon Thompson, her year-old son, will rise again, and as part of her plea agreement, authorities agreed to the clause.

That's extreme. You're not that.

I wouldn't describe doing stupid things as fundamentalist.

Shammai was fundamentalist him and his students were in no way stupid.

I realize now that this is example is probably lost on most people.

[Floating mountain]

If you can beat not being able to go two sentences without a "Praise Jesus" than you are extreme. I did actual know someone like that and then they moved.

So only Christians can be fundamentalists

No but it is the most extreme example I have due to the frequency, duration, and where i live most people are Christian or atheist.

[Pandeeria]

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

This seems pretty literal to me. All well, at least your not a ignorant and bigoted Christian

That quote still makes me cringe. I'm pro gay marriage and pro choice. It might be blasphemous, but all people are people right?

Correct. But I don't understand, why follow the religion with a holy book that promotes violence and hate? I believe you said you like the morals of religion (well at least Catholicism) but why get morals from religion at all? You don't need a book to have morals and to be a good human being.

[Genivaria]

That's extreme. You're not that.

I wouldn't describe doing stupid things as fundamentalist.

Shammai was fundamentalist him and his students were in no way stupid.

I realize now that this is example is probably lost on most people.

I wasn't using the word 'fundamentalist' I was using the word extreme.
Check this list out.
http://www.fstdt.com/Top100.aspx

[Menassa]

What I meant by that is the turn the other cheek philosophy. I like the peace that Catholicism preaches, despite the fact that few follow it.

[...]
If I can ask, why do you need religion for morals and peace?

I know who I am without religion,
I hate that person.

[Floating mountain]

If you can beat not being able to go two sentences without a "Praise Jesus" than you are extreme. I did actual know someone like that and then they moved.

How extreme would you think I am?

I haven't be on long enough to tell.

[Pensalum]

What I meant by that is the turn the other cheek philosophy. I like the peace that Catholicism preaches, despite the fact that few follow it.

That's what I don't understand. The bible also preaches a lot of violence and hate. You could argue that it's metaphorical, but there is quite a lot of it, and it seems really literal. You could argue it's just that ignorant and bad people put it into the bible, but then why follow the bible and religion? It's still in the bible.

If I can ask, why do you need religion for morals and peace?

May I ask where the bible preaches violence and hate? I haven't really read it.

[Menassa]

I wouldn't describe doing stupid things as fundamentalist.

Shammai was fundamentalist him and his students were in no way stupid.

I realize now that this is example is probably lost on most people.

I wasn't using the word 'fundamentalist' I was using the word extreme.
Check this list out.
http://www.fstdt.com/Top100.aspx

Shammai once punched a hole in his roof so his daughter who just gave birth and her son could bee under a Sukkah.

[Pandeeria]

[...]
If I can ask, why do you need religion for morals and peace?

I know who I am without religion,
I hate that person.

So you need a old book with violence and ignorance inside to guide you towards morality and being a good human being? You don't need a religion to be a good person.

[Pandeeria]

That's what I don't understand. The bible also preaches a lot of violence and hate. You could argue that it's metaphorical, but there is quite a lot of it, and it seems really literal. You could argue it's just that ignorant and bad people put it into the bible, but then why follow the bible and religion? It's still in the bible.

If I can ask, why do you need religion for morals and peace?

May I ask where the bible preaches violence and hate? I haven't really read it.

There is more, if you want me to post more:

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests
Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)

Kill Witches
You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Kill Fortunetellers
A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

Death for Hitting Dad
Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)

[Menassa]

I know who I am without religion,
I hate that person.

So you need a old book with violence and ignorance inside to guide you towards morality and being a good human being? You don't need a religion to be a good person.

I have a feeling we're not reading the same book(s)

Old also doesn't equal bad.

[Pensalum]

Correct. But I don't understand, why follow the religion with a holy book that promotes violence and hate? I believe you said you like the morals of religion (well at least Catholicism) but why get morals from religion at all? You don't need a book to have morals and to be a good human being.

You don't need religion to have morals. Anyone, atheist or not can be a good person. I just choose to use the morals in religion because I believe in God.

[Menassa]

May I ask where the bible preaches violence and hate? I haven't really read it.

There is more, if you want me to post more:

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests
Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)

Kill Witches
You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Kill Fortunetellers
A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

Death for Hitting Dad
Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)

http://torah.org/learning/livinglaw/5768/mishpatim.html
http://www.simpletoremember.com/jewish/ ... -barbaric/

[Pandeeria]

So you need a old book with violence and ignorance inside to guide you towards morality and being a good human being? You don't need a religion to be a good person.

I have a feeling we're not reading the same book(s)

Old also doesn't equal bad.

In older times, there was rampant fascism and sexism, a lot more hate and intolerance, and in the way old times, we lived under kings and theocracies.

While old doesn't automatically equal bad, it most likely will.

[Genivaria]

So you need a old book with violence and ignorance inside to guide you towards morality and being a good human being? You don't need a religion to be a good person.

I have a feeling we're not reading the same book(s)

Old also doesn't equal bad.

I believe 'outdated' was the purpose of pointing out it's age.