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The Wycihowskiist Collective
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Postby The Wycihowskiist Collective » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:28 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Souseiseki wrote:whether developmentally disabled adults should be able to go to a high school might have been an interesting topic if you didn't put in all this lol transchronologial bullshit

But without the lol transchronological bullshit then how could the thread secretly be about "Trans people: Should they be allowed?"


I'm not debating whether transpeople should be allowed. I am fine with whatever they choose. I am saying, as technology and other fringe groups demand THEIR rights, where do we draw the line? Hell, what if a furrie who identifies as a dog wants to be walked by a person? Do you see what I mean?

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Cannot think of a name
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Postby Cannot think of a name » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:30 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:Hell, what if a furrie who identifies as a dog wants to be walked by a person?

Craigslist.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:30 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Souseiseki wrote:whether developmentally disabled adults should be able to go to a high school might have been an interesting topic if you didn't put in all this lol transchronologial bullshit


She isn't retarded. She mentally is average, just acts younger then her years. As I have said, I have no problem with transgendered people. But what if people keep changing ages ( I don't know why they would do that), species , etc. Where does it end?

Hopefully where you realise that gender identity is A Thing In Your Head and age and species and shit like that isn't. Hopefully.
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Benuty
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Postby Benuty » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:30 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Ifreann wrote:But without the lol transchronological bullshit then how could the thread secretly be about "Trans people: Should they be allowed?"


I'm not debating whether transpeople should be allowed. I am fine with whatever they choose. I am saying, as technology and other fringe groups demand THEIR rights, where do we draw the line? Hell, what if a furrie who identifies as a dog wants to be walked by a person? Do you see what I mean?


The BDSM community seems fine with doing that ( considering they have been doing it).
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Souseiseki
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Postby Souseiseki » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:30 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Souseiseki wrote:whether developmentally disabled adults should be able to go to a high school might have been an interesting topic if you didn't put in all this lol transchronologial bullshit


She isn't retarded. She mentally is average, just acts younger then her years. As I have said, I have no problem with transgendered people. But what if people keep changing ages ( I don't know why they would do that), species , etc. Where does it end?

wait are you the OP?

are you 100% sure this isn't just: "oh, you want to be a girl? well what about people who want to be cats? where does it eeeeeeeeend?" thread?
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Benuty
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Postby Benuty » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:31 pm

Cannot think of a name wrote:
The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:Hell, what if a furrie who identifies as a dog wants to be walked by a person?

Craigslist.


Too many serial killers on Craigslist.
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The Wycihowskiist Collective
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Postby The Wycihowskiist Collective » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:31 pm

[quote="Cannot think of a name";p="16345723"]Don't we call this 'developmentally disabled' and already have accommodations for it?[/quote

Yes. We do . But Cindy is cognitivelt normal ( How I hate that word). But let's take it further..Some of the students at the high school ( and parents) start complaining. They have a problem with a 21 year old women bing a freshman in high school and are concerned with her flirty ways.

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Cannot think of a name
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Postby Cannot think of a name » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:32 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:She mentally is average, just acts younger then her years.

In my day we called that 'being a Slacker'. I've kept the faith for perhaps too long.

Get a job at a coffee shop and open an Etsy store just like everyone else who feels that way.
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Zottistan
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Postby Zottistan » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:33 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Ifreann wrote:But without the lol transchronological bullshit then how could the thread secretly be about "Trans people: Should they be allowed?"


I'm not debating whether transpeople should be allowed. I am fine with whatever they choose. I am saying, as technology and other fringe groups demand THEIR rights, where do we draw the line? Hell, what if a furrie who identifies as a dog wants to be walked by a person? Do you see what I mean?

We let them. Why shouldn't we? The greatest thing about humanity is our ability to adapt our circumstances to us instead of adapting ourselves to our circumstances. There's no better example of this than using medicine to make a person physically how they want to be mentally. If somebody wants to be walked and they can find somebody who wants to walk them, why shouldn't they be allowed to walk them?

Yes, we all see what you mean. It's just wrong.

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Cannot think of a name
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Postby Cannot think of a name » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:33 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Cannot think of a name wrote:Don't we call this 'developmentally disabled' and already have accommodations for it?


Yes. We do . But Cindy is cognitivelt normal ( How I hate that word). But let's take it further..Some of the students at the high school ( and parents) start complaining. They have a problem with a 21 year old women bing a freshman in high school and are concerned with her flirty ways.

Why are we taking it further when I haven't even taken it to your initial point?
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Dumb Ideologies
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Postby Dumb Ideologies » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:35 pm

I keep re-reading and my response to the thread is still "Wut". I'll keep you updated when I manage to process this stupid comparison.
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The Wycihowskiist Collective
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Postby The Wycihowskiist Collective » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:35 pm

Benuty wrote:
Cannot think of a name wrote:Craigslist.


Too many serial killers on Craigslist.



Serial killers :shock: :shock: . Their human s***, and should be put in a cell and have the air pumped. No reason to go to the expense of an execution.

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Draakonite
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Postby Draakonite » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:35 pm

Ifreann wrote:
The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
She isn't retarded. She mentally is average, just acts younger then her years. As I have said, I have no problem with transgendered people. But what if people keep changing ages ( I don't know why they would do that), species , etc. Where does it end?

Hopefully where you realise that gender identity is A Thing In Your Head and age and species and shit like that isn't. Hopefully.


Ever heard of "Otherkin"?

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:36 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Ifreann wrote:But without the lol transchronological bullshit then how could the thread secretly be about "Trans people: Should they be allowed?"


I'm not debating whether transpeople should be allowed.

Colour me sceptical.
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Dumb Ideologies
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Postby Dumb Ideologies » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:37 pm

Ifreann wrote:
The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
I'm not debating whether transpeople should be allowed.

Colour me sceptical.


Alright. That feels like an ochre emotion. I'll get my paintbrush. This may tickle a little.
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Cannot think of a name
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Postby Cannot think of a name » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:37 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Benuty wrote:
Too many serial killers on Craigslist.



Serial killers :shock: :shock: . Their human s***, and should be put in a cell and have the air pumped. No reason to go to the expense of an execution.

Well...thanks for that unrelated, unsolicited and disturbingly specific revenge fantasy that closes the gap between you and serial killers...
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Tsuntion
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Postby Tsuntion » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:37 pm

Draakonite wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Hopefully where you realise that gender identity is A Thing In Your Head and age and species and shit like that isn't. Hopefully.


Ever heard of "Otherkin"?


If they have brains more similar to those of their identified species than those of humans, I might take them seriously and begin to wonder about accommodating them.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:39 pm

Draakonite wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Hopefully where you realise that gender identity is A Thing In Your Head and age and species and shit like that isn't. Hopefully.


Ever heard of "Otherkin"?

Yes.
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Zottistan
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Postby Zottistan » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:40 pm

Tsuntion wrote:
Draakonite wrote:
Ever heard of "Otherkin"?


If they have brains more similar to those of their identified species than those of humans, I might take them seriously and begin to wonder about accommodating them.

If they don't have brains similar to their identified species, I'd accommodate them too. Provided they can pay for themselves, considering that since the brains don't line up it would essentially be cosmetic surgery.

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:40 pm

Dumb Ideologies wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Colour me sceptical.


Alright. That feels like an ochre emotion. I'll get my paintbrush. This may tickle a little.

I think I'd look good ochre.
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Banter For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Snark That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Sarcasm
He/Him

Dangerous this Jack o' Hearts.
With his kiss
the riot
starts

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The Wycihowskiist Collective
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Postby The Wycihowskiist Collective » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:41 pm

Zottistan wrote:
The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
I'm not debating whether transpeople should be allowed. I am fine with whatever they choose. I am saying, as technology and other fringe groups demand THEIR rights, where do we draw the line? Hell, what if a furrie who identifies as a dog wants to be walked by a person? Do you see what I mean?

We let them. Why shouldn't we? The greatest thing about humanity is our ability to adapt our circumstances to us instead of adapting ourselves to our circumstances. There's no better example of this than using medicine to make a person physically how they want to be mentally. If somebody wants to be walked and they can find somebody who wants to walk them, why shouldn't they be allowed to walk them?

Yes, we all see what you mean. It's just wrong.


!. The reason I put it here was to see if their was any concerns about the scenario descibed. My sole point is that it spells a change for our society ( and change can be good). However, changes always bring on further changes. Point in case: The civil rights protest of the 60's and 70's opened the minds of disabled people to fight for their own rights. Nobody expected that to come from the Civll Rights Movement.
2. Where do we stop? There are some abvious ones we wouldn't allow because their criminal in nature. But to what point? Is ageplay next? Furrys? You see what I mean?
3. That was the whole point of it, to explore the possible consequences ( unintended, possibly) of decisions we make today.

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Llamalandia
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Postby Llamalandia » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:41 pm

The Noahideian Civitatis wrote:So I was thinking about Transgendered people, and I was wondering if it could be applied other ways. I don't have any problems with it, but usually i think societal rules evolve for good reasons.

Anyways I thought about an application and I wast to see what you thought about it:

You are the principal of a high school. Students and their parents are enrolling them in their classes when you have an unusual problem. In comes Cindy, a girl who wants to enroll in 9th grade, She is a biological female, so no problems there. The problem is her age. She is 21. Yet she claims that she is " transchronological" and that she really is a freshman in high school.
Her father comes in with her, He explains to you that while she indeed IS 21, that she developmentally functions at a 15 year old level. Yes, she has been to high school, but a psychiatrist report you are given says that " because of her being transchronological, she functions at a level of a 15 year old. It would be recommended foe her to go through high school , since by that time her emotional and developmental delays will get better".
You observe her while her father dioes that talking, and you observe many childish behaviors. When her father mentions her developmental delay, Cindy rolls her eyes and becomes engrossed in her Iphone. She clearly is bored, and gives off body language that she would rather not be here.
Her father asks she be enrolled, and that since she is emotionally and developmentally delayed, that he be appraised of her behavior. He emphasises that she is not mentally delayed in any way, but that she needs as he says " more time to grow up" and feels that he would be an excellent student at your high school.
So do you take here? She IS 21 and, as most people consider, an adult? Do you refuse her?

My opinion is that transgendered people are all right. But as my example shows, what is excellent for male to female or female to male people can open a whole can of worms. What do you do? At what time do you put a stop to it? Oh, and YES, people that ARE developmentally delayed ( severely or profoundly retarded) CAN go to school to the age of 25. What rules should society set? I see a lot of chaos.

I'll admit I really wanted to spend an extra here in high school (had some good friends the class behind me). To my knowledge some private (especially boarding it seems) schools allow kids to stay on an extra 6months - year to take more college prep courses if they want before heading to college. That said what you're proposing seems obviously a good deal more radical than that. Im not sure I would tend to say not without the person's consent. Also while i realize that many people consider transgenderism to be innate like sexual orientation the transgender person does still often make a conscience and informed decision on how and whether to transition/express/identify themselves and their fully informed consent is obviously critical to any surgery or transition. That said youre transchronos would present a bit of a conundrum here as if they are truly as "delayed' as they appear then are they really capable of consenting once they reach the age of majority or should their legal guardian make all the decisions here (or some combination). Additionally, at least for mental or psychiatrict incompetency/incapacitation the state or relatives can file for a conservatorship over a person which gives them broad powers to control the persons life decisions however such options are more reserved for extreme case of things like paranoid schizophrenia.

But in the case of school let us not forget that isn't primary principle and goal is the academic education of students with physical education and psychosocial development as a secondary goals. I mean it seems like perhaps if the school had the faculty (and enought students to justify the expense) to provide further college level classes to this 21 year old (who i assume has already been through high school once or am i misunderstanding you?) then perhaps it would be all right.

That said why not just let her go to a local college and celebrate school events and activities with the high school that way her career prospects are not delayed (in case she comes to realize when she is mature that she really wasn't transchrono if that makes any sense) and she can still enjoy the comraderie of people "her own age".

Of course integrating transgender students can be hard and expensive enough as it is and even in open communities they likely face at least moderate criticism, i'd have to think the same would be true of these transchronos. :) :)
Last edited by Llamalandia on Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Wycihowskiist Collective
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Postby The Wycihowskiist Collective » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:42 pm

Cannot think of a name wrote:
The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:

Serial killers :shock: :shock: . Their human s***, and should be put in a cell and have the air pumped. No reason to go to the expense of an execution.

Well...thanks for that unrelated, unsolicited and disturbingly specific revenge fantasy that closes the gap between you and serial killers...


I don't have any mercy or pity for them. Kill them and don't allow them the privledge of breathing Earth's oxygen for a second loger.

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Zottistan
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Postby Zottistan » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:43 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Zottistan wrote:We let them. Why shouldn't we? The greatest thing about humanity is our ability to adapt our circumstances to us instead of adapting ourselves to our circumstances. There's no better example of this than using medicine to make a person physically how they want to be mentally. If somebody wants to be walked and they can find somebody who wants to walk them, why shouldn't they be allowed to walk them?

Yes, we all see what you mean. It's just wrong.


!. The reason I put it here was to see if their was any concerns about the scenario descibed. My sole point is that it spells a change for our society ( and change can be good). However, changes always bring on further changes. Point in case: The civil rights protest of the 60's and 70's opened the minds of disabled people to fight for their own rights. Nobody expected that to come from the Civll Rights Movement.
2. Where do we stop? There are some abvious ones we wouldn't allow because their criminal in nature. But to what point? Is ageplay next? Furrys? You see what I mean?
3. That was the whole point of it, to explore the possible consequences ( unintended, possibly) of decisions we make today.

1) There are no serious ones.
2) Provided it's legal and not hurting anybody who doesn't consent, ageplay and furries would be fine.
3) I see very few possible negative consequences that wouldn't be for the better.

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Benuty
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Postby Benuty » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:43 pm

The Wycihowskiist Collective wrote:
Zottistan wrote:We let them. Why shouldn't we? The greatest thing about humanity is our ability to adapt our circumstances to us instead of adapting ourselves to our circumstances. There's no better example of this than using medicine to make a person physically how they want to be mentally. If somebody wants to be walked and they can find somebody who wants to walk them, why shouldn't they be allowed to walk them?

Yes, we all see what you mean. It's just wrong.


!. The reason I put it here was to see if their was any concerns about the scenario descibed. My sole point is that it spells a change for our society ( and change can be good). However, changes always bring on further changes. Point in case: The civil rights protest of the 60's and 70's opened the minds of disabled people to fight for their own rights. Nobody expected that to come from the Civll Rights Movement.
2. Where do we stop? There are some abvious ones we wouldn't allow because their criminal in nature. But to what point? Is ageplay next? Furrys? You see what I mean?
3. That was the whole point of it, to explore the possible consequences ( unintended, possibly) of decisions we make today.


https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope
Last edited by Hashem 13.8 billion years ago
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