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Miley Cyrus VMA performance and modern views on sex and race

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:13 pm

Magna Libero wrote:Yeah. So, this is the most popular news in these times?

No.
Even more popular than all the other news and crisis that are happening, such as wars or famine?

They're getting far more attention.
she is just ugly.

So nothing to actually contribute?

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:16 pm

"People say, ‘Hey, do you think this is degrading to women?’ I’m like, ‘Of course it is. What a pleasure it is to degrade a woman. I’ve never gotten to do that before. I’ve always respected women."

-Thicke
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:19 pm

The Parkus Empire wrote:"People say, ‘Hey, do you think this is degrading to women?’ I’m like, ‘Of course it is. What a pleasure it is to degrade a woman. I’ve never gotten to do that before. I’ve always respected women."

-Thicke

Truly he will be remembered by history as the greatest of feminist philosophers.

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Tahar Joblis
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Postby Tahar Joblis » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:20 pm

Bottle wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Except no, not really.

Well, for the people who can't conceive of sex as anything other than an act which is done to woman-objects by man-subjects, I suppose it is.

Like the people who look at Cyrus backing up and wiggling her butt onto a man's crotch - you know, actively dancing sexy and not being by any means passive - and describe it putting Cyrus as the object of the verb and the (largely stationary) man as the subject of the verb.

As if this dancing is active-subject Thicke doing a thing to passive-object Cyrus.
Bottle wrote:complete with grinding his crotch against Cyrus's rump.

The Rich Port wrote:He looked really uncomfortable grinding up against Cyrus

Yeah, there are some people running around and doing this... physician, heal thyself.

Anyway, on the topic of Thicke, we already had a thread on it, and I'd like to point anybody interested in talking about "Blurred Lines" to that thread to review.

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:21 pm

Ifreann wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:"People say, ‘Hey, do you think this is degrading to women?’ I’m like, ‘Of course it is. What a pleasure it is to degrade a woman. I’ve never gotten to do that before. I’ve always respected women."

-Thicke

Truly he will be remembered by history as the greatest of feminist philosophers.

A very unique and creative brand of feminism his was at that.
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Tahar Joblis
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Postby Tahar Joblis » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:21 pm

The Parkus Empire wrote:"People say, ‘Hey, do you think this is degrading to women?’ I’m like, ‘Of course it is. What a pleasure it is to degrade a woman. I’ve never gotten to do that before. I’ve always respected women."

-Thicke

Sounds like he either doesn't know what the meaning of "degrade" is, or was answering with great sarcasm.

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:24 pm

Tahar Joblis wrote:
Bottle wrote:Well, for the people who can't conceive of sex as anything other than an act which is done to woman-objects by man-subjects, I suppose it is.

Like the people who look at Cyrus backing up and wiggling her butt onto a man's crotch - you know, actively dancing sexy and not being by any means passive - and describe it putting Cyrus as the object of the verb and the (largely stationary) man as the subject of the verb.

As if this dancing is active-subject Thicke doing a thing to passive-object Cyrus.
Bottle wrote:complete with grinding his crotch against Cyrus's rump.

The Rich Port wrote:He looked really uncomfortable grinding up against Cyrus

Yeah, there are some people running around and doing this... physician, heal thyself.

Anyway, on the topic of Thicke, we already had a thread on it, and I'd like to point anybody interested in talking about "Blurred Lines" to that thread to review.

Thicke and that song were both a part of the performance and very much relate to the criticism of it.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:25 pm

The Parkus Empire wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Truly he will be remembered by history as the greatest of feminist philosophers.

A very unique and creative brand of feminism his was at that.

36 years of respecting women(and he wouldn't have said it if it weren't true) earns one some credit towards degrading them.

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Bottle
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Postby Bottle » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:26 pm

Ifreann wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:A very unique and creative brand of feminism his was at that.

36 years of respecting women(and he wouldn't have said it if it weren't true) earns one some credit towards degrading them.

Woman here, can confirm: Old dudes totally get a free pass on being creepy. True fact.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:34 pm

Bottle wrote:
Ifreann wrote:36 years of respecting women(and he wouldn't have said it if it weren't true) earns one some credit towards degrading them.

Woman here, can confirm: Old dudes totally get a free pass on being creepy. True fact.

Sweet, I have something to look forward to.

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Bottle
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Postby Bottle » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:38 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Bottle wrote:Woman here, can confirm: Old dudes totally get a free pass on being creepy. True fact.

Sweet, I have something to look forward to.

Make sure you dress like Gordon Gekko, and hang out at under-21 clubs every Thursday night. You get extra feminist points if you introduce yourself to groups of college freshman by asking which one of them wants to take a ride in your BMW.
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Trollgaard
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Postby Trollgaard » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:41 pm

Wait, what's wrong with that blurred lines song? I heard on the radio a few times...it has an infectious groove to it. What is wrong with it?

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:43 pm

Trollgaard wrote:Wait, what's wrong with that blurred lines song? I heard on the radio a few times...it has an infectious groove to it. What is wrong with it?

It's all about guy telling a girl who's saying no that he knows she wants it. It's also got a fun bit about making her hurt because it works.
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Tahar Joblis
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Postby Tahar Joblis » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:44 pm

Bottle wrote:
Ifreann wrote:36 years of respecting women(and he wouldn't have said it if it weren't true) earns one some credit towards degrading them.

Woman here, can confirm: Old dudes totally get a free pass on being creepy. True fact.

Bullshit. Old women get much more of a pass on being creepy than old men.

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Trollgaard
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Postby Trollgaard » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:45 pm

The Parkus Empire wrote:
Trollgaard wrote:Wait, what's wrong with that blurred lines song? I heard on the radio a few times...it has an infectious groove to it. What is wrong with it?

It's all about guy telling a girl who's saying no that he knows she wants it. It's also got a fun bit about making her hurt because it works.


Hmm?

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Tahar Joblis
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Postby Tahar Joblis » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:47 pm

The Parkus Empire wrote:
Trollgaard wrote:Wait, what's wrong with that blurred lines song? I heard on the radio a few times...it has an infectious groove to it. What is wrong with it?

It's all about guy telling a girl who's saying no that he knows she wants it. It's also got a fun bit about making her hurt because it works.

There's actually nowhere in the entire song where he says that the girl is saying no. It does say that the girl grabs him and tells the girl to "get at him."

The way you grab me
Must wanna get nasty
Go ahead, get at me


It does suggest the girl likes rough sex, but again, this is the 21st century, we can admit that some people like rough sex.

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:51 pm

Trollgaard wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:It's all about guy telling a girl who's saying no that he knows she wants it. It's also got a fun bit about making her hurt because it works.


Hmm?

Watch the video/listen to the song.
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Trollgaard
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Postby Trollgaard » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:54 pm

The Parkus Empire wrote:
Trollgaard wrote:
Hmm?

Watch the video/listen to the song.


The video has tits in it! Uncensored even! lololol

I have heard the song...but I don't know if i've *listened* to it. Next time I catch it on the radio I'll try and pay more attention.

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The Parkus Empire
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Postby The Parkus Empire » Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:56 pm

Trollgaard wrote:
The Parkus Empire wrote:Watch the video/listen to the song.


The video has tits in it! Uncensored even! lololol

I have heard the song...but I don't know if i've *listened* to it. Next time I catch it on the radio I'll try and pay more attention.

Hm, yeah, they have an unrated one out there, although I was talking about the YouTube one.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 4:06 pm

Bottle wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Sweet, I have something to look forward to.

Make sure you dress like Gordon Gekko, and hang out at under-21 clubs every Thursday night. You get extra feminist points if you introduce yourself to groups of college freshman by asking which one of them wants to take a ride in your BMW.

Oh man, some friends and I went to a club a while back that we used to go to when we were freshmen, on a drunken whim. Felt so damned creepy.

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Greed and Death
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Postby Greed and Death » Fri Aug 30, 2013 4:07 pm

Wind in the Willows wrote:
greed and death wrote:I can agree, but being awful does not make racist.

And noting the awfulness does not make one a slut shamer.


What exactly is racist about a dance?

It is that she took a dance associated with African Americans and she imitated the dance in a comical fashion, that she treated blackness as something to put on and become more sexual, and also she treated her mostly black backup dancers as though they were objects to give her pleasure.

While I began this thread with the assumption that people were over reacting about the racial undertones I have changed my opinion I think the the act as a whole was racist and promotes a view of African Americans that is demeaning.
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Bottle
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Postby Bottle » Fri Aug 30, 2013 4:12 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Bottle wrote:Make sure you dress like Gordon Gekko, and hang out at under-21 clubs every Thursday night. You get extra feminist points if you introduce yourself to groups of college freshman by asking which one of them wants to take a ride in your BMW.

Oh man, some friends and I went to a club a while back that we used to go to when we were freshmen, on a drunken whim. Felt so damned creepy.

No joke. I was waiting to meet a TA friend of mine outside the student union the other day and had a total Mathew McConaughey moment.
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The Rich Port
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Postby The Rich Port » Fri Aug 30, 2013 6:12 pm

Northern Dominus wrote:
The Rich Port wrote:
It's because it's Adele.

She has talent AND she's not anorexic.
Is Miley Cyrus anorexic? How about Lady Gaga? Or Katy Perry? Are any of those women who happened to perform at the VMA's "anorexic" as well, or do you just not like Miley Cyrus and happened to attach some sort of back-handed insult to mock her body rather than state that you're just not a fan?


I wasn't referring to Miley Cyrus specifically.

That's all in YOUR head, brah.

Calm the hell down.

... Why are you defending her so much, anyway?

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Aug 30, 2013 6:16 pm

The Rich Port wrote:
Northern Dominus wrote:Is Miley Cyrus anorexic? How about Lady Gaga? Or Katy Perry? Are any of those women who happened to perform at the VMA's "anorexic" as well, or do you just not like Miley Cyrus and happened to attach some sort of back-handed insult to mock her body rather than state that you're just not a fan?


I wasn't referring to Miley Cyrus specifically.

So who were you referring to?The obvious implication of your post is that female mainstream music icons who are routinely sexualised are either untalented or anorexic. At least some of them must be, in your mind, anorexic or you wouldn't have mentioned it. So who is it? Expand on your point. Enlighten us as to your point of view.

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Las Palmeras
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Postby Las Palmeras » Fri Aug 30, 2013 6:21 pm

One thing for sure, Miley has definitely become the outlet of aggression for many.
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