Miley Cyrus VMA performance and modern views on sex and race

[Lordieth]

The idea of her "appropriating black culture" is simply silly, and the idea that overtly sexual and raunchy dancing are a "black thing" is racist in itself. She's not racist.

As for slut shaming, or it being too sexual, in my opinion, she's a 20 year old doing stupid things, it happens.

THAT IS THE POINT

SHE IS ASSOCIATING BLACKNESS WITH BEING OVERTLY SEXUAL AND THAT IS RACIST

I AM GLAD YOU AGREE WITH US

So does that make it OK when black artists do it? Surely if she's imitating other artists, some of who happen to be black, aren't they also to blame for "associating blackness with being overtly sexual"?

[Farnhamia]

Can we all at least agree that whoever did her hair should be killed as a warning to others?

Funny how you don't see her father out in public much these days, not that I follow country singers. I'd be in hiding, too.

[Releign]

Can we all at least agree that whoever did her hair should be killed as a warning to others?

Funny how you don't see her father out in public much these days, not that I follow country singers. I'd be in hiding, too.

I would hire a hitman if I was in that situation.

[Grenartia]

Am I the only one who fails to see how the performance was inherently racist?

[Releign]

Am I the only one who fails to see how the performance was inherently racist?

Have you read the other comments?
You have NO IDEA how many times the damn race card was pulled.

[Grenartia]

Am I the only one who fails to see how the performance was inherently racist?

Have you read the other comments?
You have NO IDEA how many times the damn race card was pulled.

No, I haven't, but I got a taste of the "its racist" bit in TET the other day.

[Releign]

Have you read the other comments?
You have NO IDEA how many times the damn race card was pulled.

No, I haven't, but I got a taste of the "its racist" bit in TET the other day.

Oh god it was turning into a cliche.
I mean, it could have just been "Yeah this is kind of racist", but they went with "BLEEEEEP BLEEP BLEEP RACIST BLEEEEEP BLEEEP BLEEP RACIST" per usual.

[Shamhnan Insir]

Forget any perceivable race issue, she has exposed herself to be entirely brain dead. Fed up of idiots being "role models" no matter what race they affiliate with.

[Lordieth]

Can we all at least agree that whoever did her hair should be killed as a warning to others?

Funny how you don't see her father out in public much these days, not that I follow country singers. I'd be in hiding, too.

He took two steps forward, two steps back, then took a running jump out of the nearest achy breaky window.

[The Andromeda Islands]

No, I haven't, but I got a taste of the "its racist" bit in TET the other day.

Oh god it was turning into a cliche.
I mean, it could have just been "Yeah this is kind of racist", but they went with "BLEEEEEP BLEEP BLEEP RACIST BLEEEEEP BLEEEP BLEEP RACIST" per usual.

I finally checked out parts of the performance a few minutes ago. I personally thought it was just sad.

Since Robin Thicke was wearing stripes, he should have blew a whistle, 'cause that performance was FOUL.

[Seperates]

She's never been a 'good' artist, if that's what you can even call her. The people behind her (Disney) were phenomenal at reading pop culture trends and insuring her relevance as a teen idol. However, now that she no longer has them, her actual talents show through.. and she is no more talented than any otheir kid with access to musical equipment and a lot of money to throw around. This most recent stint is nothing more than an attempt to regarner fame using the last bastion of the desperate pop idol... Any press is good press, purposfully utilizing the pearl-clutching moralists as a means to an end, counting on them to exaggerate and demonize her for actions that to anybody with any social depth understand to be fairly non-controversial.

If anything artiditc can be taken from her recent work, it is practically satirical of pop culture today, a boring and flaccid landscape of droning sounds and grinding, where the only thing to look forward to is a the next party that you go to, that all just become one long half remembered dream. But since neither the lyrics nor the artist have indicated this to be the case, I will stick with Time To Pretend as my angry anti-pop anthem.

[Nailed to the Perch]

THAT IS THE POINT

SHE IS ASSOCIATING BLACKNESS WITH BEING OVERTLY SEXUAL AND THAT IS RACIST

I AM GLAD YOU AGREE WITH US

So does that make it OK when black artists do it? Surely if she's imitating other artists, some of who happen to be black, aren't they also to blame for "associating blackness with being overtly sexual"?

A black person being sexual is not intrinsically associating their sexualization with their race. A white person playacting blackness in a manner that boils down to, "look at me! I'm being black! I wear grills and have a big booty and make gang signs, like a black person!" is. That doesn't mean that black performers can't exploit those same sexist and racist stereotypes, but it does mean that's a different issue than appropriation in a racist manner.

The thing is, beyond the reductive nature of Ms. Cyrus's portrayal of "blackness," it also matters that it is fundamentally a persona that she can adopt and take off at will. To quote from a pretty good article on the subject:

What Miley is doing is cultural appropriation. She, a wealthy white woman, is taking elements from black culture in order to achieve a specific image. Her status as a member of a traditionally oppressive race and class means that she is able to pick and choose what parts of black culture she wants to embrace without having to deal with the racism and racialization that black women live with every day. In short, she can imagine that she is being "ghetto" without having any concept of what living in a ghetto would really mean.

Miley is doing her best to promote herself as a part of rachet culture, which Jody Rosen describes as "the potent sexual symbolism of black female bodies," while simultaneously treating the black women in her videos and performances as props. She is taking elements of black culture and using them to give her the patina of street cred that she wants so badly. She is playing at being black without even trying to understand what the lived experience of being black really is. She is appropriating cultural elements without taking any time to reflect on her position of privilege and how her use of the term "ratchet" or her twerking are contributing to the oppression of black people.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/anne-theri ... _hp_ref=tw

Or, to make the point in a tl;dr version, this tweet someone quoted on my facebook page today:

Miley sticks middle finger up in pics, smokes & wears grills = just her being a kid. Trayvon does it = hes a thug

You can't just erase her whiteness here, anymore than one can claim that a white person using the N word has no different impact then when a black person uses it.

[Aravea]

Since when did the VMAs become a strip club...oh wait it always was

[Occupied Deutschland]

I blame anyone who bothered to listen to Miley Cyrus in the first place. It should be standard policy NOT to listen to 'artists' who got their start on the Disney channel (especially when said 'artist' is the daughter of a certain line-dancing holy-fuck-dude-you-and-that-fucking-achy-breaky-heart-song-of-yours-killed-country 'artist' like Billy Ray Cyrus).

[Forsakia]

THAT IS THE POINT

SHE IS ASSOCIATING BLACKNESS WITH BEING OVERTLY SEXUAL AND THAT IS RACIST

I AM GLAD YOU AGREE WITH US

Yup. I think trying to explain the sociological implications of fetishizing black women's bodies (and specifically their bottoms) while connecting those bodies to out-of-control, animalistic sexuality may go a bit over the heads of NSG, though. On this site, "there is a black woman there whose entire function in the performance is to be a large ass for Ms. Cyrus to smack" cannot possibly count as racially insensitive unless Cyrus follows it up by saying, "ALSO I AM TOTALLY RACIST, Y'ALL. FUCK BLACK PEOPLE, TEE HEE."

Yes, but that description covers a good chunk of music videos of the last 20 years.

Which doesn't mean it's ok, but suggests that the outrage is as much about who she is as what she actually did.

[Occupied Deutschland]

So does that make it OK when black artists do it? Surely if she's imitating other artists, some of who happen to be black, aren't they also to blame for "associating blackness with being overtly sexual"?

A black person being sexual is not intrinsically associating their sexualization with their race. A white person playacting blackness in a manner that boils down to, "look at me! I'm being black! I wear grills and have a big booty and make gang signs, like a black person!" is. That doesn't mean that black performers can't exploit those same sexist and racist stereotypes, but it does mean that's a different issue than appropriation in a racist manner.

The thing is, beyond the reductive nature of Ms. Cyrus's portrayal of "blackness," it also matters that it is fundamentally a persona that she can adopt and take off at will. To quote from a pretty good article on the subject:

What Miley is doing is cultural appropriation. She, a wealthy white woman, is taking elements from black culture in order to achieve a specific image. Her status as a member of a traditionally oppressive race and class means that she is able to pick and choose what parts of black culture she wants to embrace without having to deal with the racism and racialization that black women live with every day. In short, she can imagine that she is being "ghetto" without having any concept of what living in a ghetto would really mean.

Miley is doing her best to promote herself as a part of rachet culture, which Jody Rosen describes as "the potent sexual symbolism of black female bodies," while simultaneously treating the black women in her videos and performances as props. She is taking elements of black culture and using them to give her the patina of street cred that she wants so badly. She is playing at being black without even trying to understand what the lived experience of being black really is. She is appropriating cultural elements without taking any time to reflect on her position of privilege and how her use of the term "ratchet" or her twerking are contributing to the oppression of black people.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/anne-theri ... _hp_ref=tw

Or, to make the point in a tl;dr version, this tweet someone quoted on my facebook page today:

Miley sticks middle finger up in pics, smokes & wears grills = just her being a kid. Trayvon does it = hes a thug

You can't just erase her whiteness here, anymore than one can claim that a white person using the N word has no different impact then when a black person uses it.

This debate was a lot more fun when it revolved around Eminem.

[Thanatttynia]

Can we all at least agree that whoever did her hair should be killed as a warning to others?

I like it.

[Gauthier]

A desperate cry for help if anyone ever saw one.

[Nailed to the Perch]

Yup. I think trying to explain the sociological implications of fetishizing black women's bodies (and specifically their bottoms) while connecting those bodies to out-of-control, animalistic sexuality may go a bit over the heads of NSG, though. On this site, "there is a black woman there whose entire function in the performance is to be a large ass for Ms. Cyrus to smack" cannot possibly count as racially insensitive unless Cyrus follows it up by saying, "ALSO I AM TOTALLY RACIST, Y'ALL. FUCK BLACK PEOPLE, TEE HEE."

Yes, but that description covers a good chunk of music videos of the last 20 years.

Which doesn't mean it's ok, but suggests that the outrage is as much about who she is as what she actually did.

Oh, it absolutely does. The trope of black-woman-as-jezebel is incredibly common in our culture in general and in music videos in particular. That said, the people who get frustrated with that, mostly black women, have been outraged about it all along. People are just paying slightly more attention to them than usual, because they're able to piggyback on the much larger contingent of people shrieking about how a girl had the temerity to grow into an attractive young woman and then behave precisely the way we demand that attractive young women behave.

[Thanatttynia]

Since Robin Thicke was wearing stripes, he should have blew a whistle, 'cause that performance was FOUL.

sick burn bro

I blame anyone who bothered to listen to Miley Cyrus in the first place. It should be standard policy NOT to listen to 'artists' who got their start on the Disney channel (especially when said 'artist' is the daughter of a certain line-dancing holy-fuck-dude-you-and-that-fucking-achy-breaky-heart-song-of-yours-killed-country 'artist' like Billy Ray Cyrus).

Why? There is no reason that a former Disney Channel star cannot produce good music.

[Occupied Deutschland]

Why? There is no reason that a former Disney Channel star cannot produce good music.

You're right.
But I haven't seen any evidence that any of them HAVE produced good music, so...

[Forsakia]

Yes, but that description covers a good chunk of music videos of the last 20 years.

Which doesn't mean it's ok, but suggests that the outrage is as much about who she is as what she actually did.

Oh, it absolutely does. The trope of black-woman-as-jezebel is incredibly common in our culture in general and in music videos in particular. That said, the people who get frustrated with that, mostly black women, have been outraged about it all along. People are just paying slightly more attention to them than usual, because they're able to piggyback on the much larger contingent of people shrieking about how a girl had the temerity to grow into an attractive young woman and then behave precisely the way we demand that attractive young women behave.

How far are you going with your cultural appropriation line? In terms of the article you quoted talking about twerking as a cultural element that she's appropriating?

[Gauthier]

Why? There is no reason that a former Disney Channel star cannot produce good music.

You're right.
But I haven't seen any evidence that any of them HAVE produced good music, so...

Disney is a Muzak Factory. If you spend a decade long career singing saccharine tailored-for-preteens tunes and end up making good music without being a drug-addicted burnout it's a miracle. Hell, there's a popular theory online that Miley Cyrus's sluttacular is an attempt on her part to completely burn off the Disney taint.

[Thanatttynia]

Why? There is no reason that a former Disney Channel star cannot produce good music.

You're right.
But I haven't seen any evidence that any of them HAVE produced good music, so...

I like Miley Cyrus' song *runs off stage dodging tomatoes*

Your definition of 'good music' can be totally different to another persons definition of it.

[New England and The Maritimes]

THAT IS THE POINT

SHE IS ASSOCIATING BLACKNESS WITH BEING OVERTLY SEXUAL AND THAT IS RACIST

I AM GLAD YOU AGREE WITH US

Yup. I think trying to explain the sociological implications of fetishizing black women's bodies (and specifically their bottoms) while connecting those bodies to out-of-control, animalistic sexuality may go a bit over the heads of NSG, though. On this site, "there is a black woman there whose entire function in the performance is to be a large ass for Ms. Cyrus to smack" cannot possibly count as racially insensitive unless Cyrus follows it up by saying, "ALSO I AM TOTALLY RACIST, Y'ALL. FUCK BLACK PEOPLE, TEE HEE."

C'mon people, sociological analysis isn't exactly the same as teaching yourself ancient Egyptian. Take even one class and you can understand this stuff just fine.