Russia - Gay Rights - Sochi Olympics Megathread

[Agritum]

Sure, the moment you're discriminated against for thousands of years based off of your sexual orientation and want to make people aware of your struggle for the same respect and equality others have.

If they can have parades, we should be able to as well, years of suffering or not. It's free speech, even if it is completely unnecessary.

You can have them just as people can criticize them for being stupid.

Free speech is a double edged sword, yo.

[Liriena]

How come that there is no thread about Guantanamo bay and how come that there is no NGOs in the US making protests against it?

Yet, Putin is the dictator and Obama is a an angel.

This is beautiful. I explain that Tu Quoque is a fallacy, and yet you commit it again.

He doesn't care. He'll keep parroting it until someone falls for it.

[The Norgan Alliance]

If a white woman and a black man started running through the south kissing wouldn't you think that the only result from the southern people is to throw them in jail and strengthen their defenses against the people "imposing" laws on them?

So you're saying laws should not be imposed on people?

What I said is that there are better ways of dealing with this than to publicly break their laws.

[Liriena]

Maybe so, but it's a lousy argument against publicly advocating for the human rights of a minority. Whether the majority likes it or not is irrelevant. Human rights are not suspended just because the majority of a nation's population are mentally ill and uneducated.

What I mean is that there are better ways of dealing with this than making the next Olympics "Fabulous".

Such as...what?

[Caecuser]

Maybe so, but it's a lousy argument against publicly advocating for the human rights of a minority. Whether the majority likes it or not is irrelevant. Human rights are not suspended just because the majority of a nation's population are mentally ill and uneducated.

What I mean is that there are better ways of dealing with this than making the next Olympics "Fabulous".

What would you suggest?

[Solaray]

If they can have parades, we should be able to as well, years of suffering or not. It's free speech, even if it is completely unnecessary.

You can have them just as people can criticize them for being stupid.

Free speech is a double edged sword, yo.

Sure thing, it'd be blast, so it's worth it. Those gay pride parades are always such sausagefests anyway.

[Agritum]

So you're saying laws should not be imposed on people?

What I said is that there are better ways of dealing with this than to publicly break their laws.

Ever heard of Civil Disobedience?

I'll name an important example of it: Rosa Parks.

[Virana]

The US committing human rights abuse doesn't eliminate the fact that Russia is doing the same.

Tu Quoque is a logical fallacy.

How come that there is no thread about Guantanamo bay and how come that there is no NGOs in the US making protests against it?

Yet, Putin is the dictator and Obama is a an angel.

There are plenty of US-based NGOs protesting against Gitmo. It's one of the reasons Obama has said countless amount of times (yet, as with many of his other promises, fallen short of fulfilling) that he'll close Gitmo.

As someone else mentioned, you're committing a major logical fallacy in assuming that Agritum is excusing US human rights abuses just because he's focusing on Russia's.

What I said is that there are better ways of dealing with this than to publicly break their laws.

Ever heard of Civil Disobedience?

I'll name an important example of it: Rosa Parks.

Perhaps an even bigger player of the same movement, Martin Luther King, Jr. strikes a bell.

[Bodobol]

Sure, the moment you're discriminated against for thousands of years based off of your sexual orientation and want to make people aware of your struggle for the same respect and equality others have.

If they can have parades, we should be able to as well, years of suffering or not. It's free speech, even if it is completely unnecessary.

I agree that you should be perfectly allowed to hold straight pride parades; apologies if my post seemed contrary to that. However, I believe that we should have the ability to call you out as a homophobe and bigot if you do so.

[Solaray]

What I mean is that there are better ways of dealing with this than making the next Olympics "Fabulous".

Such as...what?

Displaying international outrage. Diplomatic hullaballoo. UN related stuff. Better than some childish nonsense.

[The Norgan Alliance]

What I mean is that there are better ways of dealing with this than making the next Olympics "Fabulous".

Such as...what?

Such as diplomatic talks, trade sanctions, war. I never said these were good things, but they are most certainly better as most likely they will actually make a difference.

[Solaray]

If they can have parades, we should be able to as well, years of suffering or not. It's free speech, even if it is completely unnecessary.

I agree that you should be perfectly allowed to hold straight pride parades; apologies if my post seemed contrary to that. However, I believe that we should have the ability to call you out as a homophobe and bigot if you do so.

It's not homophobic or bigoted to hold pride in being straight.

[Scholencia]

Russia saved Europe fron fascism and liberals should respect more that country. It has a right to do what it wants on its territory. If the US can have Guantanamo than liberals should not s.

Without Russia (battle of Stalingrad, Kursk and so on) the Allies would hardly defeat the Nazis because ussr contributed more in term of clashes. The mentality of the Soviet soldiers and people was not different and thoose of moder-day Russians. It is obvious that homophobia, communism, anti-fascism and all what Stalin represented liberated the World of Nazism.

Going against modern-day Russia is also as going against against anti-fascism.

[The Norgan Alliance]

Ever heard of Civil Disobedience?

I'll name an important example of it: Rosa Parks.

Perhaps an even bigger player of the same movement, Martin Luther King, Jr. strikes a bell.

The main difference is that he's not running around breaking laws, he did most all of his things legally and peacefully.

[Bodobol]

I agree that you should be perfectly allowed to hold straight pride parades; apologies if my post seemed contrary to that. However, I believe that we should have the ability to call you out as a homophobe and bigot if you do so.

It's not homophobic or bigoted to hold pride in being straight.

True, but if you're doing it for the sole purpose of getting annoyed with gay pride parades, then it is homophobic and bigoted.

Anyway, I'm going to go do my homework now. Goodbye.

[Caecuser]

Without Russia (battle of Stalingrad, Kursk and so on) the Allies would hardly defeat the Nazis because ussr contributed more in term of clashes. The mentality of the Soviet soldiers and people was not different and thoose of moder-day Russians. It is obvious that homophobia, communism, anti-fascism and all what Stalin represented liberated the World of Nazism.

Going against modern-day Russia is also as going against against anti-fascism.

Why should we care?

[The Norgan Alliance]

Without Russia (battle of Stalingrad, Kursk and so on) the Allies would hardly defeat the Nazis because ussr contributed more in term of clashes. The mentality of the Soviet soldiers and people was not different and thoose of moder-day Russians. It is obvious that homophobia, communism, anti-fascism and all what Stalin represented liberated the World of Nazism.

Going against modern-day Russia is also as going against against anti-fascism.

You're completely forgetting the US, and going against Russia is NOT going against anti-fascism. Is going against the US going against freedom?

[Virana]

Perhaps an even bigger player of the same movement, Martin Luther King, Jr. strikes a bell.

The main difference is that he's not running around breaking laws, he did most all of his things legally and peacefully.

Hence the point: civil disobedience.

[San-Silvacian]

wtf is this oping go to war with russia

LOL

you aren't serious, are you?

[Agritum]

Perhaps an even bigger player of the same movement, Martin Luther King, Jr. strikes a bell.

The main difference is that he's not running around breaking laws, he did most all of his things legally and peacefully.

Rosa Parks broke a law. And yet she is seen as an icon of the Civil Rights Movement.

Guess why?

[Sommorragh]

I agree that you should be perfectly allowed to hold straight pride parades; apologies if my post seemed contrary to that. However, I believe that we should have the ability to call you out as a homophobe and bigot if you do so.

It's not homophobic or bigoted to hold pride in being straight.

Yup. Unless you're talking about hubris, in which case you don't pay much attention to a portion of the LGBTQ community.

[Spoder]

I remember how they were showing videos of people pouring out what they called Russian Vodka on the street to show their support of gays in Russia. If you looked closely, you could see that when they open the bottles, the seals are already broken. Vodka indeed. More like "Watka."

[Kouralia]

The main difference is that he's not running around breaking laws, he did most all of his things legally and peacefully.

Rosa Parks broke a law. And yet she is seen as an icon of the Civil Rights Movement.

Guess why?

Female.

*nods*

[Bodobol]

Without Russia (battle of Stalingrad, Kursk and so on) the Allies would hardly defeat the Nazis because ussr contributed more in term of clashes. The mentality of the Soviet soldiers and people was not different and thoose of moder-day Russians. It is obvious that homophobia, communism, anti-fascism and all what Stalin represented liberated the World of Nazism.

Going against modern-day Russia is also as going against against anti-fascism.

No; The Allies had a strong chance of winning without Russia. While it would be blatantly false to say they weren't a major contributor to the Allied side of the war, Germany would have eventually run dangerously short on resources, and Hitler's rapid land expansion would still have been his downfall. But let's not continue the threadjack, mmkay? TG me if you want to continue this debate, but I'll probably be offline for the next 30 minutes or so.

[Liriena]

Without Russia (battle of Stalingrad, Kursk and so on) the Allies would hardly defeat the Nazis because ussr contributed more in term of clashes. The mentality of the Soviet soldiers and people was not different and thoose of moder-day Russians. It is obvious that homophobia, communism, anti-fascism and all what Stalin represented liberated the World of Nazism.

Going against modern-day Russia is also as going against against anti-fascism.
Irrelevant bullshit that is not really a valid argument against protesting the violation of LGBT people's human rights in the Russian Federation.

Fixed.

Stop threadjacking right fucking now.