Anarchism

[Olivaero]

Anarchism is impossible on a large scale whilst there are people who don't want to live in an Anarchy. In small communes no doubt. But from what I've seen thats no where near what Anarchists aim for.

[Zerlos]

How does economy work in an anarchic society? Why would you spend 20 years studying to become a doctor if there is no law saying I can just take what I want from someone else? This would of course then lead into violent crime and so on and choas would ensue until a powerful person or group of people rose to power forming a new government anyway. Anarchy isn't a way to run a country it's a way a country runs until it gets a government.

[Agorya]

Terrible. Anarcho-Anything is stupid, unrealistic, and dangerous.

What about Anarcho Statism?

BTW guys, do Anarcho Capitalists exist anywhere besides the internet?

I saw a picture which had an anarcho-capitalist flag at a Tea Party rally.

The tea partiers can have that moron.

I don't really like anarcho-primitivists, myself. How is society suppose to function with everybody living like animals?

[Threlizdun]

Anarchism is the destination for the search for the most of the most moral system in which to govern society.

How does economy work in an anarchic society? Why would you spend 20 years studying to become a doctor if there is no law saying I can just take what I want from someone else? This would of course then lead into violent crime and so on and choas would ensue until a powerful person or group of people rose to power forming a new government anyway. Anarchy isn't a way to run a country it's a way a country runs until it gets a government.

No anarchist that has spent over a minute contemplating their ideology opposes the existence of governments or laws. The lack of social hierarchies does not mean we support a society that operates on the principles of every man for himself.

[Meryuma]

A horrible ideology that is just a step or two above fascism. That's my opinion on anarchism. At least on a large scale. On a small scale I think anarchism, like communism, can work. Nothing larger than your average-sized medieval village, though.

Let me guess: you think "large-scale anarchy" is the same thing as failed states? In any case, anarchism should start at the level of individual communities.

Arachnism is stupid and inevitably leads to tyranny.

Assertion time!

[Olivaero]

How does economy work in an anarchic society? Why would you spend 20 years studying to become a doctor if there is no law saying I can just take what I want from someone else? This would of course then lead into violent crime and so on and choas would ensue until a powerful person or group of people rose to power forming a new government anyway. Anarchy isn't a way to run a country it's a way a country runs until it gets a government.

Anarchism has many answers to the Economic question, a An-Cap would say the employer would have the responsibility to vet it's employee's if they wanted to keep up a reputation in this case for excellent medical care a anarcho-communist would probably say that the community would recognize a good doctor and invest him with the responsibilities thereof.

The ways of making sure things don't break down into complete chaos depend really on what type of anarchy we are talking, I personally don't believe they are tenable without complete agreement with those living in but that's not to say if everyone in the society accepted the premise it couldn't work.

[Threlizdun]

Anarchism has many answers to the Economic question, a An-Cap would say the employer would have the responsibility to vet it's employee's if they wanted to keep up a reputation in this case for excellent medical care

"Anarcho-capitalists" are irrelevent to this conversation because one cannot be both an anarchist and a capitalist.

The ways of making sure things don't break down into complete chaos depend really on what type of anarchy we are talking, I personally don't believe they are tenable without complete agreement with those living in but that's not to say if everyone in the society accepted the premise it couldn't work.

Ultimately any economic system that does not incorporate the use of hierarchies is compatible with anarchism, though I have yet to see a system that better represents this opposition to hierarchy better than communism.

[Blasveck]

Question:

In anarchic society, what is going to prevent power heirarchies from forming?

[Genivaria]

Direct Democracy ON THE LOCAL LEVEL appeals to me, but Representatives are required at some point.

[Threlizdun]

Question:

In anarchic society, what is going to prevent power heirarchies from forming?

Presumably laws would be instated to prevent others from taking power in such a manner, just as we have laws in place today that prevent people from trying to otherthrow the government and establish themselves as leaders. However, I can't see it being a major threat, as hierarchies are not simply about elevating some, but oppressing others. Many people would have to accept their position below this individual in order for them to succeed. If they are comfortable with their position in society, which much be the case for anarchism to work, then they would have no reason to do this.

[Agorya]

Question:

In anarchic society, what is going to prevent power heirarchies from forming?

This is simple: There wouldn't be any need for hierarchies since the free market would make demand for it very low. Most codes would be moral and ethical ones, and the actual legal codes would be enforced by private competitors for the Law industry.

[Gernonai]

Question:

In anarchic society, what is going to prevent power heirarchies from forming?

The people having an agreement that they are all equal and that they will all work together for the common good. It does require people to sort of ignore their instincts to be greedy and lazy to help themselves and their neighbors.

[The Parkus Empire]

Anarchism is the destination for the search for the most of the most moral system in which to govern society.

How does economy work in an anarchic society? Why would you spend 20 years studying to become a doctor if there is no law saying I can just take what I want from someone else? This would of course then lead into violent crime and so on and choas would ensue until a powerful person or group of people rose to power forming a new government anyway. Anarchy isn't a way to run a country it's a way a country runs until it gets a government.

No anarchist that has spent over a minute contemplating their ideology opposes the existence of governments or laws. The lack of social hierarchies does not mean we support a society that operates on the principles of every man for himself.

Rule of law would still be rule, would it not?

[Blasveck]

Question:

In anarchic society, what is going to prevent power heirarchies from forming?

This is simple: There wouldn't be any need for hierarchies since the free market would make demand for it very low. Most codes would be moral and ethical ones, and the actual legal codes would be enforced by private competitors for the Law industry.

I hear this a lot from An-Caps, that Ancapism is the most moral system.
Morality is inherently subjective.

Also, what makes the state illegitimate?

[Agorya]

Anarchism is the destination for the search for the most of the most moral system in which to govern society.

No anarchist that has spent over a minute contemplating their ideology opposes the existence of governments or laws. The lack of social hierarchies does not mean we support a society that operates on the principles of every man for himself.

Rule of law would still be rule, would it not?

Only if you *ask* for it, and it cannot be forced upon you without consent.

[Ironcastle]

I despise the idea of a society without laws. It would lead to a complete breakdown in order, the disruption of all services and a ruined economy. While it may work in a village or small town scale, it has never worked in the large scale. I mean, just look at Somalia! After having no government for such a long time, the vast majority of people there love in complete poverty, under the warlords who have taken control. The only way anarchism could work is if human nature itself was changed, and we all weren't as selfish and greedy.

[The Parkus Empire]

Rule of law would still be rule, would it not?

Only if you *ask* for it, and it cannot be forced upon you without consent.

Then it's pointless.

[Genivaria]

Question:

In anarchic society, what is going to prevent power heirarchies from forming?

This is simple: There wouldn't be any need for hierarchies since the free market would make demand for it very low. Most codes would be moral and ethical ones, and the actual legal codes would be enforced by private competitors for the Law industry.

That's nice but what happens when someone simply WANTS to.
You say it wouldn't happen but for the sake of argument lets say it did, what then.

[Threlizdun]

Direct Democracy ON THE LOCAL LEVEL appeals to me, but Representatives are required at some point.

I have no issue with representatives, as long as the people are still ultimately responsible for the running of affairs. If say there was an emergency that affected several people, then it would seem reasonable to elect representatives for your community to meet with others and discuss the issue at hand. The representative could stay in contact with their community and rely the decisions of their community to the council. This individual would represent them, but ultimately it would be the people themselves who would actually decide what is to be done. No individual is given more authority than anyone else.

[Blasveck]

Rule of law would still be rule, would it not?

Only if you *ask* for it, and it cannot be forced upon you without consent.

It can, if you have enough manpower.

Might makes the ability to make something right or wrong.

[The Parkus Empire]

I despise the idea of a society without laws. It would lead to a complete breakdown in order, the disruption of all services and a ruined economy. While it may work in a village or small town scale, it has never worked in the large scale. I mean, just look at Somalia! After having no government for such a long time, the vast majority of people there love in complete poverty, under the warlords who have taken control. The only way anarchism could work is if human nature itself was changed, and we all weren't as selfish and greedy.

I don't know if you can make Somalia synonymous with anarchy, any more than you can make North Korea synonymous with statism. A better example might be Kowloon

[Genivaria]

Rule of law would still be rule, would it not?

Only if you *ask* for it, and it cannot be forced upon you without consent.

And what happens when a group of people who do use force stumble upon your little utopia? Ask them nicely to go away?

[Gernonai]

I despise the idea of a society without laws. It would lead to a complete breakdown in order, the disruption of all services and a ruined economy. While it may work in a village or small town scale, it has never worked in the large scale. I mean, just look at Somalia! After having no government for such a long time, the vast majority of people there love in complete poverty, under the warlords who have taken control. The only way anarchism could work is if human nature itself was changed, and we all weren't as selfish and greedy.

Somalia is only anarchy by the dictionary definition, "chaos". In actuality it is a number of warlords vying for power and seizing the resources of the nation by force.

[Blasveck]

Only if you *ask* for it, and it cannot be forced upon you without consent.

And what happens when a group of people who do use force stumble upon your little utopia? Ask them nicely to go away?

From an anarchist viewpoint, doesn't the state do that anyway?

[Ostroeuropa]

I hold two mutually exclusive views of anarchism depending on my mood, that are functionally the same view on anarchism.

1. All systems are anarchism, there is only anarchism.
2. All anarchisms have a system, there is no anarchism.

I'm prepared to defend either of these claims.
Functionally speaking, there is absolutely no difference between our current system and an anarchy where one gang has gotten particularly powerful. So we might be an anarchy.
OR, that might mean that anarchy simply isn't possible, and necessarily degrades into a form of government.