NSG Culture and the rules

[Ostroeuropa]

We spend a lot of time talking about the culture of various places and I thought it may be interesting to have a moment of introspection and talk about the culture of NSG.
Something i'm especially interested in discussing is the part the rules play on the culture, but this thread can be used to discuss anything about the culture really.
I've seen people break the rules plenty of times. People who obviously know they are doing it. And yet nobody reports them (so I can't talk. I've done this too and benefited from it.) I'm wondering why it is that people are so willing to report some people, but unwilling to report others.
I've noticed that there seems to be a very strong connection to post count. People with higher post counts tend to go underreported.
The reason I don't bother reporting people used to be that I didn't care about occasional rule violations by persons.
The reason I am pretty confident if flaming or something in particular threads is based around this too. People simply seem to not care anymore about the rules, provided you have over 5000 posts. I don't do it often, but sometimes.
You can admit to having broken the rules in this thread, provided it isn't a recent event. A moderator has confirmed that confession to violations that occured in the past are not in themselves actionable.
Do you agree that the rules go largely unenforced?
Do you agree with me that this is largely our fault for failing to report the vast majority of violations?

As a second point of discussion, how do you feel about the debating culture of NSG?
Are certain tropes and memes being present a good thing or a bad thing?
I do happen to like that people here are vaguely aware of logical fallacies.

[Czechanada]

I've never really understood the necessity of flaming, as well as the persecution of flaming and trolling. I've never flamed, nor do I care if others flame me.

[Saruhan]

I once got warned for flaming because someone read something innocent wrong, but that's about it

[Zweite Alaje]

Whether you get reported or not is a matter of how many enemies you have here and how much they hate you. It's pretty much a popularity contest here.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

I got warned for flaming by personally insulting a very problematic user. Just it. I think I write a lot of things that aren't really PG-13, but then I think it is content that wouldn't hurt any adolescent.

I think this environment is pretty nice and safe.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Whether you get reported or not is a matter of how many enemies you have here and how much they hate you. It's pretty much a popularity contest here.

If you say this, you are probably pretty hated, then. I can't understand how someone would, even with extreme views sometimes and we disagreeing a lot in almost anything involving the liberal x conservative culture war, I love you.

[Temujinn]

The Rules are Selectively enforced, and have been since 2003.

[The Parkus Empire]

Whether you get reported or not is a matter of how many enemies you have here and how much they hate you. It's pretty much a popularity contest here.

It's more a matter of whether or not the recipient is a snitch.

[Ostroeuropa]

Whether you get reported or not is a matter of how many enemies you have here and how much they hate you. It's pretty much a popularity contest here.

It's more a matter of whether or not the recipient is a snitch.

See, it's this mentality that makes underreporting a phemonanae...
But if thats the general attitude of the forums, then shouldn't we just be clear about it and scrap the rules in the first place?
Whats the point in having the rules if people are seen poorly for reporting?

[Frisivisia]

You should rename this thread "Complain About Getting Banned/Warned That One Time Wah Wah The Mods Are So Unfair 2013".

[Ashmoria]

moderators arent patrol officers (for the most part) so they dont punish violations that arent brought to their attention. annoying people get reported more than non-annoying people.

i try to stay out of it.

[Czechanada]

It's more a matter of whether or not the recipient is a snitch.

See, it's this mentality that makes underreporting a phemonanae...
But if thats the general attitude of the forums, then shouldn't we just be clear about it and scrap the rules in the first place?
Whats the point in having the rules if people are seen poorly for reporting?

That stigma exists on NS? I never knew that.

[Ostroeuropa]

You should rename this thread "Complain About Getting Banned/Warned That One Time Wah Wah The Mods Are So Unfair 2013".

That's the thing though, i'm not complaining about the times i've been caught.
I'm not blaming the mods.
I'm asking why nobody bothers to report unless they have an axe to grind.
If anything, i'm complaining about the times I wasn't warned, as well as complaining about the times others got away with it.
The mods aren't superhuman, they can't realistically catch rule violations if noone reports them.
But thats the thing, nobody reports.

[Ostroeuropa]

moderators arent patrol officers (for the most part) so they dont punish violations that arent brought to their attention. annoying people get reported more than non-annoying people.

i try to stay out of it.

Sure, that's my perception too.
But then why don't we cut the bullshit and admit that we don't actually care about the rules and have them altered to better reflect what people actually care about.
What, functionally, is the difference between ignoring someone who flames because you agree with them, but reporting someone who flames because you disagree, and just reporting them for disagreeing?

[The Parkus Empire]

See, it's this mentality that makes underreporting a phemonanae...

That's not a problem.

But if thats the general attitude of the forums, then shouldn't we just be clear about it and scrap the rules in the first place?

It's not our site, it's Max Barry's.

Whats the point in having the rules if people are seen poorly for reporting?

They function as a deterrent, and shit gets picked up without reporting all the time. Not to say that there aren't occasions where reporting is nice, such as an account that solely exists to post shock shit.

[Ashmoria]

You should rename this thread "Complain About Getting Banned/Warned That One Time Wah Wah The Mods Are So Unfair 2013".

That's the thing though, i'm not complaining about the times i've been caught.
I'm not blaming the mods.
I'm asking why nobody bothers to report unless they have an axe to grind.
If anything, i'm complaining about the times I wasn't warned, as well as complaining about the times others got away with it.
The mods aren't superhuman, they can't realistically catch rule violations if noone reports them.
But thats the thing, nobody reports.

no one wants to be on a forum where every freaking infraction is reported.

so we only report annoying people.

[Frisivisia]

You should rename this thread "Complain About Getting Banned/Warned That One Time Wah Wah The Mods Are So Unfair 2013".

That's the thing though, i'm not complaining about the times i've been caught.
I'm not blaming the mods.
I'm asking why nobody bothers to report unless they have an axe to grind.
If anything, i'm complaining about the times I wasn't warned, as well as complaining about the times others got away with it.
The mods aren't superhuman, they can't realistically catch rule violations if noone reports them.
But thats the thing, nobody reports.

Because people don't really care, if it's not a major infraction and it's not somebody you'd like to see no longer on the forums for a few days, there's no use.

[Ashmoria]

moderators arent patrol officers (for the most part) so they dont punish violations that arent brought to their attention. annoying people get reported more than non-annoying people.

i try to stay out of it.

Sure, that's my perception too.
But then why don't we cut the bullshit and admit that we don't actually care about the rules and have them altered to better reflect what people actually care about.
What, functionally, is the difference between ignoring someone who flames because you agree with them, but reporting someone who flames because you disagree, and just reporting them for disagreeing?

because many people care about the rules.

and ... its important to have a way to get rid of annoying people lest they destroy your site.

[Ostroeuropa]

Sure, that's my perception too.
But then why don't we cut the bullshit and admit that we don't actually care about the rules and have them altered to better reflect what people actually care about.
What, functionally, is the difference between ignoring someone who flames because you agree with them, but reporting someone who flames because you disagree, and just reporting them for disagreeing?

because many people care about the rules.

and ... its important to have a way to get rid of annoying people lest they destroy your site.

It's just rustling my jimmies
I'm a big fan of you know, the rule of law and due process and all that shit. And even though it's just a forum, it's a forum that is at least nominally fairly big on people voicing their opinion.
The idea that someone can be banned for effectively, just voicing the "wrong" opinions, despite performing the exact same rule violations as someone with the "right" opinion, pisses me off.
That's functionally what happens.
The only ethically consistent action is to report ALL violations.

[Frisivisia]

because many people care about the rules.

and ... its important to have a way to get rid of annoying people lest they destroy your site.

It's just rustling my jimmies
I'm a big fan of you know, the rule of law and due process and all that shit. And even though it's just a forum, it's a forum that is at least nominally fairly big on people voicing their opinion.
The idea that someone can be banned for effectively, just voicing the "wrong" opinions, despite performing the exact same rule violations as someone with the "right" opinion, pisses me off.

So it is "Complain About Getting Banned/Warned That One Time Wah Wah The Mods Are So Unfair 2013".

[Souseiseki]

I'm wondering why it is that people are so willing to report some people, but unwilling to report others.

obviously, the person who is being reported and who is reporting can play a part. i've found myself put in the awkward position of having to report someone i kinda like and who basically on my side because they won't stop being tits towards organizations i hate. but i think most of it is basically some sort of jury nullification except for reporting. (or enjoying it.)

[Ostroeuropa]

It's just rustling my jimmies
I'm a big fan of you know, the rule of law and due process and all that shit. And even though it's just a forum, it's a forum that is at least nominally fairly big on people voicing their opinion.
The idea that someone can be banned for effectively, just voicing the "wrong" opinions, despite performing the exact same rule violations as someone with the "right" opinion, pisses me off.

So it is "Complain About Getting Banned/Warned That One Time Wah Wah The Mods Are So Unfair 2013".

Not really. I'm unlikely to be banned or warned for another few months. It's more of an abstract jimmy rustling on behalf of the nutters with insane opinions.

[The Parkus Empire]

moderators arent patrol officers (for the most part) so they dont punish violations that arent brought to their attention. annoying people get reported more than non-annoying people.

i try to stay out of it.

Sure, that's my perception too.
But then why don't we cut the bullshit and admit that we don't actually care about the rules and have them altered to better reflect what people actually care about.
What, functionally, is the difference between ignoring someone who flames because you agree with them, but reporting someone who flames because you disagree, and just reporting them for disagreeing?

I don't know if it works like that so much. I don't report anyone for flaming me, and I don't think someone who agreed with me would be too likely to do it, unless it was in jest. I think it's more a matter of someone who continues to flame in infantile ways designed to provoke, or someone who doesn't even argue but just flames--I'd say those people are a problem, but just losing your temper now and again isn't a big deal unless it results in a flame war. If someone calls you a shithead, that's immature, yeah. If you complain and want them to be banned because it hurt your feelings, that's even more immature.

[Ostroeuropa]

I'm wondering why it is that people are so willing to report some people, but unwilling to report others.

obviously, the person who is being reported and who is reporting can play a part. i've found myself put in the awkward position of having to report someone i kinda like and who basically on my side because they won't stop being tits towards organizations i hate. but i think most of it is basically some sort of jury nullification except for reporting. (or enjoying it.)

I've noticed a lot of it is reciprocal too.
We probably break rules at eachother all the time, but since neither of us report it...neither of us report it.

[The Parkus Empire]

because many people care about the rules.

and ... its important to have a way to get rid of annoying people lest they destroy your site.

It's just rustling my jimmies
I'm a big fan of you know, the rule of law and due process and all that shit. And even though it's just a forum, it's a forum that is at least nominally fairly big on people voicing their opinion.
The idea that someone can be banned for effectively, just voicing the "wrong" opinions, despite performing the exact same rule violations as someone with the "right" opinion, pisses me off.
That's functionally what happens.
The only ethically consistent action is to report ALL violations.

So you're one of those people who rats his friends out for having pot? Or underage drinking?