Sexism in video games.

[Dakini]

I retract my statement.

Now, what did we learn?

I like how he tried claiming he was well-informed on the subject and thought that anyone believed him before he posted a statement that two seconds on google could disprove.


Well, in case anyone was gullible before..

[Dakini]

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/566 ... ideo-games

I do have a feeling something is morally wrong with requesting money for "research" when all she's really doing is buying video games. Research my ass. She could go on YouTube and do just as much research with those "let's play" thingies.

She's a media critic. Her job involves consuming media and critically analyzing it. She decided to release these for free online so everyone could have access to it and instead of finding a company to pay her, she asked the internet if they'd be interested (and they are). Also, she's got, like, an actual studio so you're not staring at her nose hair while she mumbles incoherently into a camera.

I mean, it's a sweet gig, but considering how much people are willing to pay professional athletes for playing games this is pretty negligible.

[Dakini]

Nope. If you can't read the thread or be bothered to look around and see things that are right in front of your face then I'm not going to waste more of my time on you.

The fact that he hasn't made everyone else's ignore list is actually quite astonishing. I mean, perhaps to some its amusing or cute, but I got sick of his shit some time ago.

Sometimes he seems a little less dense than the average...


....but yeah, I think he's going to go the way of TJ for me.

[Dakini]

It's "morally wrong" to say, explicitly, "Your support will go towards production costs, equipment, games and downloadable content," and then spend the money she receives on production costs, equipment, games, and downloadable content?

You have a rather unique definition of "morally wrong."

Morality is relative, but still there's something icky about what she's doing. Again, she could get just as much information on these games from YouTube by watching, literally, hundreds of other people play rather than enjoying the games herself.

How do you figure that?

She's playing games spanning decades and isn't focusing just on major titles. What makes you think that all the games she wanted to discuss are featured on someone's youtube channel? What makes you think that they're featured on someone's youtube channel without extra commentary and intact cut scenes? What makes you think that it's okay to steal video clips from other people's youtube videos (and what makes you think they'll be reasonable quality)?

[Dakini]

The fact that he hasn't made everyone else's ignore list is actually quite astonishing. I mean, perhaps to some its amusing or cute, but I got sick of his shit some time ago.

TJ was, for the longest time, the only person on my ignore list, because no matter how bad, how idiotic, how utterly bereft of integrity, honesty, and basic human dignity people appeared to be, I always believed that somehow, someday, they'd all have SOMETHING useful to say.

TJ was, in my entire history of NSG, the only person who I was utterly, completely convinced would never, ever, ever have anything useful to contribute. I don't like blocking people because I like to believe that someday they might say something worthwhile. It takes a lot, a LOT, to convince me that you're someone who is completely and totally useless in a conversation, beyond any redemption.

But some people like to push that belief.

I've blocked a few people... usually they end up getting deleted not long after because they actually trolling.

So far TJ is the only one who got ignored by me and not deleted.

[Dakini]

She's a media critic. Her job involves consuming media and critically analyzing it. She decided to release these for free online so everyone could have access to it and instead of finding a company to pay her, she asked the internet if they'd be interested (and they are). Also, she's got, like, an actual studio so you're not staring at her nose hair while she mumbles incoherently into a camera.

Eh. Fair enough. Still, I hold my opinion. Morality is relative. Blah blah blah.

Really, she's probably under-charging for what she could do if she got an actual job doing this or if she charged for her individual videos.

I mean, it's a sweet gig, but considering how much people are willing to pay professional athletes for playing games this is pretty negligible.

Oh, I agree with you. It's terrible, but different.

Yes and no. It's terrible that professional athletes make more money than people who save lives or teach children or do research for a living.

This is nowhere near comparable because she's not making that much. If she's paying herself a salary (she's likely paying her camera person a salary so she might be paying herself too), with the amount of money she raised and the time it's probably going to take her, it's not like she's getting rich off this and it wouldn't surprise me if she's got other jobs on the side to get by.

[Dakini]

You know, for some reason, the idea that someone who is going through hundreds of video games to identify sexism in video games and why it's wrong and explain how it's wrong and to document where, when, and how it happens is only doing it because they just want to get someone else to pay for their video game habit is pretty hilarious.

...
*quietly makes a new youtube account*

Considering your earlier comments about production value and editing, this might not be a worthwhile endeavor.

[Dakini]

Obviously a thread about sexism in video games should have nothing to do with actual sexism in video games.



For fuck's sake. Oh my fucking god did you not read any of my post?

I have literally thousands of hours of playtime and multiple max level characters on different servers. Holy fucking shit I play the FUCK out of Internet Lightsabers and Blasters. What in the ever-loving hell makes you think I'm too sensitive to handle it?

I give up.

Look, at the end of the day, my question will remain this: is it really worth talking about a trend that is disappearing anyway?

First of all that is not obviously the case. If it were, why would it not be worthwhile discussing why it doesn't go away faster?

[Dakini]

I prefer putting on my twin daggers and face mask, personally. ROGUES 4 LIFE.

(Also, c'mon, rogues are way kinkier.)

Please, Clerics are the best. You'll need me when you roll that Nat 1 on the disable device check.

I like my ranger.

[Dakini]

I mean, really, doesn't this just sum up the caliber of this poster?

I thought it would be obvious that would be more or less a sarcastic jab.

Really? It looked like a pretty classical ad hom to me.

[Dakini]

I like my ranger.

You don't get the satisfaction from a bow like you do from a cannon.

Pft. I get satisfaction from siccing my tiger on creatures.



...also shooting them in the eye with my arrows. That's pretty sweet.


...and strangling them with vines and stabbing them with thorns. Also good.

[Dakini]

Yet Aurora comes in and claims that "hurt feelings" aren't real harm.

They aren't, and if you think they are, you really need to grow up. If something makes you feel offended, that's not a real harm. You need to learn how to deal with things that you personally might not like. That's how, you know, mature adults live.

I think that if you want to see someone who needs to grow up, you should look in the mirror.

[Dakini]

Me, for one? I certainly know people who have.

The dozens of rape victims I know who've been triggered if someone tells that fucking 'is it theft or rape hurr durr' "joke". The abuse victims, who hear people laughing about domestic abuse.

I means seriously, it's quite common. I don't think I've had a full blown PTSD attack because someone has said a joke, but it's not out of the realms of possibility for me alone and I'm pretty fucking lucky in terms of my flashbacks and episodes.

Then those people should take measures to not hear those kinds of jokes, either by avoiding certain places/situations, or informing people beforehand that they really don't enjoy such things, as it sets them off.

So rape survivors should never go on the internet or leave their house because of chuckleheads like you? Is that what you're saying?

[Dakini]

Depression isn't hurt feelings. It's a chemical imbalance causing irrational thought patterns, with a tendency toward catastrophizing problems, accentuating negative information, and dismissing positive information.

ahahahahaha.

Right. Of course. Bullying and emotional abuse in no way contributes to depression.

How could I forget.

Yeah, people who are harassed and bullied never commit suicide either.

[Dakini]

Fixed.

The thing is, people claim to have all sorts of shit on the internet.
aspergers is the most common.
So how the hell am I supposed to take your word for it?
Again, i'm not saying you are a liar. I'm just saying I cannot take your word for it.

Did you try reading the fucking links about PTSD someone posted?

No?


Just like you didn't bother reading the links about the bullying and harassment that Anita S. experienced which you dismissed as something like "people got annoyed, so she cried and got money"? Because it conflicts with your precious preconceived notions about how things work?


I second (or third, or fourth) Neo Art's sentiment regarding your posts.

[Dakini]

Did you try reading the fucking links about PTSD someone posted?

No?


Just like you didn't bother reading the links about the bullying and harassment that Anita S. experienced which you dismissed as something like "people got annoyed, so she cried and got money"?


I second (or third, or fourth) Neo Art's sentiment regarding your posts.

Which links? Things are moving pretty fast.

The PTSD links were in the last page or two.

The other links are from earlier in a post you claimed I didn't say anything worth responding to (aka pointed out that you didn't know wtf you were talking about).

[Dakini]

OK. Now let's assume that objectification pervades the media in all its forms, and that it's essentially inevitable that you'll encounter it. What then? Move to the North Pole?

Since I have no reputation left to tarnish, I'll say it: Make your own.

Oh, everyone has the time, money, resources, connections and talent to make their own media.

[Dakini]

Did you try reading the fucking links about PTSD someone posted?

No?


Just like you didn't bother reading the links about the bullying and harassment that Anita S. experienced which you dismissed as something like "people got annoyed, so she cried and got money"? Because it conflicts with your precious preconceived notions about how things work?


I second (or third, or fourth) Neo Art's sentiment regarding your posts.

And it's really a reflection of the level of ignorance those arguing there is no sexism have. They do not consider personal examples to exist. They do not consider expert opinions to exist. They consider, as the only shred of evidence, their assertion that there is simply no evidence while finding increasingly pathetic reasons to dismiss the opposing evidence.

Yeah, it would be pretty sad if it wasn't so fucking terrible.

[Dakini]

Oh, everyone has the time, money, resources, connections and talent to make their own media.

Kickstarter?

That totally tales care of the time, resources, connections and talent part doesn't it?

Also, considering how much sexist assholes complained when a woman tried raising $6000 to create a series commenting on sexism in video games, I can't imagine what would happen if anyone tried raising enough to actually create non-sexist video games (if that was their expressed intent).

Angel investors? People who do have talent helping you (or vice-versa)? The Internet?

There a certainly accessible ways.

If by "accessible" you mean "to a select few".

[Dakini]

It isn't all the fault of the mods. Really, it's more the fault of the world. People tend to think that anyone who disagrees with them is deluded/lying/evil. It's the new trend in politics.

Yeah, really, it is. They're the ones who set the tone and temperament. They're the ones who decide the level of discourse allowed. They're the ones who set the bar.

This is where they've set it.

This shit show is entirely on them.

Maybe there aren't enough of them.

I mean, really, if they had to deal with everyone on here who should be banned, I don't think they'd ever sleep (let alone do their jobs that actually pay them).

[Dakini]

Yeah, really, it is. They're the ones who set the tone and temperament. They're the ones who decide the level of discourse allowed. They're the ones who set the bar.

This is where they've set it.

This shit show is entirely on them.

You mean with half of us arguing, and you standing there on the sidelines insulting people and acting superior?
Why are you even here?
Just leave. You apparently hate it so much. Maybe you just enjoy insulting people. That's kind of sad.

No, he's one of the few decent posters left. How about you learn to argue better and act like an adult?

Have you looked at any of the links you've been presented?

[Dakini]

Maybe there aren't enough of them.

I mean, really, if they had to deal with everyone on here who should be banned, I don't think they'd ever sleep (let alone do their jobs that actually pay them).

I used to think that. I really did. I used to think it was just a matter of staffing.

And then "trollnaming" happened.

Maybe trollnaming happened because there aren't enough of them?

...I'm just trying to be hopeful. :/

[Dakini]

That totally tales care of the time, resources, connections and talent part doesn't it?

Also, considering how much sexist assholes complained when a woman tried raising $6000 to create a series commenting on sexism in video games, I can't imagine what would happen if anyone tried raising enough to actually create non-sexist video games (if that was their expressed intent).


If by "accessible" you mean "to a select few".

How about you quote my whole comment?

I did. I just don't bottom post. I interleave. I don't think I trimmed anything from your post either, but I will sometimes trim things that are irrelevant or that I agree on and otherwise don't want to comment on.

And I've definitely been posting like this since before you got here so you can kiss my ass.

How about that you consider that I never rallied against the women you speak off.

That was totally not the point of what I said. The point was that roving gangs of assholes harassed this woman for trying to raise $6k. How much money do you think it costs to make and distribute a video game?

[Dakini]

Maybe there aren't enough of them.

I mean, really, if they had to deal with everyone on here who should be banned, I don't think they'd ever sleep (let alone do their jobs that actually pay them).

Personally, I think that other forums got it right when a lot of them encouraged BYOM. They not only broadcasted using the ignore function but also told players to encourage others to do the same. Instead, we got a rule against suggesting that someone use their ignore function to avoid conflict.

I don't think that's generally better either. I mean, given the current demographics of this forum, if we instituted something where you get to, for instance, give up/down mods then you just get tyranny of the majority and the majority is not good right now. It would probably drive away the good posters (which would be sad, because I've been here forever and I don't want to find new forums).

[Dakini]

That totally tales care of the time, resources, connections and talent part doesn't it?

Also, considering how much sexist assholes complained when a woman tried raising $6000 to create a series commenting on sexism in video games, I can't imagine what would happen if anyone tried raising enough to actually create non-sexist video games (if that was their expressed intent).

See, bringing up Feminist Frequency is a bit of a double-edged sword.
On the one hand, the sheer backlash was insane.
The amount of misogynistic bullshit that got spewed and the rape and death threats...
It's sickening and symptomatic of serious issues in the culture.

You had me until here.

On the other hand, a lot of her "criticisms" are complete bullshit and rely on incomplete information or twisting of facts.
I don't really consider her credible, but I share contempt of the assholes that (instead of raising opposition in a rational way and countering her arguments) resort to violence.

And now I'm pretty sure you've never watched her videos and are talking out your ass.