Christian Discussion Thread III

[Menassa]

So why did you specify American?

It's not an American Thing, it's an internet meme.

That's probably why I wouldn't know what it was...

[Nuverikstan]

It's not an American Thing, it's an internet meme.

That's probably why I wouldn't know what it was...

Yeah he is right it is an internet meme.

[Nuverikstan]

Noticing neither of us are going to Budge over this Catholic vs Baptists argument here is a new one.

Who believes the Ark is still on mount Ararat?

[Athartha]

It is up to the discretion of your parish priest. You will have to demonstrate a knowledge of the sacrament of confession, and explain why it is you wish to attend confession (for you, it would be you are intending to take RCIA and would like to be able to confess your sins now). You, of all people, are aware of how fragile life is. But I also believe God would not allow for you to die before your time, and would not allow for you to die before being a member of the Church.

The Immaculate Conception means that Mary, whose conception was brought about the normal way, was conceived without original sin or its stain— the essence of original sin consists in the deprivation of sanctifying grace, and its stain is a corrupt nature. Mary, upon her conception and birth, was preserved from these defects by the very grace of God; from the first instant of her existence she was in the state of sanctifying grace and was free from the corrupt nature original sin brings. This can be seen in the angel Gabriel's greeting to her in Luke 1:28, "Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you." The phrase "full of grace" is a translation of the Greek word kecharitomene, which therefore expresses a characteristic quality of Mary. That is, she is full of God's Grace. Kecharitomene is a perfect passive participle meaning "to fill or endow with grace." It is the Catholic belief that she held this grace her entire life, rather than simply at birth, otherwise it is not how Gabriel would have greeted her.
All pardon for sins ultimately comes from Christ’s death and completion of his work. This is exemplified in baptism, the washing away of original sin and all sins committed prior to baptism. However, sins can, and will be, committed after baptism, and therefore requires a different sacrament. This is the act of penance, done through confession. Christ forgave many of their sins in their lifetime, gave this power to other men so the Church, which is considered a continuation of his presence (Matt. 28:20), and through this continuation men of this church were able to, and are able to, forgive the generations of Christ's death. Through apostolic succession this power has continued. If God has already forgiven all of a man’s sins, or will forgive them all, past and future, upon a single act of repentance, then it makes little sense to tell the apostles they have been given the power to "retain" sins, since forgiveness would be all-or-nothing and nothing could be "retained." This means a continued act of repentance is required for sins committed, and those who can give this repentance is the Clergy of the Church.

Well over your reason on Mary having the grace of God. I heard from a Jewish rabbi turned Christian he said that Mary was a descendent of David and that is why she was chosen. Now Joseph also was, but Christ had to be born of the line of David and being born from Mary is the most accurate. And to your second thing why does he have to wait until next Easter to be baptized? We are already in enough arguments so I won't start the fight over why you guys believe you must be baptized to be saved.

I'm afraid that has little to do with what I've said, who Mary is and is not descendent of plays little part in the Immaculate Conception or if she was given God's Grace.

That's simply when the Church does confirmations, it does it at Easter. Baptisms for the young are done year-round, baptism for converts are done along with Confirmation in the Easter season. It's done on the Easter-vigil, this is because of the visiting Bishop that will be able to complete your confirmation. If a bishop visits town, or a priest receives approval, confirmation may be done at any time of the year.

Also, its important to note, Easter is the time for confirmation for RCIA candidates. Those who are baptised Catholic as a child receive confirmation at any point in the year.

[Grenartia]

See, this is where I've got to disagree with the Catholic Church. I have absolutely no problems for abortion in cases of rape or when the mother's life is in danger. And forcing a woman to keep the baby until birth under those circumstances is unethical and un-Christian.

Can you explain how it is specifically un-Christian[sic]?

Because it is unethical.

See, this is where I've got to disagree with the Catholic Church. I have absolutely no problems for abortion in cases of rape or when the mother's life is in danger. And forcing a woman to keep the baby until birth under those circumstances is unethical and un-Christian.

I'd prefer morning after pill in the case of rape.

As did I. Either that, or "the mother should choose to give up her life for the life of the child", which would seem to be endorsing a form of suicide, which means that its a damned if you do, damned if you don't type of situation, considering the Catholic stance on suicide.

1. It's not one or the other, it's the BOTH are sacred, and you must try to save both. It is immoral to intentionally kill one to save the other. 2. The other quote I posted, shows that it Is however, acceptable but tragic, if one is unintentionally killed trying to save the other.

1. I'm aware.

2. What I'm referring to is if there is such a situation where one cannot be saved without killing the other.

I'm in a bit of crisis. I was born and raised a Catholic, everyone I know is Catholic, it would a major stain on my family if I converted…but I feel drawn by the Protestant denominations, particularly the "low churches" (I mean that in an unoffensive way)…It's like for all of my life I've never really felt God's presence, just "played the part", and then I go to one southern church and suddenly I have my faith.

Join the Baptist church. We are friendly and more than likely we will offer you donuts.

My only problems with the Baptist church (or at least the Southern Baptist Convention) are their anti-LGBT equality, pro-capital punishment, anti-choice, and anti-poor (or at least, against solutions to poverty) stances. It all really seems un-Christian.

For the longest time, I felt alone in my battles while I was a LGBT Ally....but with this website, I don't feel that way anymore

http://notalllikethat.org/

Check the site out if you want to learn more

That site is amazing.

Are you not American?

I am a Texan.

So...you're not American.

[Nuverikstan]

Well over your reason on Mary having the grace of God. I heard from a Jewish rabbi turned Christian he said that Mary was a descendent of David and that is why she was chosen. Now Joseph also was, but Christ had to be born of the line of David and being born from Mary is the most accurate. And to your second thing why does he have to wait until next Easter to be baptized? We are already in enough arguments so I won't start the fight over why you guys believe you must be baptized to be saved.

I'm afraid that has little to do with what I've said, who Mary is and is not descendent of plays little part in the Immaculate Conception or if she was given God's Grace.

That's simply when the Church does confirmations, it does it at Easter. Baptisms for the young are done year-round, baptism for converts are done along with Confirmation in the Easter season. It's done on the Easter-vigil, this is because of the visiting Bishop that will be able to complete your confirmation. If a bishop visits town, or a priest receives approval, confirmation may be done at any time of the year.

Also, its important to note, Easter is the time for confirmation for RCIA candidates. Those who are baptised Catholic as a child receive confirmation at any point in the year.

That seems pretty unfair don't you think? If the child is baptized then when it grows up it can join whenever it wants. But if an adult feels like joining he must wait until a bishop confirms him. A car accident could happen and he dies before he can join. Or a shooting at his house. I am not going to question anything else because I know neither of us are going to budge.

[Nuverikstan]

Can you explain how it is specifically un-Christian[sic]?

Because it is unethical.

I'd prefer morning after pill in the case of rape.



1. It's not one or the other, it's the BOTH are sacred, and you must try to save both. It is immoral to intentionally kill one to save the other. 2. The other quote I posted, shows that it Is however, acceptable but tragic, if one is unintentionally killed trying to save the other.

1. I'm aware.

2. What I'm referring to is if there is such a situation where one cannot be saved without killing the other.

Join the Baptist church. We are friendly and more than likely we will offer you donuts.

1.My only problems with the Baptist church (or at least the Southern Baptist Convention) are their anti-LGBT equality, pro-capital punishment, anti-choice, and anti-poor (or at least, against solutions to poverty) stances. It all really seems un-Christian.

For the longest time, I felt alone in my battles while I was a LGBT Ally....but with this website, I don't feel that way anymore

http://notalllikethat.org/

Check the site out if you want to learn more

That site is amazing.

I am a Texan.

2.So...you're not American.

1.Well I agree with everything except for the poverty one. Where I live we actually help the poor a lot, but I don't know about other churches.
2.Excatly. *Takes a whiff of the air* Smell that freedom.

[Athartha]

I'm afraid that has little to do with what I've said, who Mary is and is not descendent of plays little part in the Immaculate Conception or if she was given God's Grace.

That's simply when the Church does confirmations, it does it at Easter. Baptisms for the young are done year-round, baptism for converts are done along with Confirmation in the Easter season. It's done on the Easter-vigil, this is because of the visiting Bishop that will be able to complete your confirmation. If a bishop visits town, or a priest receives approval, confirmation may be done at any time of the year.

Also, its important to note, Easter is the time for confirmation for RCIA candidates. Those who are baptised Catholic as a child receive confirmation at any point in the year.

That seems pretty unfair don't you think? If the child is baptized then when it grows up it can join whenever it wants. But if an adult feels like joining he must wait until a bishop confirms him. A car accident could happen and he dies before he can join. Or a shooting at his house. I am not going to question anything else because I know neither of us are going to budge.

Hardly, it's done for uniformity! So that way no matter where you are in the world, RCIA classes begin and end at the same time. It's no different than someone waiting to start their first semester of university in fall the summer after they graduate from secondary school. Is it unfair that they have to wait for this, when they could die before it starts? No, that is simply how life is.

[Nuverikstan]

That seems pretty unfair don't you think? If the child is baptized then when it grows up it can join whenever it wants. But if an adult feels like joining he must wait until a bishop confirms him. A car accident could happen and he dies before he can join. Or a shooting at his house. I am not going to question anything else because I know neither of us are going to budge.

Hardly, it's done for uniformity! So that way no matter where you are in the world, RCIA classes begin and end at the same time. It's no different than someone waiting to start their first semester of university in fall the summer after they graduate from secondary school. Is it unfair that they have to wait for this, when they could die before it starts? No, that is simply how life is.

Well our church has membership classes everyone other Sunday for if you want to join the church. That way then people don't have to wait so long to join the church. But I guess if you are to join the Catholic Church you have to be prepared if ever you are to be a priest.

[Athartha]

Hardly, it's done for uniformity! So that way no matter where you are in the world, RCIA classes begin and end at the same time. It's no different than someone waiting to start their first semester of university in fall the summer after they graduate from secondary school. Is it unfair that they have to wait for this, when they could die before it starts? No, that is simply how life is.

Well our church has membership classes everyone other Sunday for if you want to join the church. That way then people don't have to wait so long to join the church. But I guess if you are to join the Catholic Church you have to be prepared if ever you are to be a priest.

Hardly, RCIA classes last a few months in the autumn and winter. Do you know how complex Catholic doctrine is? One has to be able to understand the basic teachings of the church in order to join it, that's all. I do not mean this offensively, but I can teach what Baptism is in a day, there is no way I could teach what Catholicism is in a week - it takes months of studying and prayer.
Now, as for your comment on "prepared if ever you are to be a priest." Hardly a comparison.

[Nuverikstan]

Well our church has membership classes everyone other Sunday for if you want to join the church. That way then people don't have to wait so long to join the church. But I guess if you are to join the Catholic Church you have to be prepared if ever you are to be a priest.

Hardly, RCIA classes last a few months in the autumn and winter. Do you know how complex Catholic doctrine is? One has to be able to understand the basic teachings of the church in order to join it, that's all. I do not mean this offensively, but I can teach what Baptism is in a day, there is no way I could teach what Catholicism is in a week - it takes months of studying and prayer.
Now, as for your comment on "prepared if ever you are to be a priest." Hardly a comparison.

No offense taken. I like having a simpler church that just follows the Bible. Oh and the priest thing it was a joke.

[Magna Libero]

I'm officially an Evangelical Lutheran (that is our national religion). I'm also in a Church that is kind of based on Lutheranism ( doesn't in my opinion resemble Lutheranism), but is Evangelical (seems like there are some Baptist tendencies in that Church or something).

Eh. Complicated. But it is a small Church.

[Nuverikstan]

I'm officially an Evangelical Lutheran (that is our national religion). I'm also in a Church that is kind of based on Lutheranism ( doesn't in my opinion resemble Lutheranism), but is Evangelical (seems like there are some Baptist tendencies in that Church or something).

Eh. Complicated. But it is a small Church.

What country are you from?

[Magna Libero]

I'm officially an Evangelical Lutheran (that is our national religion). I'm also in a Church that is kind of based on Lutheranism ( doesn't in my opinion resemble Lutheranism), but is Evangelical (seems like there are some Baptist tendencies in that Church or something).

Eh. Complicated. But it is a small Church.

What country are you from?

Finland.

Anything specific with my nationality?

[Tawhiri]

I was raised in Te Pīhopatanga o Aotearoa the local Anglican church. I wouldn't say i'm over religious, but I am fairly so.

[Nuverikstan]

What country are you from?

Finland.

Anything specific with my nationality?

Never knew Finland's national religion was Lutheranism. That is why I asked.

[Magna Libero]

Finland.

Anything specific with my nationality?

Never knew Finland's national religion was Lutheranism. That is why I asked.

Okay. I suppose Sweden has that, too, since Finland used to be a part of Sweden.

[Nuverikstan]

Never knew Finland's national religion was Lutheranism. That is why I asked.

Okay. I suppose Sweden has that, too, since Finland used to be a part of Sweden.

Would you support Scandinavia unification?

[Magna Libero]

Because it is unethical.




1. I'm aware.

2. What I'm referring to is if there is such a situation where one cannot be saved without killing the other.



1.My only problems with the Baptist church (or at least the Southern Baptist Convention) are their anti-LGBT equality, pro-capital punishment, anti-choice, and anti-poor (or at least, against solutions to poverty) stances. It all really seems un-Christian.



That site is amazing.



2.So...you're not American.

1.Well I agree with everything except for the poverty one. Where I live we actually help the poor a lot, but I don't know about other churches.
2.Excatly. *Takes a whiff of the air* Smell that freedom.

1. Weird. I haven't heard of any anti- poor people churches. My churches help poor people and also evangelize in foreign poor countries and help them.

[Arvas]

I'm a Lutheran, my Church is part of the Porvoo Communion.

[Magna Libero]

Okay. I suppose Sweden has that, too, since Finland used to be a part of Sweden.

Would you support Scandinavia unification?

Do you mean the Unification Church? I don't know honestly much about it. However, the name sounds promising, since it's good if there is one Church.

[Nuverikstan]

Would you support Scandinavia unification?

Do you mean the Unification Church? I don't know honestly much about it. However, the name sounds promising, since it's good if there is one Church.

No I mean unifying Scandinavia. Like Norway, Sweden, and Finland all one country.

[Magna Libero]

I'm a Lutheran, my Church is part of the Porvoo Communion.

I didn't know you live that south. Is it the "normal" Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland?

Do you mean the Unification Church? I don't know honestly much about it. However, the name sounds promising, since it's good if there is one Church.

No I mean unifying Scandinavia. Like Norway, Sweden, and Finland all one country.

I don't have many feelings or opinions about it. It might be good, since that would strengthen the country militarily, so other countries could not attack so easily. But, I do not know. Am I supposed to put in something about Christianity in here?

How do you feel about very powerful governments? Are they good or bad from a Christian perspective?
I think they can be bad sometimes. Countries such as India, North Korea and China can be very tough places for a Christian.

[Arvas]

I'm a Lutheran, my Church is part of the Porvoo Communion.

I didn't know you live that south. Is it the "normal" Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland?

Ah, no. I'm Sámi from Sweden! From the very north of Sweden, though / I cross the border into Finland to visit family on that side. Haha

[Nuverikstan]

I'm a Lutheran, my Church is part of the Porvoo Communion.

I didn't know you live that south. Is it the "normal" Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland?

No I mean unifying Scandinavia. Like Norway, Sweden, and Finland all one country.

I don't have many feelings or opinions about it. It might be good, since that would strengthen the country militarily, so other countries could not attack so easily. But, I do not know. Am I supposed to put in something about Christianity in here?

How do you feel about very powerful governments? Are they good or bad from a Christian perspective?
I think they can be bad sometimes. Countries such as India, North Korea and China can be very tough places for a Christian.

You don't have to add anything Christian it was just a question. And I like a powerful government if ran by a good leader. Like someone will morals and preferably Christian preferably Baptist. Also India is bad because they don't do anything about poverty and crime that much. That is why it is a bad place for Christians.