Gay bars: Discriminatory?

[Planeia]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/03/denmark-gay-bar-straight-kissing-_n_1475445.html

A Danish gay bar has sparked international debate after reportedly banning all heterosexual couples from kissing while visiting.

As Pink News and other LGBT sites are reporting, the founder of the Denmark-based lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) advocacy group Homosocialt Fællesskab claims a bouncer at Copenhagen's Never Mind bar told a woman in his party she could not kiss her boyfriend.

"The bouncer replied that it was unacceptable to conduct in that kind of behavior at a gay place and that Never Mind receives a lot of emails from its gay guests concerning the high number of straight guests that visit the bar," Jobbe Joller is quoted as saying. "I asked him if it was not the same as saying that black people are not allowed to kiss in Never Mind, but he disagreed and told me that the owner of Never Mind may decide who can kiss and who can’t kiss in the bar."

He then added: "I told him in a very serious tone that what they had going on was sick, and that LGBT people across Denmark struggled for acceptance and equal rights for all, while Never Mind fought against it."

Never Mind's owner told the Copenhagen Post that he didn't see the "big problem" in his establishment's policy. "I know that we need equal rights, but this is a gay bar," Christian Carlsen is quoted as saying. “We obviously have a lot of guests who aren’t homosexuals and that’s fine as long as they understand that this is a gay bar. The gays can’t go to so many other places to meet each other."

Now, I know that this news is over a year old, but I dug it up to bring up this discussion. While I am indifferent to most matters of equality and segregation (at least in today's world, because pre-Civil Rights Movement it was unacceptable), I just believe the fact that there is an establishment exclusively for homosexuals is absolute hypocrisy in its finest meaning, after all these years that the LGBT community has been fighting and campaigning for equal rights, and in recent years have actually been making significant progress.

I believe that gay bars should be banned. Let me rephrase that before a dimwitted person mistakes it for a statement of bigotry. Establishments meant exclusively for sexual orientation should be banned, that includes straight. They make all the campaigning of LGBT rights useless. Places like that should be for having fun anyway, if you're lucky enough to get lucky, good, but if you don't, whatever. Yes establishments can keep sexual orientation directed themes and what not to attract a certain crowd, but if the unwanted crowd ends up coming, it shouldn't matter.

[Ifreann]

It is so hard to be straight, you guys.

[Ostroeuropa]

I'm not opposed to themed bars provided they do not discriminate based on arbitrary criteria.
Never Mind must be made to change the policy, or closed down.
The rationale for gay bars seems sound, in as far as gays are 10% of the population who desire another (5%?) the population at maximum, and thus have only 1/10 as many potential partners as straights.
This may necessitate that homosexuals have venues that are themed toward matching them up with partners.
I see it as functionally no different from a rock club or any other kind of themed bar.
Discrimination however is unacceptable.

[Planeia]

It is so hard to be straight, you guys.

And that justifies this segregation?

[The Tectonic Plates]

Gay bars in and of themselves are not discriminatory. This policy however is definitely discriminatory and should be changed.

[Enadail]

I completely disagree that they should be banned, unless you believe the government should control all businesses. There are comedy clubs at my place that require buying 3 drinks while there; as someone who really doesn't drink alcohol and I dislike soda, I'm expected to pay $10 for a cup of juice? Discrimination!

Just because a business has practices/rules you disagree with doesn't mean it should be shut down. Hell, by that reasoning, clubs with "girls night" are discriminatory, but no ones going to make a fuss over that.

Sure, I think its wrong for a club to bar straight kissing, but in the end, I think its just a poor business choice. Leave their business to succeed or fail on its own accords.

[DogDoo 7]

I've never had this problem and I've frequented many gay bars back when I was in the US. I guess if it's turning into "hetero-tourism" the owner may need to do something to ensure that the gays can have enough gays to hit on.

[Galloism]

Well that seems like a stupid rule.

Is he afraid the gay people in his bar are going to turn straight if they see heterosexual kissing?

I mean, if a church group showed up en masse and started kissing in their dirty heterosexual ways in an attempt to shame/make uncomfortable their regular patrons in the bar, that would justify throwing their asses out.

A blanket rule based on orientation discrimination seems silly, though.

[Haktiva]

As a private institution they have the right to choose their cliental and decide what is appropriate conduct, kinda like how I own a salon for fat republican white women.

[Ostroeuropa]

I've never had this problem and I've frequented many gay bars back when I was in the US. I guess if it's turning into "hetero-tourism" the owner may need to do something to ensure that the gays can have enough gays to hit on.

One way this is dealt with at a local gay bar is to hand out wristbands.
Yellow for straight, White for homosexual.
It may seem slightly orwellian but it's done in good faith and harmless enough.
The bands are handed out by the barman, who is required to ask EVERYONE for identification (except people with wristbands.). If they are above 18, he will then ask your orientation and give you a wristband.
The wristbands originally served as a signal that you had been confirmed above 18 and could be served alcohol. The additional usage came later after some complaints by homosexuals that straight people were too common in the bar and that it was not possible to determine who was and wasn't gay, thus ruining ostensibly the entire point of a gay bar.
Being a bisexual, i'm somewhat miffed they missed me out but i'm guessing that'll change soon if it hasn't already.

[Disserbia]

Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb

[Planeia]

As a private institution they have the right to choose their cliental and decide what is appropriate conduct, kinda like how I own a salon for fat republican white women.

"As a private institution they have the right to choose to not serve black people and decide what is appropriate conduct."

Besides, discrimination on that level is illegal, even for private institutions.

[Ifreann]

It is so hard to be straight, you guys.

And that justifies this segregation?

Don't be silly. It justifies shutting down all gay bars, and indeed all places geared towards facilitating socialisation between gay people. We'll also need straight pride parades, and white history month.

[Planeia]

And that justifies this segregation?

Don't be silly. It justifies shutting down all gay bars, and indeed all places geared towards facilitating socialisation between gay people. We'll also need straight pride parades, and white history month.

You stop being silly, I'm talking about your sarcastic implication.

[Haktiva]

As a private institution they have the right to choose their cliental and decide what is appropriate conduct, kinda like how I own a salon for fat republican white women.

"As a private institution they have the right to choose to not serve black people and decide what is appropriate conduct."

Besides, discrimination on that level is illegal, even for private institutions.

True, but I don't think it's that big of a deal when certain people aren't allowed into a place of business. Yeah it sucks and isn't right, but if the business doesn't want their money, that's their problem. People have a habit of finding alternative methods to get their endless wants and needs.

Also this reminds me of that episode of South Park with the lesbian bar. Too bad this is old news, else I'd be looking forward to seeing another 300 parody.

[Ifreann]

Don't be silly. It justifies shutting down all gay bars, and indeed all places geared towards facilitating socialisation between gay people. We'll also need straight pride parades, and white history month.

You stop being silly,

I'd rather not, it's quite fun.

I'm talking about your sarcastic implication.

My sarcastic implication is that you're overreacting. And I stand by it.

[Nationalist State of Knox]

It is so hard to be straight, you guys.

I feel so oppressed.

[Ostroeuropa]

It is so hard to be straight, you guys.

I feel so oppressed.

Are you saying you wouldn't feel oppressed if a bouncer walked up to you kissing your loved one and said
"You cannot kiss eachother here."

"But they are kissing."

"yes, but you aren't allowed because you are straight."
You aren't being oppressed here. Noone is alleging otherwise to my knowledge.
Straight patrons of the bar are being oppressed.

[Hallistar]

I think the gay bar must've done that in response to how homosexual male couples kissing in public get alot of ostracism/get kicked out of clubs in some instances.

[Of the Free Socialist Territories]

It is so hard to be straight, you guys.

I feel so oppressed.

It's tyranny, plain and simple.

FREE STRAIGHT REPUBLIC!

[Ostroeuropa]

I think the gay bar must've done that in response to how homosexual male couples kissing in public get alot of ostracism/could be kicked out of clubs.

And that's bullshit too, but all Never Mind has done is give the bigots a reason to say they are treating homosexuals equally.

[Planeia]

You stop being silly,

I'd rather not, it's quite fun.

I'm talking about your sarcastic implication.

My sarcastic implication is that you're overreacting. And I stand by it.

It's not overreaction. The fact that it is hard to be gay does not justify segregation. You can meet and talk to gay people anywhere else, and if you get rejected as in finding out the person you're hitting on is not gay, then so what, trial and error. If you're trying to be discreet about your orientation then why go to a gay bar? You're not anonymous there. It's a public place. And with that being said it should be accessible by the public, meaning everyone, with no discrimination whatsoever.

[Ostroeuropa]

I'd rather not, it's quite fun.

My sarcastic implication is that you're overreacting. And I stand by it.

It's not overreaction. The fact that it is hard to be gay does not justify segregation. You can meet and talk to gay people anywhere else, and if you get rejected as in finding out the person you're hitting on is not gay, then so what, trial and error. If you're trying to be discreet about your orientation then why go to a gay bar? You're not anonymous there. It's a public place. And with that being said it should be accessible by the public, meaning everyone, with no discrimination whatsoever.

Are you against dance clubs, rock clubs, themed bars in general?

[The Tectonic Plates]

I think the gay bar must've done that in response to how homosexual male couples kissing in public get alot of ostracism/get kicked out of clubs in some instances.

I doubt that, but two wrongs make a right?

[Planeia]

It's not overreaction. The fact that it is hard to be gay does not justify segregation. You can meet and talk to gay people anywhere else, and if you get rejected as in finding out the person you're hitting on is not gay, then so what, trial and error. If you're trying to be discreet about your orientation then why go to a gay bar? You're not anonymous there. It's a public place. And with that being said it should be accessible by the public, meaning everyone, with no discrimination whatsoever.

Are you against dance clubs, rock clubs, themed bars in general?

No themes can stay, just they should not care whether the unwanted crowd comes.

Kinda like Hasbro did with MLP.