Edward Snowden Discussion Thread

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God do the hypernationalist jingo-dogs bark these days...

[Abatael]

You don't prove why it is deserving of death. It is an opinion. You can convince others to agree with you, but that is not proving it is worthy of death. You can't prove that; it's subjective.

Generally, when someone says another person deserves to die, I want to know why they want to kill someone, other than "I think it's a good idea."

Because of his crimes.

[Welsh Cowboy]

Generally, when someone says another person deserves to die, I want to know why they want to kill someone, other than "I think it's a good idea."

Because of his crimes.

And why do his crimes deserve death?

[Living Freedom Land]

Brave men and women throughout history have broken bad laws because they were serving a higher moral purpose.

Yes. He is not one of them.

HE is one of them. He exposed the details of abuses by the US government. Whether or not what he did was legal is beside the point. It was morally justified.

[Abatael]

Because of his crimes.

And why do his crimes deserve death?

Because they're treasonous.

[Abatael]

Yes. He is not one of them.

HE is one of them. He exposed the details of abuses by the US government. Whether or not what he did was legal is beside the point. It was morally justified.

He is not one of them. He is a vile coward who deserves death. Nothing he did was justified.

[Sibirsky]

Who are the victims?

How is this fucking relevant?

The victim is the public, the nation and the government.

It's relevant in that he's going to be killed one way or another. It's related to Snowden.

How is the public a victim?

The public is a beneficiary.

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And why do his crimes deserve death?

Because they're treasonous.

Surely subverting those who subvert the constitution must be the opposite of treason?

[Abatael]

The victim is the public, the nation and the government.

It's relevant in that he's going to be killed one way or another. It's related to Snowden.

How is the public a victim?

The public is a beneficiary.

He betrayed the nation, which is betraying the public.

[Sibirsky]

I sincerely wish for a rogue NSA employee (like the guys at the IRS) to have a personal vendetta against you.

You're a bad person. You deserve worse.

Good to know. Don't really care though.

I beg you would care if it actually happened.

The government systematically destroys lives. This kind of information makes them more dangerous.

And obviously, this is unconstitutional.

[Occupied Deutschland]

And why do his crimes deserve death?

Because they're treasonous.

His crime is leaking information.
Treason requires one to be giving aid and comfort to the enemy or levying war against the US.
As Snowden clearly isn't leveling war against the US, he must be giving aid and comfort to the USs enemies by leaking classified info to the American people.
This can only mean the American people are the enemies of the US Snowden is giving aid and comfort to.

[Sibirsky]

Brave men and women throughout history have broken bad laws because they were serving a higher moral purpose.

Yes. He is not one of them.

[Abatael]

Because they're treasonous.

Surely subverting those who subvert the constitution must be the opposite of treason?

No. He is subverting the government, which is not at fault.

[Sibirsky]

And why do his crimes deserve death?

Because they're treasonous.

Learn what treason is before you have the audacity to post this moronic bullshit.

Why was he not charged with treason?

[Welsh Cowboy]

Because they're treasonous.

His crime is leaking information.
Treason requires one to be giving aid and comfort to the enemy or levying war against the US.
As Snowden clearly isn't leveling war against the US, he must be giving aid and comfort to the USs enemies by leaking classified info to the American people.
This can only mean the American people are the enemies of the US Snowden is giving aid and comfort to.

The only other way to get him for treason was if he leaked sensitive information to Russia, China, or terrorist groups. Until there's proof of that...

[Sibirsky]

HE is one of them. He exposed the details of abuses by the US government. Whether or not what he did was legal is beside the point. It was morally justified.

He is not one of them. He is a vile coward who deserves death. Nothing he did was justified.

He's a hero that revealed illegal abuse.

[Sibirsky]

How is the public a victim?

The public is a beneficiary.

He betrayed the nation, which is betraying the public.

He did not betray a nation.

He betrayed a corrupt government engaged in criminal activity.

[Welsh Cowboy]

He betrayed the nation, which is betraying the public.

He did not betray a nation.

He betrayed a corrupt government engaged in criminal activity.

I don't think anyone's proven the programs broke a law, although as one satirist put it: that might possibly be the scary part, that they didn't have to break a law.

I still haven't made my mind up on this whole thing.

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Surely subverting those who subvert the constitution must be the opposite of treason?

No. He is subverting the government, which is not at fault.

Who else but the government can be at fault for unconstitutional government spying?

[Abatael]

Because they're treasonous.

Learn what treason is before you have the audacity to post this moronic bullshit.

Why was he not charged with treason?

Because the government is being too liberal with him.

He is not a hero or patriot. He's a coward and a traitor.

If he's so brave, then he would come back to the U.S. to face his punishment for his crimes.

[Sibirsky]

He did not betray a nation.

He betrayed a corrupt government engaged in criminal activity.

I don't think anyone's proven the programs broke a law, although as one satirist put it: that might possibly be the scary part, that they didn't have to break a law.

I still haven't made my mind up on this whole thing.

The fact that the program is unconstitutional is as clear as could be.

[Welsh Cowboy]

I don't think anyone's proven the programs broke a law, although as one satirist put it: that might possibly be the scary part, that they didn't have to break a law.

I still haven't made my mind up on this whole thing.

The fact that the program is unconstitutional is as clear as could be.

The email program or the phone records?

[Sibirsky]

Learn what treason is before you have the audacity to post this moronic bullshit.

Why was he not charged with treason?

Because the government is being too liberal with him.

He is not a hero or patriot. He's a coward and a traitor.

If he's so brave, then he would come back to the U.S. to face his punishment for his crimes.

Why in the flying fuck would the government be too liberal with him?

You make zero sense.

[Sibirsky]

The fact that the program is unconstitutional is as clear as could be.

The email program or the phone records?

All of it.

[Occupied Deutschland]

Learn what treason is before you have the audacity to post this moronic bullshit.

Why was he not charged with treason?

Because the government is being too liberal with him.

He is not a hero or patriot. He's a coward and a traitor.

If he's so brave, then he would come back to the U.S. to face his punishment for his crimes.

You keep using that word it does not mean what you think it means...

If you classify Snowden as a traitor the only consistent way of doing so makes the American people the enemies of the United States. I have a feeling this is not what you wish. AT MOST he is guilty of espionage, and all we have to base that off of is that's what they say he might have done, with no proof that is publicly available.

Frankly, I'm skeptical of the government's impartiality on this matter. But either way, treason is quite obviously not what happened here.