How should the United States handle illegal immigration?

[Aidannadia]

A lot of responses give lie to the fact that 'illegal immigrants' is a PC term for Mexicans, why not just say 'How should the United States handle Mexicans?'.

We have lots of people sneak across the Canadian border because of the long waiting lines for medical services there.

[Farnhamia]

A lot of responses give lie to the fact that 'illegal immigrants' is a PC term for Mexicans, why not just say 'How should the United States handle Mexicans?'.

We have lots of people sneak across the Canadian border because of the long waiting lines for medical services there.

Do they go home afterwards? If so then they aren't "illegal immigrants."

[Enadail]

Some people say that illegal immigrants only take that jobs that Americans don't want to do. That is pure bullshit. Americans would work those jobs if they were at least paid minimum wage and given at least the minimal benefits that the state and federal laws say. The greedy corporations just chose to hire the illegals because they are willing to work for 2 to 3 dollars an hour with zero benefits. Whenever ICE raided a business where I live there was always a bunch of American citizens and legal immigrants that were waiting to take those jobs that just opened up.

And yet when farms in Arizona and Georgia were rid of undocumented workers, food went rotting in the sun, even when people were being offered wages that were crazy high for farm workers. Hm...

[Aidannadia]

We have lots of people sneak across the Canadian border because of the long waiting lines for medical services there.

Do they go home afterwards? If so then they aren't "illegal immigrants."

I actually haven't heard either way, so I can't answer the question accurately, but if they had a condition like cancer or diabetes, they may want to stay because of a recurring need for hospital visits, but this is just something I have thought of off the bat.

[Enadail]

Yes, 6.7 billion people living in shithole countries for the most part. Europe only accounts for about 500 million of that.

Yah, India and China are definite shit holes, with one holding a majority of US debt and both being among the highest producers of engineers and scientists the world around, and both producing pretty much all their countries need (India does import a lot of food, as I mentioned above).

Even if they were shit holes, they couldn't afford to have any impact on the world economy, rendering them out of the equation, even though they are both enormous parts of the world economy.

I do wonder what reality you live in sometimes.

[Ifreann]

Why do you hate America so much?

I don't.

Just the supreme laws of it.

Personally I'm setting him up to say things contrary to the principle of the rule of law so I can use them against him in a court of law in other threads.

Not gonna happen.

Already has.

The US is 0.3 billion people. The rest of the World is 6.7 billion people. The world economy could get by without the US. The US economy would have a much harder time of it.

Yes, 6.7 billion people living in shithole countries for the most part. Europe only accounts for about 500 million of that.

Countries the rest of the world will be perfectly free to trade with while the US takes its toys and goes home to play all alone. Countries with cheap labour and various resources you'll no longer have access to, but the rest of the world will.

Though, you're right that this is all unrealistic, because the US is never going to try and dump all its illegal immigrants in the Pacific, no matter how bad you want it to.

[Norjagen]

Took the middle option. The problem we have stems from legal immigration being too difficult, while illegal immigration is too easy.

I do think we need to secure the border first. We know how to go about that, if we're willing to commit the resources and resolve to get it done. Someone mentioned the Berlin wall. Something along those lines might not be out of the question.

Once the incoming flood of undocumented immigrants is dealt with, even if only temporarily, we can set about crafting a path to citizenship that makes sense. To try and cover both tasks at once seems like a recipe for disaster. Once things are secure, we'll be able to take stock of the situation without a sense of immediate urgency, and work out a well-thought-out solution.

[Enadail]

Took the middle option. The problem we have stems from legal immigration being too difficult, while illegal immigration is too easy.

I do think we need to secure the border first. We know how to go about that, if we're willing to commit the resources and resolve to get it done. Someone mentioned the Berlin wall. Something along those lines might not be out of the question.

Once the incoming flood of undocumented immigrants is dealt with, even if only temporarily, we can set about crafting a path to citizenship that makes sense. To try and cover both tasks at once seems like a recipe for disaster. Once things are secure, we'll be able to take stock of the situation without a sense of immediate urgency, and work out a well-thought-out solution.

And if we build a wall, they'll dig tunnels under, or climb over. It would be crazy expensive to monitor the entire US-Mexico border 24/7, and wouldn't even solve the issue, given you can become undocumented even entering legally.

Given a lack of jobs has proven to stem undocumented immigration, it'd be much easier and more appropriate to attack the problem at its source: companies hiring undocumented workers under the table. Force them to bring it to light and you solve most of the problems; taxes have to be paid, they're in the light, wages rise and are competitive.

[Coffee Cakes]

I say just annex Mexico and Central America.
Just draw up generous terms for the agreement, that benefits both us and them, to keep it fair.

[Big Jim P]

Target practice.

[The Ben Boys]

I feel they should follow it anyway, but the path to citizenship is in dire need of reform, no longer emulating 100 year old nativistic ideals.

Our citizenship process is fine as it is, foreigners simply need to respect it. They should all be hunted down and thrown into the ocean.

What are you talking about? Why do you need to know who wrote the Star Spangled Banner, pay obscene naturalization fees (at least $300 as of 2005), and even worse application fees ($685)? Some of this stuff is unnecessary, mostly because if they are more easily legal it solidifies us as a state of immigrants and bonds us closer together, more available for the military draft, and more people that pay taxes.

Of course, this is the one thing I depend on liberals for and, of course, most of them don't want it or don't care in the immigration states (citizen-wise: most of them don't like illegal immigration or are very conservative on citizenship).

[Coffee Cakes]

Target practice.

Is it bad I laughed at that?

[Farnhamia]

Target practice.

Is it bad I laughed at that?

Yes.

[Coffee Cakes]

Is it bad I laughed at that?

Yes.

That was bad, and I feel bad. *nods*

[Big Jim P]

Target practice.

Is it bad I laughed at that?

No. It shows you have a sense of humor.

[Big Jim P]

Yes.

That was bad, and I feel bad. *nods*

I am sorry I made you feel bad CC.

[Coffee Cakes]

Is it bad I laughed at that?

No. It shows you have a sense of humor.

Awesome.

That was bad, and I feel bad. *nods*

I am sorry I made you feel bad CC.

You didn't get the Futurama reference? D:

[Big Jim P]

No. It shows you have a sense of humor.

Awesome.

I am sorry I made you feel bad CC.

You didn't get the Futurama reference? D:

Didn't get the ref. Sorry.

[Ecans]

A lot of responses give lie to the fact that 'illegal immigrants' is a PC term for Mexicans, why not just say 'How should the United States handle Mexicans?'.

We have lots of people sneak across the Canadian border because of the long waiting lines for medical services there.

They do not "SNEAK" across the border! They visit quite legally to have medical procedures done and PAY good money to do so. They then return to Canada, having no wish to stay.

This applies to a tiny fraction of those not willing or feel not able to wait. I had a heart attack 10 years ago. From diagnosis to operation took 3 days. I had a bad case of pneumonia last year. Diagnosis to treatment=2 days. Treatment to surgery= 1 more day.

On the other hand, those who can claim dual citizenship (US/Canada) cross the border to have babies and get medical procedures that will not bankrupt them or cost the their houses and retirement. All without paying a nickel in Canadian taxes. Thankfully new laws are being written to prevent this farce.

I'm afraid that you have been lied to about Canadian wait lists. The one area we fall down on is late-life chronic care. That's improving, though. It's been used as a political foot ball in the US. Exaggerations and outright lies get used. Surely, as an American citizen, you are accustomed to that!

Illegal mass movement from Canada to the US? When our banking system did NOT require bail-outs? When our jobless rate raised by tiny amounts? When we don't have a fraction % of the violent gun crime you endure daily? I don't think so!

[Republica Newland]

No amnesty. Quotas on a need by need basis. We should take care of ourselves first. That's why we're a country after all. The govt and private sector should report what exactly they are lacking to a centralized institution which would then allow properly qualified foreigners fitting the job descriptions to come into the country. The time they're allowed to stay should coincide with their contracts. After a contract ends, they should be allowed to stay a further couple of months. If they can't find work in that time frame then they are sent back. After a number of years of working in the US they get full citizenship.

Unfortunately though, this leaves a loophole: firms post job offers with shit wages/benefits, no one applies and voila they're lacking personnel and they report that. Now guess who's gonna take those jobs..

[Enadail]

No amnesty. Quotas on a need by need basis. We should take care of ourselves first. That's why we're a country after all. The govt and private sector should report what exactly they are lacking to a centralized institution which would then allow properly qualified foreigners fitting the job descriptions to come into the country. The time they're allowed to stay should coincide with their contracts. After a contract ends, they should be allowed to stay a further couple of months. If they can't find work in that time frame then they are sent back. After a number of years of working in the US they get full citizenship.

Unfortunately though, this leaves a loophole: firms post job offers with shit wages/benefits, no one applies and voila they're lacking personnel and they report that. Now guess who's gonna take those jobs..

So basically, you want mostly the system the US has now, but with a much much MUCH larger USCIS? How is what you propose different from what the US does now?

[Densaner]

Deportation for those you can find. Make life unbearable for the ones you can't.

[Enadail]

Deportation for those you can find. Make life unbearable for the ones you can't.

So violate human rights and spend a ton of money for what gain?

[Krazakistan]

Deportation for those you can find. Make life unbearable for the ones you can't.

So violate human rights and spend a ton of money for what gain?

They came here illegally, they shouldn't have any rights to begin with IMO.

[Big Jim P]

Deportation for those you can find. Make life unbearable for the ones you can't.

^this.