So, Abortion.

[Asuiop]

Look, the human being ended up inside of you through your actions. The human being had no say in the matter. Now you want to kill the human instead of giving birth to him/her. Sounds a bit selfish doesn't it?

[Vazdania]

at conception, that cell is a human. If you prevent those gametes from forming a complete diploid cell then go ahead.

You know that more than half of all fertilized ova spontaneously abort, right?

Half of them don't even implant and more of them result in a miscarriage before a woman even knows she was pregnant. I'd only be getting an abortion slightly later than that so really, it's no biggie as far as development goes.

that is correct, we can only blame nature on that, the women didn't intentionally do that, now did she??? Nature naturally aborts some embryo's.

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

If your intent to do so and use of contraceptives is 100% effective, yes, I'd accept that argument. But often contraceptives are not 100% effective, and often women are not given a choice of contraceptive.

well then they become pregnant....then they should go along with the pregnancy until the child is birthed.

What a casual understanding of points I have made, without any regard to realities. You really are not very mature in your understanding of the world.

[Vazdania]

well then they become pregnant....then they should go along with the pregnancy until the child is birthed.

Why?
Because oh no clump of cells being destroyed?

that can develop into a human

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

You know that more than half of all fertilized ova spontaneously abort, right?

Half of them don't even implant and more of them result in a miscarriage before a woman even knows she was pregnant. I'd only be getting an abortion slightly later than that so really, it's no biggie as far as development goes.

that is correct, we can only blame nature on that, the women didn't intentionally do that, now did she??? Nature naturally aborts some embryo's.

Your default thinking is blaming something for everything, isn't it?

[Individuality-ness]

Look, the human being ended up inside of you through your actions. The human being had no say in the matter. Now you want to kill the human instead of giving birth to him/her. Sounds a bit selfish doesn't it?

Telling a woman that she has no rights to her own body because it makes you squeamish is the epitome of selfishness.

A woman aborting a pregnancy because she knows she cannot provide the best environment for it to grow is the opposite of that.

[Vazdania]

well then they become pregnant....then they should go along with the pregnancy until the child is birthed.

What a casual understanding of points I have made, without any regard to realities. You really are not very mature in your understanding of the world.

people tell me that all the time on here. I don't give a crap really.

[Asuiop]

Sadly, it does. So much so. And usually from immature males.

Is it any surprise, really?

Please tell me you don't think I'm a rapist now...

[Vazdania]

that is correct, we can only blame nature on that, the women didn't intentionally do that, now did she??? Nature naturally aborts some embryo's.

Your default thinking is blaming something for everything, isn't it?

?

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

Why?
Because oh no clump of cells being destroyed?

that can develop into a human

On their own. Right.

[Dakini]

"The bear didn't want to maul you, you unknowingly put yourself between her and her cub so you forced her to maul you."

"The troll didn't want to troll you, you unknowingly put your picture up so that said troll was forced to badly Photoshop it to make it look like you were eating cum and spam it all over the forums to harass you."

"You didn't want to start a trend, you unknowingly made a terrible argument and everyone else was forced to find it hilarious."

[Individuality-ness]

Is it any surprise, really?

Please tell me you don't think I'm a rapist now...

I have never conversed with you regarding consent, so I cannot judge, but that particular line of thinking is what rape apologists do.

[Mavorpen]

And now you're lying.

Laws, including the legal definition of "person", are rooted in reason, empirical evidence, and ethics. So please give me a reason why not all human beings should receive the fundamental human right (i.e. right to life) associated with human personhood.

Why would I do that?

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

Is it any surprise, really?

Please tell me you don't think I'm a rapist now...

Do you often jump to weird conclusions? Like How consent to sex is consent to risk of pregnancy, but is not consent to pregnancy itself, but no abortions should be allowed in either case?

[Individuality-ness]

"The troll didn't want to troll you, you unknowingly put your picture up so that said troll was forced to badly Photoshop it to make it look like you were eating cum and spam it all over the forums to harass you."

"You didn't want to start a trend, you unknowingly made a terrible argument and everyone else was forced to find it hilarious."

"You didn't want to make an argument on NationStates, you unknowingly went onto the forums and you were forced to post."

[Vazdania]

that can develop into a human

On their own. Right.

fucking no. The women consented to sex which may or may not result in a fetus depending on if nature allows the child to remain in the womb. Now the women knowingly had sex and know the consequences thereof. ALL people start out life in such a (albeit parasitic) manner, but even parasites are organisms.

[Asuiop]

Please tell me you don't think I'm a rapist now...

I have never conversed with you regarding consent, so I cannot judge, but that particular line of thinking is what rape apologists do.

I'm not a rapist or rape apologist. It was just a really bad arguement.

[Individuality-ness]

I have never conversed with you regarding consent, so I cannot judge, but that particular line of thinking is what rape apologists do.

I'm not a rapist or rape apologist. It was just a really bad arguement.

I never said you were. I said the line of thinking was akin to rape apology.

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

Your default thinking is blaming something for everything, isn't it?

?

I find it odd that someone pointed out that not all zygotes embed to become fetus, and you automatically decided to blame nature. It's just an overt display of victim mentality if I ever saw one.

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

I have never conversed with you regarding consent, so I cannot judge, but that particular line of thinking is what rape apologists do.

I'm not a rapist or rape apologist. It was just a really bad arguement.

Then please don't make it anymore.

[Dakini]

You know that more than half of all fertilized ova spontaneously abort, right?

Half of them don't even implant and more of them result in a miscarriage before a woman even knows she was pregnant. I'd only be getting an abortion slightly later than that so really, it's no biggie as far as development goes.

that is correct, we can only blame nature on that, the women didn't intentionally do that, now did she??? Nature naturally aborts some embryo's.

Who said we should blame women for choosing how their bodies should be used? If I'm talking to someone who has had an abortion, I'm not going to blame her for it, I can recognize that it's a difficult decision and even if I think I would have chosen differently in her position, I can still respect her decision.

Anyway, the point I was making there is that if human life begins at conception then it's not really that valuable since "nature" sees fit to destroy more than half of it from the get-go.

[Vazdania]

?

I find it odd that someone pointed out that not all zygotes embed to become fetus, and you automatically decided to blame nature. It's just an overt display of victim mentality if I ever saw one.

? who cares ? What else are we to say? Nature does that!

[Asuiop]

I'm not a rapist or rape apologist. It was just a really bad arguement.

Then please don't make it anymore.

I'm not fucking talking to you

[Grad Duchy of Luxembourg]

On their own. Right.

fucking no. The women consented to sex which may or may not result in a fetus depending on if nature allows the child to remain in the womb. Now the women knowingly had sex and know the consequences thereof. ALL people start out life in such a (albeit parasitic) manner, but even parasites are organisms.

Right. The woman consented to sex (which may or may not) result in a fetus (which may or may not) embed in the womb. But the woman who couldn't resist lust and decided to consent to sex has to bear all the responsibilities that befalls on her shoulder even if men don't.

[Dakini]

Look, the human being ended up inside of you through your actions. The human being had no say in the matter. Now you want to kill the human instead of giving birth to him/her. Sounds a bit selfish doesn't it?

Sounds pretty selfish of that human being to expect me to allow it to use my body as a life support machine when I don't want it there.

Granted, I recognize that embryos do not have feelings or a concept of self so being selfish is beyond their capabilities.