China lays claim to Okinawa as territory dispute with Japan

[Ganos Lao]

It isn't a seperate language. Basque is a seperate language, Norman French isn't.

Yes. It. Is.

Really, what are you basing your absurd notion of it being a dialect on? I bet you think Swedish, Norwegian and Danish are all just dialects of each other too.

Probably based it on whatever made him think going back to the 1763 Consensus was a good idea.

[The Godly Nations]

Because they want to keep their patois, which is hardly as different from standard French as Cantonese, Min, and Wu is from Standard Mandarin.

So Breton, a distinctly Celtic language descending from Celtic British language brought from Great Britain to Armorica by migrating Britons during the Early Middle Ages, is hardly different from standard French?

Breton is a celtic language, not an Oil language, which are, in fact patois, and hardly different from Standard French.

[Jetan]

Yes. It. Is.

Really, what are you basing your absurd notion of it being a dialect on? I bet you think Swedish, Norwegian and Danish are all just dialects of each other too.

Probably based it on whatever made him think going back to the 1763 Consensus was a good idea.

Indeed.

[Ganos Lao]

So Breton, a distinctly Celtic language descending from Celtic British language brought from Great Britain to Armorica by migrating Britons during the Early Middle Ages, is hardly different from standard French?

Breton is a celtic language, not an Oil language, which are, in fact patois, and hardly different from Standard French.

Yes, I edited that out, my mind slipped.

But you have yet to provide any real, conclusive evidence to bolster your beliefs. You need to prove how the Norman language is little more than a dialect of French.

[The Godly Nations]

It isn't a seperate language. Basque is a seperate language, Norman French isn't.

Yes. It. Is.

Really, what are you basing your absurd notion of it being a dialect on? I bet you think Swedish, Norwegian and Danish are all just dialects of each other too.

Nope, there is very little difference between Norman French and standard French, especially when compared to the difference between Min dialects, and standard Mandarin. Norman French isn't even as deviant from Standard French, as Min dialects are from each other.

[Jetan]

Yes. It. Is.

Really, what are you basing your absurd notion of it being a dialect on? I bet you think Swedish, Norwegian and Danish are all just dialects of each other too.

Nope, there is very little difference between Norman French and standard French, especially when compared to the difference between Min dialects, and standard Mandarin. Norman French isn't even as deviant from Standard French, as Min dialects are from each other.

Chinese languages are not a valid basis of judgement on what constitutes a language and what is a dialect. Norman is separate language. As to differences between languages, see the earlier example of Swedish, Norwegian and Danish.

[Ganos Lao]

Nope, there is very little difference between Norman French and standard French, especially when compared to the difference between Min dialects, and standard Mandarin. Norman French isn't even as deviant from Standard French, as Min dialects are from each other.

Chinese languages are not a valid basis of judgement on what constitutes a language and what is a dialect. Norman is separate language. As to differences between languages, see the earlier example of Swedish, Norwegian and Danish.

When Norse invaders arrived in the then-province of Neustria and settled the land that became known as Normandy, they gradually adopted the Gallo-Romance speech of the existing populations – much as Norman rulers in England later adopted the speech of the administered people. There are Norse influences in the Norman language as a result, and in some cases, Norse words adopted in Norman have been borrowed into French – and more recently some of the English words used in French can be traced back to Norman origins.

Why all this pretense that Norman is separate from French if it's just a dialect of French?

[Arumdaum]

China, LEARN

TAIWAN
THE SENKAKUS
AND OKINAWA

Do not belong to you.

Taiwan considers itself to be part of China, minus those who want independence.

[Ganos Lao]

China, LEARN

TAIWAN
THE SENKAKUS
AND OKINAWA

Do not belong to you.

Taiwan considers itself to be part of China, minus those who want independence.

And then there's those in Taiwan who think that they ought to rule China.

[Arglorand]

I think the whole world should pursue territorial absurdities like China does.

I lay claim to Moldova as a former tributary state of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Now, not to imply all former tributary states should be part of Lithuania, but it certainly does not belong to Moldova or its inhabitants.

[Arumdaum]

Because they want to keep their patois, which is hardly as different from standard French as Cantonese, Min, and Wu is from Standard Mandarin.

So what makes Norman and French not so different? Provide evidence beyond "it IS a patois!" for our clarification.

The funny thing is that Cantonese is really different from Mandarin and speakers of the languages have absolutely no idea what each other talk about, unlike the limited understanding that Italian and Spanish speakers can have with each other. Not sure about Min and Wu.

[Fruition (Ancient)]

I think the whole world should pursue territorial absurdities like China does.

I lay claim to Moldova as a former tributary state of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Now, not to imply all former tributary states should be part of Lithuania, but it certainly does not belong to Moldova or its inhabitants.

That has been the norm of the ancient empires. Nowadays, leaders of the nations are too tired and occupied with domestic matters to even dare conquer foreign territories.

[Olthar]

According to the anime I've watched, Okinawa is Japanese. Therefore, Okinawa is not Chinese. How hard is this?

[Arglorand]

I think the whole world should pursue territorial absurdities like China does.

I lay claim to Moldova as a former tributary state of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Now, not to imply all former tributary states should be part of Lithuania, but it certainly does not belong to Moldova or its inhabitants.

That has been the norm of the ancient empires. Nowadays, leaders of the nations are too tired and occupied with domestic matters to even dare conquer foreign territories.

Exactly. In that part of the world, absurd territorial claims are, unfortunately, still popular, apparently as a polite way of saying "We don't like you."

[Arumdaum]

I think the whole world should pursue territorial absurdities like China does.

I lay claim to Moldova as a former tributary state of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Now, not to imply all former tributary states should be part of Lithuania, but it certainly does not belong to Moldova or its inhabitants.

Wasn't it just some newspaper contributors rather than an official claim by China?

[Arglorand]

I think the whole world should pursue territorial absurdities like China does.

I lay claim to Moldova as a former tributary state of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Now, not to imply all former tributary states should be part of Lithuania, but it certainly does not belong to Moldova or its inhabitants.

Wasn't it just some newspaper contributors rather than an official claim by China?

True. Not to say the Diaoyu/Senkaku conflict is any one bit more sensible, however.

[Arumdaum]

Taiwan considers itself to be part of China, minus those who want independence.

And then there's those in Taiwan who think that they ought to rule China.

Isn't that because they view the Republic of China as the legitimate government of the country which was ousted following the Chinese Civil War?

[Ganos Lao]

And then there's those in Taiwan who think that they ought to rule China.

Isn't that because they view the Republic of China as the legitimate government of the country which was ousted following the Chinese Civil War?

Pretty much.

There's also those claims about the ROC still being the legitimate owners of Taiwan, which is why Mongolia and Taiwan have no relations. It was only in 2002 that Taiwan recognized Mongolia as an independent country with subsequent measures taken later on to reflect that in official maps and such. The ROC also tried to prevent Mongolia joining the UN, leaving Mongolia excluded from the UN until 1960, when the Soviet Union announced that unless Mongolia was admitted, it would block the admission of all of the newly independent African states.

Faced with this pressure, the ROC relented under protest.

[New Chalcedon]

Isn't that because they view the Republic of China as the legitimate government of the country which was ousted following the Chinese Civil War?

Pretty much.

There's also those claims about the ROC still being the legitimate owners of Taiwan, which is why Mongolia and Taiwan have no relations. It was only in 2002 that Taiwan recognized Mongolia as an independent country with subsequent measures taken later on to reflect that in official maps and such. The ROC also tried to prevent Mongolia joining the UN, leaving Mongolia excluded from the UN until 1960, when the Soviet Union announced that unless Mongolia was admitted, it would block the admission of all of the newly independent African states.

Faced with this pressure, the ROC relented under protest.

Well, to be fair, Nationalist China - at that time the actual owner of Mongolia - was not consulted about the disposition of same at the Yalta Conference. The entire cavalier affair smacked of imperialism, to be perfectly honest - three old, sick men sitting at a luxury resort deciding the fate of nations at the hands of their respective Empires.

[NERVUN]

I think the whole world should pursue territorial absurdities like China does.

I lay claim to Moldova as a former tributary state of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Now, not to imply all former tributary states should be part of Lithuania, but it certainly does not belong to Moldova or its inhabitants.

Wasn't it just some newspaper contributors rather than an official claim by China?

No, it was two academics who happen to work for the CCP's major think tank talking through the official mouthpiece of the CCP/government.

[Ainin]

The mentality in the CCP right now:
I'm gonna claim everything belongs to me for shit and giggles. I'm gonna whine and bitch about my frivolous case until Japan concedes.

I was under the impression that this was one or two people, not the entire nation.

CCP =/= China

[Ganos Lao]

Pretty much.

There's also those claims about the ROC still being the legitimate owners of Taiwan, which is why Mongolia and Taiwan have no relations. It was only in 2002 that Taiwan recognized Mongolia as an independent country with subsequent measures taken later on to reflect that in official maps and such. The ROC also tried to prevent Mongolia joining the UN, leaving Mongolia excluded from the UN until 1960, when the Soviet Union announced that unless Mongolia was admitted, it would block the admission of all of the newly independent African states.

Faced with this pressure, the ROC relented under protest.

Well, to be fair, Nationalist China - at that time the actual owner of Mongolia - was not consulted about the disposition of same at the Yalta Conference. The entire cavalier affair smacked of imperialism, to be perfectly honest - three old, sick men sitting at a luxury resort deciding the fate of nations at the hands of their respective Empires.

But you recognize the Mongolia of today as being legitimately independent, right?

[Vetalia]

Haha, if Italy were to use the same dumbass argument as the Chinese government (and we all know they're the ones behind this) they'd have claim to pretty much all of Western Europe, North Africa and Asia Minor along with a bit of the Middle East and Ukraine for good measure.

Of course, on the upside it'd likely take care of their budget problems and revive the original European Union.

[Czechanada]

In before the wrath of Nervun.

[Pingxiang]

WTH? Okinawa has been Japanese forever, and will be till kingdom come.
U just wrong, China.

Japanese since about 1869, you mean, right? Before that it was an independent tributary of a Daimyo in Kyushu, yet also paid tribute to Chinese rulers.

First, Okinawans were there own people with there own culture. But early on they were affected in a good way by China. Thus, early on China had a bigger affect on Okinawan culture.

China was friendly to Okinawans

The Chinese and Okinawans began their relationship, officially, in 1372 when Okinawa's King Satto formed an alliance with the Ming Emperor of China. This alliance would increase the Chinese influence on Okinawa. Then in 1392, as part of a cultural exchange, 36 Chinese families immigrated to Okinawa and settled in a village outside of Naha named Kume. It is known that among the immigrants from China, there were experts in Chinese kempo that helped to build the interest in the martial arts among the Okinawans.

Japanese in time trades with Okinawans. Everything was good until the Japanese decided to become very unfriendly to Okinawans.

The Ryukyu Kingdom expanded and prospered through trade with China, Asia, Korea, and Japan until 1609, when the Satsuma Clan, led by the Shimazu Family, from Kyushu in southern Japan, invaded the island. The Satsuma Clan reinforced the weapons edict and proceeded to milk Okinawa. Okinawa began to be Japanised, meaning that Okinawan customs were foreign, unacceptable and therefor worthy of change. During this time, it was not only illegal to own a weapon, but it was also breaking the law should one be caught making a fist during a disagreement. This is also the time when Okinawan martial arts had to be practiced in secret, which resulted in very little written history and most of that which was written was destroyed during the Battle of Okinawa in 1945.

From another source

In 1609, frustrated by Okinawa's refusal to recognize the new Japanese Shogunate, an army of Satsuma clansman invaded Okinawa and crushed the island's defenses.

I have not even mentioned when in the early 20 century the people of those islands were forced to pay more taxes then other parts of Japan at a time that those islands were in an economic crisis.

I should mention that before the founding of the Ryukyu Kingdom, that those islands were divided into three Kingdoms.

In 1429, an Okinawan, by the name of Sho Hashi, united what was known as the three kingdoms: Hokuzan (north), Chuzan (middle), and Nanzan (south), and made his capital in the city of Shuri.

And do not forget this

karate, which is Okinawan, is based on indigenous techniques and techniques acquired from Chinese boxing.

You see Chinese not Japanese influenced the Ryukyu Kingdom.

So it seems the US liberated what use to be the Ryukyu Kingdom only to give them back to Japan.