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Are homosexuals really born that way?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Is there a gay gene?

Yes
218
33%
No
231
35%
More study is needed to determine
209
32%
 
Total votes : 658

User avatar
Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:14 am

Mirage wrote:And not those three , but something that actually have evidence supporting your claim.

Mirage wrote:
Just because you say that doesn't make it true.
Last edited by Mavorpen on Thu May 16, 2013 10:15 am, edited 2 times in total.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Neo Art
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Posts: 14258
Founded: Jan 09, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Neo Art » Thu May 16, 2013 10:15 am

Choronzon wrote:
Mirage wrote:
I skim through things remember ? Tell me what part you would prefer i "read".

So, because you are lazy we should spoon feed you information?


Just breath, and remember, it'll be september soon.
if you were Batman you'd be home by now

"Consistency is a matter we are attempting to remedy." - Dread Lady Nathinaca

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Esternial
Technical Moderator
 
Posts: 54369
Founded: May 09, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Esternial » Thu May 16, 2013 10:15 am

EnragedMaldivians wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:Yes it does. In every single study performed, choice was not a factor. If you can find one on that link that lists choice as a factor, be my guest.


He doesn't read. He skims; remember?

I prefer semi-skimmed, personally.

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Neo Art
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Posts: 14258
Founded: Jan 09, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Neo Art » Thu May 16, 2013 10:16 am

Esternial wrote:
EnragedMaldivians wrote:
He doesn't read. He skims; remember?

I prefer semi-skimmed, personally.


I've always gone for 2%
if you were Batman you'd be home by now

"Consistency is a matter we are attempting to remedy." - Dread Lady Nathinaca

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Mirage
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Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:17 am

Anachronous Rex wrote:Someone's never heard of epigenetics.


My understanding of it is not that detailed, but how does it invalidate choice in this case ?

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Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
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Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:18 am

Mirage wrote:
Anachronous Rex wrote:Someone's never heard of epigenetics.


My understanding of it is not that detailed, but how does it invalidate choice in this case ?

Psst. If you want to claim you skimmed a source, don't ask a question that's answered in the source.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Anachronous Rex
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Posts: 6312
Founded: Mar 14, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Anachronous Rex » Thu May 16, 2013 10:20 am

Mirage wrote:
Anachronous Rex wrote:Someone's never heard of epigenetics.


My understanding of it is not that detailed, but how does it invalidate choice in this case ?

They said genetics weren't the only factor. Which is sort of a redundant thing to say, because they almost never are.

To provide a slightly insulting comparison: Schizophrenia is not purely genetic. It is definitely linked to genetics, but genetics alone do not cause it.

Now what you just did is take that, "genetics alone do not cause it" bit, and read it to mean "so it could be a choice!"
Last edited by Anachronous Rex on Thu May 16, 2013 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
My humor is like church wine: dry and tasteless.
If you are not sure if I am being serious, assume that I am not.

Summer is coming...

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Mirage
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Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:20 am

Mavorpen wrote:
Mirage wrote:
My understanding of it is not that detailed, but how does it invalidate choice in this case ?

Psst. If you want to claim you skimmed a source, don't ask a question that's answered in the source.


That wasn't a source. Nvm, with you things that are not true are true, turth is lie, basically something that is in no way evidence is evidence and now this.

User avatar
Esternial
Technical Moderator
 
Posts: 54369
Founded: May 09, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Esternial » Thu May 16, 2013 10:20 am

Neo Art wrote:
Esternial wrote:I prefer semi-skimmed, personally.


I've always gone for 2%

Ugh, you make me sick.

Mirage wrote:
Anachronous Rex wrote:Someone's never heard of epigenetics.


My understanding of it is not that detailed, but how does it invalidate choice in this case ?

The same way how a crocodile doesn't get to choose whether or not they grow a penis.
Last edited by Esternial on Thu May 16, 2013 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:22 am

Mirage wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:Psst. If you want to claim you skimmed a source, don't ask a question that's answered in the source.


That wasn't a source. Nvm, with you things that are not true are true, turth is lie, basically something that is in no way evidence is evidence and now this.

So now the Wikipedia article isn't a source because it proves you wrong.

That sounds oddly familiar.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

User avatar
Mirage
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Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:23 am

Anachronous Rex wrote:
Mirage wrote:
My understanding of it is not that detailed, but how does it invalidate choice in this case ?

They said genetics weren't the only factor. Which is sort of a redundant thing to say, because they almost never are.

To provide a slightly insulting comparison: Schizophrenia is not purely genetic. It is definitely linked to genetics, but genetics alone do not cause it.

Now what you just did is take that, "genetics alone do not cause it" bit, and read it to mean "so it could be a choice!"


Yes, you are right. The exact cause is unclear and choice has not been taken out as a possibility or factor and hence i said that could be a factor or even the cause.

User avatar
Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:24 am

Mirage wrote:
Anachronous Rex wrote:They said genetics weren't the only factor. Which is sort of a redundant thing to say, because they almost never are.

To provide a slightly insulting comparison: Schizophrenia is not purely genetic. It is definitely linked to genetics, but genetics alone do not cause it.

Now what you just did is take that, "genetics alone do not cause it" bit, and read it to mean "so it could be a choice!"


Yes, you are right. The exact cause is unclear and choice has not been taken out as a possibility or factor and hence i said that could be a factor or even the cause.

Find one peer reviewed source that states choice is a factor.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Mirage
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:24 am

Mavorpen wrote:
Mirage wrote:
That wasn't a source. Nvm, with you things that are not true are true, turth is lie, basically something that is in no way evidence is evidence and now this.

So now the Wikipedia article isn't a source because it proves you wrong.

That sounds oddly familiar.


Show the link to wiki article in A.rex's post i replied to and i will give you a cookie.

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Esternial
Technical Moderator
 
Posts: 54369
Founded: May 09, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Esternial » Thu May 16, 2013 10:25 am

Mavorpen wrote:
Mirage wrote:
Yes, you are right. The exact cause is unclear and choice has not been taken out as a possibility or factor and hence i said that could be a factor or even the cause.

Find one peer reviewed source that states choice is a factor.

We don't have enough evidence to say anything with enough certainty. It's all speculative, and choice may or may not be a factor in several cases.

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Mirage
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Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:25 am

Mavorpen wrote:Find one peer reviewed source that states choice is a factor.


I don't have to. I only said it is what i "believe" it to be, not that that is what it is. You are the one making the claim here.

User avatar
Of the Free Socialist Territories
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8370
Founded: Feb 12, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Of the Free Socialist Territories » Thu May 16, 2013 10:25 am

Mirage wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:So now the Wikipedia article isn't a source because it proves you wrong.

That sounds oddly familiar.


Show the link to wiki article in A.rex's post i replied to and i will give you a cookie.


It was my article. it was this bit, in the article.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_an ... cs_studies

Jesus Christ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetic ... osexuality
Last edited by Of the Free Socialist Territories on Thu May 16, 2013 10:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
Don't be deceived when our Revolution has finally been stamped out and they tell you things are better now even if there's no poverty to see, because the poverty's been hidden...even if you ever got more wages and could afford to buy more of these new and useless goods which these new industries foist on you, and even if it seems to you that "you never had so much" - that is only the slogan of those who have much more than you.

Marat, "Marat/Sade"

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Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:26 am

Mirage wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:So now the Wikipedia article isn't a source because it proves you wrong.

That sounds oddly familiar.


Show the link to wiki article in A.rex's post i replied to and i will give you a cookie.

Why would I do that when I didn't say he gave a link to Wikipedia in that post. I know you're so used to lying, but don't put words into my mouth.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Of the Free Socialist Territories
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8370
Founded: Feb 12, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Of the Free Socialist Territories » Thu May 16, 2013 10:27 am

Mirage wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:Find one peer reviewed source that states choice is a factor.


I don't have to. I only said it is what i "believe" it to be, not that that is what it is. You are the one making the claim here.


Beliefs aren't things that are magically unable to be proven wrong, and your willingness to hold a belief that is, bluntly, shite, is not something to be proud of.
Don't be deceived when our Revolution has finally been stamped out and they tell you things are better now even if there's no poverty to see, because the poverty's been hidden...even if you ever got more wages and could afford to buy more of these new and useless goods which these new industries foist on you, and even if it seems to you that "you never had so much" - that is only the slogan of those who have much more than you.

Marat, "Marat/Sade"

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Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:27 am

Mirage wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:Find one peer reviewed source that states choice is a factor.


I don't have to. I only said it is what i "believe" it to be, not that that is what it is. You are the one making the claim here.

Mirage wrote:Yes, you are right. The exact cause is unclear and choice has not been taken out as a possibility or factor and hence i said that could be a factor or even the cause.

Still lying?
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Mirage
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Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:30 am

Of the Free Socialist Territories wrote:
Mirage wrote:
Show the link to wiki article in A.rex's post i replied to and i will give you a cookie.


It was my article. it was this bit, in the article.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_an ... cs_studies

Jesus Christ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetic ... osexuality


Esternial wrote:We don't have enough evidence to say anything with enough certainty. It's all speculative, and choice may or may not be a factor in several cases.

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Russadonia
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Posts: 377
Founded: Apr 06, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Russadonia » Thu May 16, 2013 10:31 am

Mirage wrote:
Mavorpen wrote:Find one peer reviewed source that states choice is a factor.


I don't have to. I only said it is what i "believe" it to be, not that that is what it is. You are the one making the claim here.


I have an idea. Go actually talk to some gays and ask them what they think. In fact, live among them for a bit. Participant-Observation is really the best tool in this matter since you ignore their other sources.

You'd definitely learn soon enough.

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Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:31 am

Mirage wrote:
Of the Free Socialist Territories wrote:
It was my article. it was this bit, in the article.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_an ... cs_studies

Jesus Christ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetic ... osexuality


Esternial wrote:We don't have enough evidence to say anything with enough certainty. It's all speculative, and choice may or may not be a factor in several cases.

Source that claim.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Mirage
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 445
Founded: May 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mirage » Thu May 16, 2013 10:32 am

Russadonia wrote:
Mirage wrote:
I don't have to. I only said it is what i "believe" it to be, not that that is what it is. You are the one making the claim here.


I have an idea. Go actually talk to some gays and ask them what they think. In fact, live among them for a bit. Participant-Observation is really the best tool in this matter since you ignore their other sources.

You'd definitely learn soon enough.


One of my best friends is one. We met about 5 years ago.

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Of the Free Socialist Territories
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8370
Founded: Feb 12, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Of the Free Socialist Territories » Thu May 16, 2013 10:33 am

Mirage wrote:
Of the Free Socialist Territories wrote:
It was my article. it was this bit, in the article.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_an ... cs_studies

Jesus Christ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetic ... osexuality


Esternial wrote:We don't have enough evidence to say anything with enough certainty. It's all speculative, and choice may or may not be a factor in several cases.


So one person on the Internet's opinion now outweighs scientific research, because they agree with you and the research doesn't.

:roll:
Don't be deceived when our Revolution has finally been stamped out and they tell you things are better now even if there's no poverty to see, because the poverty's been hidden...even if you ever got more wages and could afford to buy more of these new and useless goods which these new industries foist on you, and even if it seems to you that "you never had so much" - that is only the slogan of those who have much more than you.

Marat, "Marat/Sade"

User avatar
Mavorpen
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63266
Founded: Dec 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Thu May 16, 2013 10:33 am

Mavorpen wrote:
Mirage wrote:
I don't have to. I only said it is what i "believe" it to be, not that that is what it is. You are the one making the claim here.

Mirage wrote:Yes, you are right. The exact cause is unclear and choice has not been taken out as a possibility or factor and hence i said that could be a factor or even the cause.

Still lying?

I get the feeling you're going to ignore this.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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