They make *what* for kids!?

[Lunatic Goofballs]

The second amendment doesn't apply to state militias. It applies to people. Or more specifically, it applies to government by depriving them of the power to restrict a certain right.

Yes. They can't restrict the right for a state to form a militia. Which means it applies to state militias. I'm not sure why this is such a significant distinction.

States aren't even mentioned in the second amendment. They have nothing to do with it:

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

We already defined the militia: All able-bodied men between the age of 17 and 45. We already established that the right to bear arms applies to people, and not people in the militia. I don't understand where state militias fit into your concept of gun rights.

Being a part of a state militia makes as much and as little difference in gun rights as being a member of the Bacon Appreciation Club.

[Big Jim P]

If I could afford the cost, I would own several different full-auto guns.

for . . .shooting ranges? gods the ammo costs alone *shudders*

I had the chance to purchas an m-60 several years ago. $8500 for the gun, $200 for the transfer stamp, gods know how much for the background check, and ammo costing around $1 a round. At 550 rounds a minute.

[DaWoad]

... why would anyone want that . . .ever.

Because of the pigs.

I hear they are vicious but a mini-gun seems like overkill . . .or at least excessive time between "engaging targets" and "reloading"


... unless you're talking about cops in which case, I really don't think you should be anywhere near any gun much less those.

[Occupied Deutschland]

And so the gun thread ends as they always do. With gunfapping.

It's practically a tradition by now, honestly.

Admit it, you'd be sad if it didn't happen.

[Thoricia]

can i ask why?

Why not?

Those are just my pistols.

I see no pocket pistols or big ass revolvers, your missing important pieces of your collection, what type of lugers are those if I may inquire.

[Paddy O Fernature]

And so the gun thread ends as they always do. With gunfapping.

Just for you. Try not to jam the action with excessive amounts of lube.

[Farnhamia]

And so the gun thread ends as they always do. With gunfapping.

It's practically a tradition by now, honestly.

Admit it, you'd be sad if it didn't happen.

Sad? No, but it wouldn't feel right.

[DaWoad]

for . . .shooting ranges? gods the ammo costs alone *shudders*

I had the chance to purchas an m-60 several years ago. $8500 for the gun, $200 for the transfer stamp, gods know how much for the background check, and ammo costing around $1 a round. At 550 rounds a minute.

you could blow your yearly paycheck in . . .a matter of hours (cooing/ switching out barrels). That's . . . just impressive.

[DaWoad]

And so the gun thread ends as they always do. With gunfapping.

Just for you. Try not to jam the action with excessive amounts of lube.

target pistol? ridiculous stock to help with recoil and sighting?

[Big Jim P]

I had the chance to purchas an m-60 several years ago. $8500 for the gun, $200 for the transfer stamp, gods know how much for the background check, and ammo costing around $1 a round. At 550 rounds a minute.

you could blow your yearly paycheck in . . .a matter of hours (cooing/ switching out barrels). That's . . . just impressive.

Ja. A littlwe out of my price range. And think about this: miniguns spit out ammo at 3000-12000 rounds a minute.

[Big Jim P]

Just for you. Try not to jam the action with excessive amounts of lube.

target pistol? ridiculous stock to help with recoil and sighting?

Mauser C-96, most recognizable as the gun Han Solos blaster was modeled on.

[Thoricia]

Because of the pigs.

I hear they are vicious but a mini-gun seems like overkill . . .or at least excessive time between "engaging targets" and "reloading"


... unless you're talking about cops in which case, I really don't think you should be anywhere near any gun much less those.

I read the first part and I thought you got it and then you regressed into calling cops pigs, for shame.


Pigs are a very nasty growing problem and are one of the hardest animals to hunt, something that quickly overwhelms them with a fast rate of fire is required. *nods*

[DaWoad]

you could blow your yearly paycheck in . . .a matter of hours (cooing/ switching out barrels). That's . . . just impressive.

Ja. A littlwe out of my price range. And think about this: miniguns spit out ammo at 3000-12000 rounds a minute.

welp, on the plus side you'd have o really wanna kill yourtarget. Accuracy issues aside, If you're shooting three thousand dollars at something/one you really want it dead.

[YellowApple]

Can it not apply to both people and state militias? I'm still not seeing why it has to be one or the other.

Really? Why did you see only this post and not my other ones where I said that it applies to both, but only to individuals in the context of preserving a militia. Dammit, is this a conspiracy?

There Is No Cabal™.

[Big Jim P]

Ja. A littlwe out of my price range. And think about this: miniguns spit out ammo at 3000-12000 rounds a minute.

welp, on the plus side you'd have o really wanna kill yourtarget. Accuracy issues aside, If you're shooting three thousand dollars at something/one you really want it dead.

Indeed.

[DaWoad]

I hear they are vicious but a mini-gun seems like overkill . . .or at least excessive time between "engaging targets" and "reloading"


... unless you're talking about cops in which case, I really don't think you should be anywhere near any gun much less those.

I read the first part and I thought you got it and then you regressed into calling cops pigs, for shame.


Pigs are a very nasty growing problem and are one of the hardest animals to hunt, something that quickly overwhelms them with a fast rate of fire is required. *nods*

three thousand dollar pests *shakes head* good god man, an airstrike starts to look cheap by comparison.

[Thoricia]

I read the first part and I thought you got it and then you regressed into calling cops pigs, for shame.


Pigs are a very nasty growing problem and are one of the hardest animals to hunt, something that quickly overwhelms them with a fast rate of fire is required. *nods*

three thousand dollar pests *shakes head* good god man, an airstrike starts to look cheap by comparison.

5.56 ammos not that expensive, you can get surplus for cheap, getting it is the problem.

If I could afford a Apache I would go that route.

[DaWoad]

three thousand dollar pests *shakes head* good god man, an airstrike starts to look cheap by comparison.

5.56 ammos not that expensive, you can get surplus for cheap, getting it is the problem.

it is when you've got a rate of fire of 12000 rounds per minute.

[Paddy O Fernature]

Why not?

Those are just my pistols.

I see no pocket pistols or big ass revolvers, your missing important pieces of your collection, what type of lugers are those if I may inquire.

And for good reason. I have taste when it comes to my firearm selection.

The luger that caught your eye, is a 100% matching 1916 (WW1) pistol in roughly low 90% condition. I'm actually shocked that I can't find my close up of it anywhere.

[Thoricia]

5.56 ammos not that expensive, you can get surplus for cheap, getting it is the problem.

it is when you've got a rate of fire of 12000 rounds per minute.

Burst fire my friend.

[Mavorpen]

States aren't even mentioned in the second amendment. They have nothing to do with it:

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

We already defined the militia: All able-bodied men between the age of 17 and 45. We already established that the right to bear arms applies to people, and not people in the militia. I don't understand where state militias fit into your concept of gun rights.

Being a part of a state militia makes as much and as little difference in gun rights as being a member of the Bacon Appreciation Club.

Okay. I see the problem. You're reading it literally. And with utterly no historical context at all. That's fine for dicking around, but serves utterly no purpose other than that. In order to interpret the Second Amendment, you need a historical context. So, let's begin with the definition of a militia in the context of the Second Amendment.

The Founder's definition of the militia in context of the creation of the Second Amendment was outlined as follows by Tench Coxe:

The militia of these free commonwealths, entitled and accustomed to their arms, when compared with any possible army, must be tremendous and irresistible. Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom. Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ...the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.
The militia, who are in fact the effective part of the people at large, will render many troops quite unnecessary. They will form a powerful check upon the regular troops, and will generally be sufficient to over-awe them.
Whereas civil rulers, not having their duty to the people duly before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as military forces, which must be occasionally raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow citizens, the people are confirmed by the article in their right to keep and bear their private arms.

What you are citing came a year after the Second Amendment was adopted, and actually had nothing to do with defining what a militia was in context to it. Rather, it was only meant to define what a Militia is as to allow the Congress the power to "provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining the Militia." It is therefore irrelevant for interpreting the Second Amendment as was intended.

Regarding the State militia, it's pretty damn clear that it was designed to refer to State militias. This is outlined by Article VI of the Articles of Confederation.

"...every State shall always keep up a well-regulated and disciplined militia, sufficiently armed and accoutered, and shall provide and constantly have ready for use, in public stores, a due number of filed pieces and tents, and a proper quantity of arms, ammunition and camp equipage."

The Bill of Rights in general were proposed to only appease the Federalists in the first place; the majority of them believed them to be unnecessary. And what was a major concern among them? Not the individual right to privately own arms. No, instead they were concerned with the federal government overreaching its power concerning the militia, citing the English Militia Act of 1661 as an example of what would happen should the federal government infringe upon the ability of states to have militias.

So what have we learned?

1) The "militia" does is not defined by the Militia Act of 1792 as you claim, seeing as it does not apply to the Second Amendment.
2) State militias is quite clearly the focus of the meaning behind "militia" in the text.

I would advise you not ignore historical context when interpreting things such as the Constitution.

[Thoricia]

I see no pocket pistols or big ass revolvers, your missing important pieces of your collection, what type of lugers are those if I may inquire.

And for good reason. I have taste when it comes to my firearm selection.

The luger that caught your eye, is a 100% matching 1916 (WW1) pistol in roughly low 90% condition. I'm actually shocked that I can't find my close up of it anywhere.

Ah you seem to think not having a mobile artillery piece makes you sophisticated huh. I'll have you know a .357 is essential in my neighborhood (and that's the little revolver).

I like the look of lugers for some reason.

[DaWoad]

it is when you've got a rate of fire of 12000 rounds per minute.

Burst fire my friend.

even then, depress the trigger for half a seocnd and you fire 100 rounds *shakes head*

[Thoricia]

Burst fire my friend.

even then, depress the trigger for half a seocnd and you fire 100 rounds *shakes head*

It also helps mow the crop field that the pigs are in, multiple applications *nods*

[Gauthier]

Join the circle jerk.

Join us, Joe.

And this is why we can't have nice things.

If domestic terrorists ever managed to do Mumbai Style in the U.S. and a thread was made about it, it would still end with talks about who has what gun and just how awesome it is. Might even have someone call for a 21 Gun Salute.