Canadian Woman Forbidden to Wear Niqab in Court

[Al-Quarra]

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

[Luziyca]

It is not like the niqab is the only type of veil. She can wear say, a chador.

[New Chalcedon]

So let's just declare open rape season against Muslim women who want to respect their culture while protecting themselves from assault?

Please show me the verse in the Qu'ran that requires women to wear the full niqab. You won't, because it doesn't exist. Here's what Mohammad had to say about female modesty:

Narrated 'Aisha (the Prophet's wife): Asma, daughter of Abu Bakr, entered upon the Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) wearing thin clothes. The Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) turned his attention from her. He said: 'O Asma, when a woman reaches the age of menstruation, it does not suit her that she displays her parts of body except this and this, and he pointed to his face and hands.

Mohammad had no problem with women showing their faces in public - the face-veil is a cultural requirement generally found in various parts of the Middle East and North Africa, not a religious one.

And last time I checked, defendants enjoyed certain rights in any civilized country - among them the right to confront (in a modern court, this means "get their lawyer to cross-examine") their accusers, and a ban on anonymous testimony. Anything that unreasonably hinders this is an attack on due process for the sake of political correctness.

So let's just declare open rape season against Muslim women who want to respect their culture while protecting themselves from assault?

I think her right to religious practice ends where the defendant's right to face his accuser begins.
Gets in the way of cross examination, prevents the jury from reading facial expressions fully.

Oh, but you're being an Islamophobe and a rape enabler, dont'cha know? How dare you insist that the principles of the law apply equally when an Islamic woman is the complainant?

I must agree with the Court's reasoning on this matter. Religious convictions does not make one above the law.

It's less a matter of "above the law", and more an ideal of the law treating everyone - irrespective of religion - equally.

Non-Muslim rape victims must show their faces when being cross-examined by the defendants' counsel - therefore, so should Muslim rape victims. Equal treatment in the courts of law is all-important to the pursuit of justice.

[The Joseon Dynasty]

It's less a matter of "above the law", and more an ideal of the law treating everyone - irrespective of religion - equally.

We don't need to be that blunt, though. Cultural accomodations can be made in the interest of equality, too, by ensuring that everyone is accorded a level of comfort in their legal proceedings, consistent with their, perhaps culturally-derived, perception of "comfort". When those accomodations are thought to sufficiently interrupt or impede the functionality of that legal process, then we cease to accomodate.

[Kemalist]

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

Niqab symbolizes the degradation of women. Muslim women should free themselves from these chains.

[New Chalcedon]

It's less a matter of "above the law", and more an ideal of the law treating everyone - irrespective of religion - equally.

We don't need to be that blunt, though. Cultural accomodations can be made in the interest of equality, too, by ensuring that everyone is accorded a level of comfort in their legal proceedings, consistent with their, perhaps culturally-derived, perception of "comfort". When those accomodations are thought to sufficiently interrupt or impede the functionality of that legal process, then we cease to accomodate.

That's fine by me - however, I draw the line at allowing the outcome of trials to be determined by what amounts to masked, faceless accusers due to "cultural accommodation" of dress-codes.

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

And this has what, again, to do with the subject of the thread?

[Ainin]

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

Stop right there. The Generalite Department of Logical Fallacies would like to have a chat with you.

[The Joseon Dynasty]

We don't need to be that blunt, though. Cultural accomodations can be made in the interest of equality, too, by ensuring that everyone is accorded a level of comfort in their legal proceedings, consistent with their, perhaps culturally-derived, perception of "comfort". When those accomodations are thought to sufficiently interrupt or impede the functionality of that legal process, then we cease to accomodate.

That's fine by me - however, I draw the line at allowing the outcome of trials to be determined by what amounts to masked, faceless accusers due to "cultural accommodation" of dress-codes.

Fair enough. I agree with the decision in this case, too.

[Marcurix]

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

When you move to a different country you have to be prepared for cultural differences-and accommodate accordingly. The Niqab has been deemed as something that would interfere with legal proceedings and thus it must be removed. That's not a loss of freedom.

[Dulkadar]

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

If you hate freedom so much. Fucking leave the country. We're better off without you.

[Mauretania Tingitana]

"When in Rome..."

[Wamitoria]

I just noticed that the "Freedom" of the western world starts to fade away... more and more news about people being arrested or forced into something becouse/against their culture/religion... If this continues we go back to the old days of Dictators and Kings.

If you hate freedom so much. Fucking leave the country. We're better off without you.

Are you even Canadian?

[Dulkadar]

If you hate freedom so much. Fucking leave the country. We're better off without you.

Are you even Canadian?

Yep, Live in St John's. Yourself?

[Ainin]

Are you even Canadian?

Yep, Live in St John's. Yourself?

The St John's in Nova Scotia or Newfieland?

[Wamitoria]

Are you even Canadian?

Yep, Live in St John's. Yourself?

Huh. Thought you were European for some reason.

No, I'm American.

[Luziyca]

Yep, Live in St John's. Yourself?

The St John's in Nova Scotia or Newfieland?

Nah. Everyone knows all Canadian NSers live in Saskatoon.

[Dulkadar]

Yep, Live in St John's. Yourself?

The St John's in Nova Scotia or Newfieland?

There is no St John's in Nova Scotia, that would be St John. Without the 's

[Luziyca]

The St John's in Nova Scotia or Newfieland?

There is no St John's in Nova Scotia, that would be St John. Without the 's

He meant Saint John's, New Brunswick, silly.

[Ainin]

The St John's in Nova Scotia or Newfieland?

There is no St John's in Nova Scotia, that would be St John. Without the 's

*New Brunswick

There's no St John['s] at all in Nova Scotia. Sorry about that.

Also, I never realized that. Thanks for the clarification.

[Dulkadar]

"When in Rome..."

Except in Canada, you're suppose to be whatever you are (unless you're the Majority, because whites are evil)

"When in Rome..."

Pillage it, siege it, install a King and try to Germanize sell curry in the area.

Fix'd

There is no St John's in Nova Scotia, that would be St John. Without the 's

*New Brunswick

There's no St John['s] at all in Nova Scotia. Sorry about that.

Also, I never realized that. Thanks for the clarification.

Ah, Nova Scotia, NB, basically the same shit

[Luziyca]

"When in Rome..."

Pillage it, siege it, install a King and try to Germanize the area.

[Terraius]

I defy someone to cite the surrah and verse of the Qur'an that mandates Islamic women cover their faces.

[Terraius]

"When in Rome..."

Pillage it, siege it, install a King and try to Germanize the area.

Then convert to Catholicism, be crowned Roman Emperor, rinse, repeat.

SHIT! Foiled again by those silly popes and their silly hats.

[Democratic Koyro]

Good.

[Risottia]

Courtesy of AJE

A Canadian woman filing charges of sexual assault will be required to remove her niqab to testify against her alleged attackers. On Wednesday, a Toronto judge ruled that the woman's niqab (or face veil) “masks her demeanour and blocks...effective cross-examination by counsel for the accused".

Makes only sense. People have to be recognized and identified in judiciary proceedings.