General Cricket (not the chirpy kind) Discussion Thread

[DesAnges]

Stuart Broad finishes with match figures of 11/121, his career Test best. Nine Australian wickets fell after tea.

43-10-121-11, SR of 23.45 and Average of 11.00. That's some quality bowling.

[Cyborg Holland]

I really can't believe what has happened. A few hours ago England had no chance. A shame for the Aussies - 3-0 is a bit harsh on them for the way they've fought back since the second test.

Mmmm...Lord's was the only real blip in what has otherwise been my favourite series since 2005 (memories are kinda sketchy), with constantly twisting cricket in every game.

Here's to a great one at the Oval!

[AiliailiA]

Openers should have good averages??

Your previous posts led me to believe that you actually play cricket. ??



Decent batting average. Bowling though ... no comparison with Botham and inferior to Watson.



Why not just admit that you hate him for something that happened off the field, and now you're gloating because he was injured in this match and then failed with the bat?




I got a bit heated when Khawaja was given out by the third umpire (when he plainly wasn't, which no-one disputes now). Another poster advised me to cool it, so I did.
That poster wasn't YOU. If you'd told me to cool it, I'd have told you to fuck off. You're the worst kind of sports fan, the kind who sulks when your side is losing (that's excusable) but does your best to make the opponent feel bad when your side is winning. That's not excusable: it bespeaks someone who gains more satisfaction from others losing than from you winning. It is, in a word, nasty.

Hey, hey, I meant no mean intention, that's not how I do things. I'm a naturally negative person, and having grown up with total Australian domination and a s**t English team, I think I'm granted a bit of banter when we finally start performing on a repetitive basis. And how exactly am I making you feel bad. OK, my post about it must feel bad to be an Aussie, and that could be misconstrued as a gloat, but trust me, it wasn't, and I never meant it to be.

There are many players I dislike, Watson is one of them. Jade Dernbach, Dale Steyn, Jonny Bairstow to name three, but all for Cricket reasons. I harbour no prejudices against him, and nowhere did I post anything along the lines of "Oh I'm so glad Watson is injured" or "I'm so glad that Watson in particular failed with the bat."

Well OK. You seemed to have a particular aminus towards Watson, but perhaps you speak the same of many other players if they're the subject of discussion. You do seem to always favor the up-and-coming players over the veterans, which is a respectable position.

I'm not sure what you mean by "Cricket reasons" but if it's anything to do with fair play, I hope you'll join me in congratulating Kevin Pietersen for walking when he knew he'd nicked the ball and saw it into the keeper's gloves. It's always been good form to walk, and particularly so now that it may cost the opposing team a DRS appeal.

[Cyborg Holland]

Hey, hey, I meant no mean intention, that's not how I do things. I'm a naturally negative person, and having grown up with total Australian domination and a s**t English team, I think I'm granted a bit of banter when we finally start performing on a repetitive basis. And how exactly am I making you feel bad. OK, my post about it must feel bad to be an Aussie, and that could be misconstrued as a gloat, but trust me, it wasn't, and I never meant it to be.

There are many players I dislike, Watson is one of them. Jade Dernbach, Dale Steyn, Jonny Bairstow to name three, but all for Cricket reasons. I harbour no prejudices against him, and nowhere did I post anything along the lines of "Oh I'm so glad Watson is injured" or "I'm so glad that Watson in particular failed with the bat."

Well OK. You seemed to have a particular aminus towards Watson, but perhaps you speak the same of many other players if they're the subject of discussion. You do seem to always favor the up-and-coming players over the veterans, which is a respectable position.

I'm not sure what you mean by "Cricket reasons" but if it's anything to do with fair play, I hope you'll join me in congratulating Kevin Pietersen for walking when he knew he'd nicked the ball and saw it into the keeper's gloves. It's always been good form to walk, and particularly so now that it may cost the opposing team a DRS appeal.

By "Cricket reasons" I mean reasons to do with the game skills wise. Jade Dernbach because except for the last over he's terrible, Steyn just bbecause he's so good and Bairstow because he's again, had his chance and hasn't proved himself. And although I was miffed when Pietersen was out, but I completely agree with you about him walking.

[AiliailiA]

I really can't believe what has happened. A few hours ago England had no chance. A shame for the Aussies - 3-0 is a bit harsh on them for the way they've fought back since the second test.

I guess they forgot to change the timezones on their portable devices. They were still on Australian Eastern Standard Time, so they thought it was tuesday. Day five of the Test, and they had to make the 299 runs by stumps.

[Liventia]

Aside from Rogers and Warner, and Clarke's allowed the occasional failure for his otherwise brilliant batting, Australia really need to work in the nets again for the next week. Awful collapse and it may be time to think about Khawaja and Smith again.

[AiliailiA]

Well OK. You seemed to have a particular aminus towards Watson, but perhaps you speak the same of many other players if they're the subject of discussion. You do seem to always favor the up-and-coming players over the veterans, which is a respectable position.

I'm not sure what you mean by "Cricket reasons" but if it's anything to do with fair play, I hope you'll join me in congratulating Kevin Pietersen for walking when he knew he'd nicked the ball and saw it into the keeper's gloves. It's always been good form to walk, and particularly so now that it may cost the opposing team a DRS appeal.

By "Cricket reasons" I mean reasons to do with the game skills wise. Jade Dernbach because except for the last over he's terrible, Steyn just bbecause he's so good and Bairstow because he's again, had his chance and hasn't proved himself. And although I was miffed when Pietersen was out, but I completely agree with you about him walking.

Both teams in this match having foreign-born players, now might be a good time to bring up the question of what attracts talent to a particular country. South Africa (where Pietersen came from, also Kepler Wessles who played for Australia against England) is an interesting case: Wessels emigrated to Australia to play because SA was under cricket embargo (to punish apartheid), whereas Pietersen emigrated because he either disapproved of the racial selection in SA (after apartheid) or because it disadvantaged him personally to play for SA.

Now I'm going to rant a bit. It may be off-topic. Bearing in mind that this thread will continue for the fifth Test.

And now we have Pakistani and Indian born cricketers playing for both countries. Fawad Ahmed for instance, whose Australian citizenship was fast-tracked by an act of the Australian Parliament. It says there, that he played for Aus A against South Africa ... first class but not Test cricket ... but worth noting because he played just two years after arriving as a refugee. He is legally entitled to play for Australia in any Test.

This "sports immigration" is not a new thing. It's been happening in Tennis for decades, and also happens with Athletics. Parents deliberately immigrate with their talented child, to "follow the dream" of their child in sport, and plant them in a fertile environment where they can play the sport fairly and if they're good enough make a career of it. If the kid is really good at it, their career can be extremely lucrative, though I'm sure there are many who end up driving a taxi or working in an office to support their parents.

So what attracts the foreign talent? Well most obviously money. County cricketers don't earn much directly, but they can get endorsements and advertising contracts from local businesses, bringing in money from fans. England and India have the biggest county cricket systems. By rights, India should be the pre-eminent cricketing country, because they have by far the most amateur players, the most county matches and the most county rivalry. But the Indian system is corrupt, and the money goes to support many inferior cricketers based on who their parents are, where they live, and dare I say it: the color of their skin.

Much smaller countries (by total population, and by amateur playing base) can still compete in Test cricket, as long as each country is mostly drawing on its native-born talent. Australia, South Africa, Trinidad and Tobago, Sri Lanka even. With much smaller local funding (fans and sponsors) they can still provide sufficient incentive to the pool of fifty or so players to form a good national team. They're at a disadvantage, but in the case of countries which are both small in population and poor (Sri Lanka, Trinidad and Tobago) it's a very powerful incentive: national players are fantastically rich by local standards, and vaulted onto the national stage in a way no English cricketer could dream of. This keeps amateur players training, keeps them subsidizing their own careers instead of buying a nice car.

But money isn't the only factor. If a young cricketer is dissatisfied with their domestic league, or a parent of promising amateur child is dissatisfied, they don't just go where the money is. They go where they think they'll have a fair chance. Lots of money isn't enough incentive, if it is handed out in corrupt way. The young cricketer, or their parent, wants fair recognition of their talent

Now, everything got screwed up back in the 70's. Western nations got in on the nationalist scheme started by ... yes, the Soviet Union ... to fund elite athletes to win glory for their nation. Government funded Sports Academies to artificially promote talent in particular sports. Including Cricket, though it's not the most blatant example. Athletics is the most obvious (because it is easier to tell if a 7-year-old can run fast or jump high, than it is to tell if they can bat or bowl). How bizarre, that the notionally Communist bloc taught us such a lesson in nationalism and in capitalism, promoting the virtue of individual achievement by government funding of elite sport. And of course, the two weeks of the Olympics or the World Cup of Football or the Tour de France are the two most unhealthy weeks of our lives. We run less when watching elite athletes run, we kick a ball around less while watching "our" team play, and we are more ashamed to trundle up to the shops on our bicycles ... when we are awed and shamed by the sight of elite athletes doing it far better than we can.

I return to my point. Maybe.

There is another factor, besides the money available to play cricket in a country. Besides the respect gained from other citizens, or honored on the Queen's Birthday. It's respect for the domestic league itself, respect for its fairness and respect returned between fans and their team. What you call "Cricket reasons".

I think England stands well to attract talent in the future, by its large and fair domestic league. Yes, England has a sports academy (those are never fair), but in proportion to the domestic league it is smaller than those of Australia or South Africa. Or (excuse me for giggling) the privately funded US league. If it was just about money, the US would dominate Cricket as they do so many other sports. If it was just about amateur base, India would dominate cricket (with Pakistan contesting second place with England)

Finally, don't think that I resent "sports immigration" at all. It's a rather special playing-field, but ultimately it's about freedom of people to seek work where their talents are best rewarded. I'm for free emigration and free immigration, no borders, and that will take while to happen but sports immigration helps it along.

[AiliailiA]

Aside from Rogers and Warner, and Clarke's allowed the occasional failure for his otherwise brilliant batting, Australia really need to work in the nets again for the next week. Awful collapse and it may be time to think about Khawaja and Smith again.

Awful collapse to be sure, but I blame the captain.

150-4 at stumps would have Australia still very strong to win on day 5. Even 150-6 would still be competetive, starting a new day.

Australia played one-day cricket in a Test, and deserved to lose for that.

[Chelta]

I am a prophet...

Australia to win, you heard it here first...

Touch wood!

But I'm not getting too confident just yet. When Australia's top order collapses, it really collapses. No 19-year olds to save us this time, either.

Everything I predict comes true! I predicted England would win this series 3-1 earlier on, so that means the next Test is Australia's.

While I'm at it, I predict Australia win the home series 5-0. Bahaha.

[Liventia]

Impressive stay at the crease for Laura Marsh in the women's ‪‎Ashes‬, finally gone after a 304-ball 55 (343 minutes).

[Nimzonia]

I really can't believe what has happened. A few hours ago England had no chance. A shame for the Aussies - 3-0 is a bit harsh on them for the way they've fought back since the second test.

Mmmm...Lord's was the only real blip in what has otherwise been my favourite series since 2005 (memories are kinda sketchy), with constantly twisting cricket in every game.

I think I prefer completely one-sided matches. Less damaging to my fingernails.

[Liventia]

Top-of-the-league Yorkshire have signed New Zealand all-rounder (if you can call him that) Kane Williamson for the rest of the season to cover for losing Gary Ballance to the England Lions.

At the other end of the table, relegation-threatened Surrey have signed South African opening batsman (and all around top player) Hashim Amla to replace JP Duminy as their overseas player for the rest of the season. That's quite a coup.

In Division Two, Essex have signed India batsman Gautam Gambhir.

[Liventia]

Final day in the women's Test today (worldwide commentary online here), with Australia batting in their second innings to start the day leading by 81 runs. Good to hear Jerusalem at Wormsley too, the Barmy Army trumpeter and a small group are apparently in attendance.

[Liventia]

Two points each for England and Australia in the Women's Ashes series after the Test. Australia are holders but tactical errors meant they had to settle for being held by England. Now three ODIs and three T20Is (worth two points apiece) will decide the series.

[Liventia]

Australia 18-man One Day International and Twenty20 squad to tour England and Scotland:
Michael Clarke (ODI capt), George Bailey (T20 capt), Fawad Ahmed, Nathan Coulter-Nile, James Faulkner, Aaron Finch, Josh Hazlewood, Phillip Hughes, Mitchell Johnson, Shaun Marsh, Glenn Maxwell, Clint McKay, Steven Smith, Mitchell Starc, Adam Voges, Matthew Wade (wk), David Warner, Shane Watson.

[Cyborg Holland]

Tim Bresnan out for the summer

Who's gonna replace him for the last test.

My line up (if I could chose any english players): Cook, Carberry, Trott, Pietersen, Bell, Root, Prior, Broad, Swann, Tremlett, Anderson

[Fartsniffage]

Tim Bresnan out for the summer

Who's gonna replace him for the last test.

My line up (if I could chose any english players): Cook, Carberry, Trott, Pietersen, Bell, Root, Prior, Broad, Swann, Tremlett, Anderson

We should call up Tuffers. I wanna see this again.

[Liventia]

Interesting news from CA: http://www.cricket.com.au/news-list/201 ... ard-update

Means players like Sam Robson can now play state cricket without losing their eligibility to play in county cricket as an English-qualified player. Indeed, Cricinfo is calling this the "Robson Rule".

[Liventia]

After a rain-delayed start to the two-day tour game in Northampton, Gary Ballance has made a century for England Lions. His knock of 104 came off 154 balls, with 15 fours and one six. The Australians have bowled a lot of spin today, with Steve Smith claiming two wickets and Nathan Lyon three (James Faulkner and Mitchell Starc one each).

[Nimzonia]

Every time I check the score in the Lions match, a wicket falls on the very next ball. I can see why cricket is the kind of sport that drives some people mad with superstition.

[Liventia]

Every time I check the score in the Lions match, a wicket falls on the very next ball. I can see why cricket is the kind of sport that drives some people mad with superstition.

Check it often tomorrow then! Stumps on Day 1, Lions 269/7. I suspect they'll declare overnight so the ECB can have a look at the bowling tomorrow. There's a 100-over limit to the innings in any case, and with the new ball due in three overs even if the Lions do bat on they probably won't last too much longer.

[Nimzonia]

Every time I check the score in the Lions match, a wicket falls on the very next ball. I can see why cricket is the kind of sport that drives some people mad with superstition.

Check it often tomorrow then! Stumps on Day 1, Lions 269/7. I suspect they'll declare overnight so the ECB can have a look at the bowling tomorrow.

The ECB wants to look at the bowling of Liam Plunkett?

[Liventia]

Check it often tomorrow then! Stumps on Day 1, Lions 269/7. I suspect they'll declare overnight so the ECB can have a look at the bowling tomorrow.

The ECB wants to look at the bowling of Liam Plunkett?

He wouldn't really be in the squad otherwise though…

[Nimzonia]

The ECB wants to look at the bowling of Liam Plunkett?

He wouldn't really be in the squad otherwise though…

That doesn't make me any less incredulous.

[Liventia]

Aussies have lost two early wickets to be 59/2 at lunch on the second day of the tour match, Cowan caught off Plunkett and Warner stumped off Kerrigan.