Who was the worst American President

[Key West]

George Walker Bush.

Illegitimate elections, YES BOTH OF THEM.
/thread.

The second election wasn't problematic. As for the 9/11 thing, the government might have had all the pieces, but you can only claim it being obvious with the benefit of hindsight.

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSA ... 6-2001.pdf
How could anyone ignore a briefing such as this only months after the USS Cole bombing in Yemen? Or even after the first attempt at the WTC attack in 1993?
Ramzi Yousef's maternal uncle is KAHLID SHEIK MOHAMMED.

As for the 2004 election, I'd rather give you the bird's eye view from Wikipedia versus the editorializing from left wing blogs.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Uni ... #section_1

Yes a user-based encyclopedia is better then the bloggy angst of people you'll shrug off as discredited anyway.

BRB after I switch off my phone to a desktop.

[Mr Rogers Neighbourhood]

I'd say Andrew Jackson is a good candidate here. That whole Trail of Tears thing wasn't the most ethical thing in the world. Also, he was a bit of a douche.

[Merriwhether]

Nixon

Nixon was a guy pinned for problems in his administration he was not responsible for, just like Romney during the election and Obama in recent months. The Presidents can't control their administration every waking moment of every day for four years, and I'd like to see you do a better job as president of that time than Nixon. Not to say that he was good- that would be a bit of an exaggeration, but I would never compare him to the people high on my list of worst presidents.

Hoover has to be pretty high on my list. I'm not sure who would be the worst, but Hoover left the US to rot during the Great Depression, against the people's will at that, because he thought the problem would fix itself like magic. He's the reason I hate laissez-faire policies.
"Old Hickory" Jackson also has to be pretty far up as well. He tap-danced on the constitution like it were a placemat and set up the Spoils System that in its day replaced perfectly good, well-educated government officials that earned their places in government with backwoodsy nutters. He single-handedly corrupted the American Legislature like Caesar peppered the Roman Government with his buddies, except this time in nobody's interest but his own. Not to mention his infamous Trail of Tears.

[The Whispers]

Hoover has to be pretty high on my list. I'm not sure who would be the worst, but Hoover left the US to rot during the Great Depression, against the people's will at that, because he thought the problem would fix itself like magic.

This is not really true. Hoover did actually spend money trying to fix the Great Depression. I don't know why children's history books keep on with this myth, except for the fact that it's much easier to say "Hoover: done fuck all / FDR: done loads" than explain the complexities of the situation.

[Mr Rogers Neighbourhood]

Hoover has to be pretty high on my list. I'm not sure who would be the worst, but Hoover left the US to rot during the Great Depression, against the people's will at that, because he thought the problem would fix itself like magic.

This is not really true. Hoover did actually spend money trying to fix the Great Depression. I don't know why children's history books keep on with this myth, except for the fact that it's much easier to say "Hoover: done fuck all / FDR: done loads" than explain the complexities of the situation.

This is a bit of a classic presidential conundrum. Sometimes the policies of one president really start taking effect during the presidency of the next. Sometimes they fail during the presidency of the next. And a lot of the time the next president is praised/blamed for it. Not saying this is wholly the case for Hoover/FDR at all. FDR fairly obviously drove most of the reform, but saying Hoover did nothing is naive.

[Smoya]

James Buchanan.

Or Millard Filemore. He supported slavery and was the first president to use a toilet.

[Wamitoria]

Bush II. Oh dear god, Bush II.

Although, in all seriousness, James Buchanan or Millard Fillmore. I just feel more strongly about the first because I was alive during his presidency.

[Neo-Assyrian Empire]

I'd have to say that James Buchanan was the worst. He did absolutely nothing to even try to stop the Civil War.

[Freiheit Reich]

19th century: Andrew Jackson: The Indian Expulsion Act which caused the 'Trail of Tears'

20th century: FDR, his 'legacy' of welfare entitlement lives with us today. His wanting a 100% tax rate of income over $20,000 proves how retarded he was. Supported military draft, treated Japanese unfairly (which cause many to have property losses), did not welcome Jewish immigrants

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_A ... erial_loss

Unfriendly to Jewish refugees (he could have given them temp. visas or safetin in refugee camps)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_St._Louis

FDR also supported minimum wage, social security, and other big govt. intervention.

Lincoln and Woodrow Wilson scored poorly as well, I don't know as much about Wilson.

See 'best and worst libertarian presidents'

http://www.sporcle.com/games/McBeergio/abraham-who

[Choronzon]

His wanting a 100% tax rate of income over $20,000 proves how retarded he was.

Source that.

FDR also supported minimum wage, social security, and other big govt. intervention.

Oh noes!

[Agritum]

9/11 was not an inside job.
9/11 was not an inside job.
9/11 was not an inside job.

The poster never said it was. He just said that the gov had knowledge of 9/11. And they did. Clinton's administration left them memos. Bush dropped the ball.

EDIT: Remember this guy?

Problem his, said memo didn't actually directly reference the World Trade Center in any manner, except for the reference to the bombing.

Sure, there are plenty of references of possible hijack attempts by terrorists, or further bombings, but it's all really vague. With this information, they could have as well thought that Al Qaeda would have bumped a plane into the Chrisler building in NY, or maybe bomb the Empire State Building.

But if the point is saying that the Bush Admnistration was shit at noticing said memos and thightening surveillance and security, well, I agree.

[Wamitoria]

The poster never said it was. He just said that the gov had knowledge of 9/11. And they did. Clinton's administration left them memos. Bush dropped the ball.

EDIT: Remember this guy?

Problem his, said memo didn't actually directly reference the World Trade Center in any manner, except for the reference to the bombing.

It, along with CIA intelligence, said that terrorists were planning to hijack commercial aircraft to attack targets in the US.

He could have increased security throughout the country, but he didn't. He fucking dropped the ball.

[Wamitoria]

His wanting a 100% tax rate of income over $20,000 proves how retarded he was.

Source that.

FDR also supported minimum wage, social security, and other big govt. intervention.

Oh noes!

I don't think anyone ever advocated a 100% tax on incomes over $20K.

Huey Long did advocate 100% income tax on incomes over $5 million in the 1930s.

[Nova Res Publica Romanorum]

Problem his, said memo didn't actually directly reference the World Trade Center in any manner, except for the reference to the bombing.

It, along with CIA intelligence, said that terrorists were planning to hijack commercial aircraft to attack targets in the US.

He could have increased security throughout the country, but he didn't. He fucking dropped the ball.

True that, though as far as I understand it, it's not like they knew where or when. Increase security, sure, but it's seldom that simple.

[Agritum]

Problem his, said memo didn't actually directly reference the World Trade Center in any manner, except for the reference to the bombing.

It, along with CIA intelligence, said that terrorists were planning to hijack commercial aircraft to attack targets in the US.

He could have increased security throughout the country, but he didn't. He fucking dropped the ball.

Read the rest of my post, please. I basically said the same thing on the last paragraph. Mi am arguing that the Bush Administration still didn't specifically know that two planes were going to crash into WTC, or that something was going to even happen there.

They just knew that terrorists were brewing a plot, were shit at discovering more/raising security, and couldn't manage to top it from happening.

[The VDNKh]

Reagan, Bush Jr. and Sr. , Nixon, Eisenhower, Johnson,

[Nova Res Publica Romanorum]

Reagan, Bush Jr. and Sr. , Nixon, Eisenhower, Johnson,

What exactly did Eisenhower do so wrong? I mean, he did half-ass civil rights, but really? The worst president? That's a bit of a stretch, unless I'm missing something here.

[Smoya]

Apparently Abe Lincoln was the best president.

[Neo-Assyrian Empire]

Reagan, Bush Jr. and Sr. , Nixon, Eisenhower, Johnson,

What exactly did Eisenhower do so wrong? I mean, he did half-ass civil rights, but really? The worst president? That's a bit of a stretch, unless I'm missing something here.

Exactly! He created the interstates and pulled most of the troops out of Korea in '53, but what did he do wrong, exactly?

[Agritum]

Reagan, Bush Jr. and Sr. , Nixon, Eisenhower, Johnson,

What exactly did Eisenhower do so wrong? I mean, he did half-ass civil rights, but really? The worst president? That's a bit of a stretch, unless I'm missing something here.

I agree. Ike was meh-ish, and quite jingoistic and shitty at foreign policy. However, he did great stuff on the infrastructural level, and his creation of DARPA and NASA is not to underrate.

[Nova Res Publica Romanorum]

Apparently Abe Lincoln was the best president.

Well, there's a lot of mythology surrounding Lincoln. He certainly wasn't the worst president, but in wartime he took some extreme measures that should never have happened. The suspension of habeas corpus comes to mind. People also get this idea that he was this great advocate of civil rights. Not to undermine the importance of the emancipation proclamation, but Lincoln wasn't exactly a civil rights advocate. He said, I believe on multiple occasions, that the white man would always and should always be held superior to the black man. The man was a bonified racist like many in his time. Again, certainly not the worst president, but not the shining example that many people think he was.

[Wamitoria]

Apparently Abe Lincoln was the best president.

Well, there's a lot of mythology surrounding Lincoln. He certainly wasn't the worst president, but in wartime he took some extreme measures that should never have happened. The suspension of habeas corpus comes to mind. People also get this idea that he was this great advocate of civil rights. Not to undermine the importance of the emancipation proclamation, but Lincoln wasn't exactly a civil rights advocate. He said, I believe on multiple occasions, that the white man would always and should always be held superior to the black man. The man was a bonified racist like many in his time. Again, certainly not the worst president, but not the shining example that many people think he was.

Considering the people he imprisoned during the suspension of habeas corpus were secessionists and their allies in Washington, I don't think we can blame him for using all powers available during a time of rebellion.

But when reading anything he said that may have sounded racist, keep in mind that one couldn't be an advocate of complete racial equality during the 1950s, let alone the 1860s.

[Freiheit Reich]

His wanting a 100% tax rate of income over $20,000 proves how retarded he was.

Source that.

FDR also supported minimum wage, social security, and other big govt. intervention.

Oh noes!

Everytime I post this comment on NSG I am asked to source that. Use google, stop being so lazy. If it was hard to find I would source it.

P.S. It is $25,000, I made a mistake.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=16363

[Smoya]

Apparently Abe Lincoln was the best president.

Well, there's a lot of mythology surrounding Lincoln. He certainly wasn't the worst president, but in wartime he took some extreme measures that should never have happened. The suspension of habeas corpus comes to mind. People also get this idea that he was this great advocate of civil rights. Not to undermine the importance of the emancipation proclamation, but Lincoln wasn't exactly a civil rights advocate. He said, I believe on multiple occasions, that the white man would always and should always be held superior to the black man. The man was a bonified racist like many in his time. Again, certainly not the worst president, but not the shining example that many people think he was.

But he didn't give up. And hey, I didn't say he was the best, I said to people he was the best. I didn't exactly say that, but, er, see what I mean?

[Choronzon]

Source that.

Oh noes!

Everytime I post this comment on NSG I am asked to source that. Use google, stop being so lazy. If it was hard to find I would source it.

Oh, poor baby. We expect citations.

Get the fuck over it. Welcome to the real world, where you are expected to back your shit up.