The best alternative fuel

[Condunum]

Hydrogen.

This, when it becomes viable for everyday use.

[GrandKirche]

Well, we could use poor people. I mean, there are a LOT of unemployed people using up resources and let's face it it'd get rid of everything ghastly.

Note: not my actual view. Give me nice nuclear any day.

[Genivaria]

Solar Shingles!

[Divair]

Solar Shingles!
(Image)

That is pretty cool.

[Genivaria]

Solar Shingles!
(Image)

That is pretty cool.

Apparently they take less time to install and are cheaper then traditional solar roof panels.
Not to mention that they far less ugly.

[Divair]

That is pretty cool.

Apparently they take less time to install and are cheaper then traditional solar roof panels.
Not to mention that they far less ugly.

I think traditional panels look pretty awesome, but I grew up with them all over the place (mandated by the government since the 50's)

[Greed and Death]

Electrcity with nuclear power.

though synthetic fossil fuels may prevail because they can use existing infrastructural.

Nuclear electric will require an expansion in grid capacity if it is to support cars and farm vehicles.

[Genivaria]

Apparently they take less time to install and are cheaper then traditional solar roof panels.
Not to mention that they far less ugly.

I think traditional panels look pretty awesome, but I grew up with them all over the place (mandated by the government since the 50's)

Mandated? That's the first I've heard of it.
Back in Conroe there was a family that wanted to install solar panels on their roof to save on money, but the homeowners association complained and said it looked ugly and made them take it down.
That's what I heard from my uncle anyway.

[Greed and Death]

I think traditional panels look pretty awesome, but I grew up with them all over the place (mandated by the government since the 50's)

Mandated? That's the first I've heard of it.
Back in Conroe there was a family that wanted to install solar panels on their roof to save on money, but the homeowners association complained and said it looked ugly and made them take it down.
That's what I heard from my uncle anyway.

Even the new ones the home owners associations will block.

[Divair]

I think traditional panels look pretty awesome, but I grew up with them all over the place (mandated by the government since the 50's)

Mandated? That's the first I've heard of it.
Back in Conroe there was a family that wanted to install solar panels on their roof to save on money, but the homeowners association complained and said it looked ugly and made them take it down.
That's what I heard from my uncle anyway.

Mandated indeed. Plan is to switch to 10% solar by 2020.

[Genivaria]

Mandated? That's the first I've heard of it.
Back in Conroe there was a family that wanted to install solar panels on their roof to save on money, but the homeowners association complained and said it looked ugly and made them take it down.
That's what I heard from my uncle anyway.

Even the new ones the home owners associations will block.

I fucking hate those people.

[Immoren]

I laik fluidized bed boilers.

[Threlizdun]

Orphan power. It's clean, renewable, and serves as a solution to two problems at once.

[Phocidaea]

For cars? Electricity.

Because you can produce electricity with nuclear, geothermal, and hydropower, all of which are efficient and, especially for the last two, practically inexhaustible.

The problem with hydrogen fuel is that even when the technology is developed it'll only solve the renewability problem- it'll still contribute significantly to global warming, unless all the vapor can be recaptured. Which is similar to recapturing all the CO₂ and CO emissions from a fossil-fuel vehicle.

[Greed and Death]

Even the new ones the home owners associations will block.

I fucking hate those people.

Home owner's associations are why solar power is not picking up in the suburbs. Most of the panel installation is in urban areas where it is of limited use because of limited space to place them, and in rural areas ( where it is of great use).
Some states have passed laws to block the enforcement of such provisions.

[Genivaria]

I fucking hate those people.

Home owner's associations are why solar power is not picking up in the suburbs. Most of the panel installation is in urban areas where it is of limited use because of limited space to place them, and in rural areas ( where it is of great use).
Some states have passed laws to block the enforcement of such provisions.

Texas is apparently one of them.
http://www.dsireusa.org/incentives/ince ... Code=TX33R

Which makes my uncle's story weird.

[Screensaver]

For cars? Electricity.

Because you can produce electricity with nuclear, geothermal, and hydropower, all of which are efficient and, especially for the last two, practically inexhaustible.

The problem with hydrogen fuel is that even when the technology is developed it'll only solve the renewability problem- it'll still contribute significantly to global warming, unless all the vapor can be recaptured. Which is similar to recapturing all the CO₂ and CO emissions from a fossil-fuel vehicle.

Actually hydrogen cars emit no more water vapor in the atmosphere than a typical petrol or diesel powered car. Also it should be noted that while water vapor does trap more heat than carbon dioxide it only stays in the atmosphere for just a few days or weeks while carbon dioxide can stay for well over 100 years.

[Indira]

Biofuels, assuming we can get them from sources that don't effect our food supply

[Lordieth]

In 600 BC it was discovered that rubbing a piece of amber with cat fur would cause it to attract small pieces of paper. This discovery led to the invention of the first apparatus for the mass production of static electricity, in which a number of cats are attached to the rim of a rotating wheel, aligned such that their fur comes into contact with a specially shaped block of amber.

I can't really find a credible source, and I doubt they used actual cats. More likely cat fur, or other animal fur. Not sure how renewable the energy would be. I haven't given the Cat Factory idea a great deal of thought.

Yet.

[Zottistan]

Nuclear.

[Fintanland]

Biofuels become inefficient when transported too far, but one good idea would be for larger farms to get their own small biofuel plant and run it with their own fuel crops, to run their agricultural machines.

[Screensaver]

Biofuels, assuming we can get them from sources that don't effect our food supply

I am curious. Why do you think that biofuels would be better than hydrogen, electricity, compressed air, liquid nitrogen, or synthetic petrol or diesel?

[Fintanland]

I am curious. Why do you think that biofuels would be better than hydrogen, electricity, compressed air, liquid nitrogen, or synthetic petrol or diesel?

My answer would be that plants use energy directly from the sun and the soil. That is a rather efficient way of doing things, and as soon as we can extract that energy from non-food crops, it is a direct way of putting the sun in your tank, in a manner of speaking.

[Northwest Slobovia]

Biofuels, assuming we can get them from sources that don't effect our food supply

I am curious. Why do you think that biofuels would be better than hydrogen, electricity, compressed air, liquid nitrogen, or synthetic petrol or diesel?

For starters, the ones in bold are just containers for moving energy from an existing power source to stick in a car. There's nothing wrong with that per se, but it's not adding adding any new source of energy to our supply. Because of that, there's the question of storage and transport efficiency: no process of transforming or moving energy is 100% efficient. Ya can't win, ya can't break even, and you can't get out of the game.

That leaves the synfuels. They can be made from coal or natural gas, in which case, they're just energy containers. Very useful ones, I might add, since a coal-burning car would suck mossy rocks. OTOH, both are targets for biofuels, especially diesel fuel.

So: biofuels. Their fundmental advantage is that they're another way to grab solar energy. They're not very efficient -- 2-4% overall energy conversion yields are pretty typical -- but they are in principle very cheap. I know of only two proposals for making them that don't compete with existing ag/forestry uses: algae and tequila. Well, alcohol from agave, but tequila sounds better. Both sound promising from a technical standpoint, so the real question is cost.

[Blazedtown]