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How do you choose whom to vote for?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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I'll vote for a candidate that first and foremost

is nice
1
1%
shares my moral/religious values
5
3%
shares my political ideas
65
44%
is honest and coherent
2
1%
is intelligent and competent
12
8%
will enact policies that will better my personal (or my family's) condition (not just economical)
6
4%
will enact policies that will better the condition of people less fortunate than me
9
6%
will enact policies that will be good for the whole country (/city/region etc)
36
24%
will enact policies that will be good for business
3
2%
option 9 in place 10 SHOCKER!
10
7%
 
Total votes : 149

User avatar
Grave_n_idle
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44837
Founded: Feb 11, 2004
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Grave_n_idle » Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:42 pm

Omnicracy wrote:So you just think your right and then act opposing to what you believe to be right?


You think you're right and then VOTE opposing to what you believe to be right, perhaps.

Sure.

Omnicracy wrote:So, let me see if I understand. To vote for a candidate who shares my political beliefs because they share my political beliefs is a bad thing. It is bad because to think that a government should be run based upon the opinions and beliefs of one person is bad. Is that what your saying?


To consider YOUR prejudices and insular perspective to be a good measure of what is good for a whole country - that would be bad.
I identify as
a problem

User avatar
Barzan
Minister
 
Posts: 3487
Founded: May 12, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Barzan » Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:45 pm

Doitzel wrote:
Grave_n_idle wrote:I'm a little distressed by how comfortable so many people seem to feel with enforcing their ideologies on others.

That's what democracy is.

No, that's what tyranny by majority is.

Rolamec wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:
Doitzel wrote:
Grave_n_idle wrote:I'm a little distressed by how comfortable so many people seem to feel with enforcing their ideologies on others.

That's what democracy is.


I wouldn't say enforcing is what democracy is. Its more like useing the most persuasive argument your morals will allow (for people who get elected, these arguments are usualy full of lies and half-truths) to convince everyone else your right and either truely hearing out other argument or at least pretending to (back to most of our elected officials for that last one).


Point made. Which is also why our founding fathers (if your American) intended our country to be a republic, not a democracy. There is a reason why thinkers such as Plato to Churchill considered democracies one of the worst form of governments. They are great for the majority, and terrible for the minority (African-Americans in slavery and segregation, as well as Asians, many immigrations Irish, Italians, Germans, Eastern Europeans, Hispanics; women; gays; etc.).

This is what liberal democracy is. All OECD countries are liberal democracies. They have basic human rights protections in place for minorities and for others who might otherwise succumb to the tyranny of the majority. Read up on things called The Charter of Rights and Freedoms, the Basic Law of the Federal Republic of Germany, or The Bill of Rights for more information.

Omnicracy wrote:
Rolamec wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:
Doitzel wrote:
Grave_n_idle wrote:I'm a little distressed by how comfortable so many people seem to feel with enforcing their ideologies on others.

That's what democracy is.


I wouldn't say enforcing is what democracy is. Its more like useing the most persuasive argument your morals will allow (for people who get elected, these arguments are usualy full of lies and half-truths) to convince everyone else your right and either truely hearing out other argument or at least pretending to (back to most of our elected officials for that last one).


Point made. Which is also why our founding fathers (if your American) intended our country to be a republic, not a democracy. There is a reason why thinkers such as Plato to Churchill considered democracies one of the worst form of governments. They are great for the majority, and terrible for the minority (African-Americans in slavery and segregation, as well as Asians, many immigrations Irish, Italians, Germans, Eastern Europeans, Hispanics; women; gays; etc.).

Democracy is great until an emergency occurs, and a scapegoat is found. Than it quickly transforms into a mob-ocracy. Athens being a great and unfortunate example.


I think my previouse post still aplies to a republican system. I am American, yes. While most of what you say is accurate, you have errored on Churchill. The quote goes something like "Democracy is the worst form of government, eccept for all the others." He ment republican democracy, not true democracy. And befor we get into a semantical argument in this thread about democracy, republic, and a slew of other words, let me say that we are all intelegent people. We know the true meanings but use the words in the common format for simplicities sake.

Incorrect. He meant democracy as in "we elect our political leaders in some manner or another and we have a rule of law". He was making a point, saying that democracy is slow, inefficient, and expensive, but it's a hell of a lot better than oligarchic dictatorship. Churchill was not invoking democracy to equate it to mean that which the ancient Greeks had. (Let's not also forget that Churchill was the head of government in a constitutional monarchy, not a republic.)
NOT affiliated with the Free Masons -- Barzan's flag does not incorporate masonic imagery
Political Compass: Economic Left/Right: -4.75 | Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: +1.03
"I have considerably less respect for people who nod and drool as talking heads in a box feed them pre-digested spoonfuls of opinutainment than someone that listens to and discusses with a variety of sources and opinions and then forms their own; regardless of whether I agree with them." - Lunatic Goofballs

User avatar
Omnicracy
Minister
 
Posts: 2923
Founded: Feb 20, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Omnicracy » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:24 pm

Grave_n_idle wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:Ah, then this post is moot, seeing as it was based on a typo.


It wasn't based on a typo - it was based on you getting on your high horse about something I didn't even suggest.


No... it was a typo. I thought you sugested something that you didn't due to a typo. It had nothing to do with a horse.

User avatar
Grave_n_idle
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44837
Founded: Feb 11, 2004
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Grave_n_idle » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:27 pm

Omnicracy wrote:
Grave_n_idle wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:Ah, then this post is moot, seeing as it was based on a typo.


It wasn't based on a typo - it was based on you getting on your high horse about something I didn't even suggest.


No... it was a typo. I thought you sugested something that you didn't due to a typo. It had nothing to do with a horse.


Or a typo.

I typed what I meant to type. Another poster used the word 'right', and I picked up on it - that's not a typo.... and I'm not quite sure how you think it is, or why you're still going on about it.
I identify as
a problem

User avatar
Omnicracy
Minister
 
Posts: 2923
Founded: Feb 20, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Omnicracy » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:30 pm

Grave_n_idle wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:
Grave_n_idle wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:Ah, then this post is moot, seeing as it was based on a typo.


It wasn't based on a typo - it was based on you getting on your high horse about something I didn't even suggest.


No... it was a typo. I thought you sugested something that you didn't due to a typo. It had nothing to do with a horse.


Or a typo.

I typed what I meant to type. Another poster used the word 'right', and I picked up on it - that's not a typo.... and I'm not quite sure how you think it is, or why you're still going on about it.


you ment "a right" not "right" wich would be saying there was "a right" with the following no.

User avatar
Martaz
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 116
Founded: Aug 29, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Martaz » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:32 pm

1)He will cut my taxes or is,at least,a fiscal conservative?
2)He is a christian?
Economic Left/Right: 9.25
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 4.41

User avatar
Omnicracy
Minister
 
Posts: 2923
Founded: Feb 20, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Omnicracy » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:32 pm

Grave_n_idle wrote:
Omnicracy wrote:So you just think your right and then act opposing to what you believe to be right?


You think you're right and then VOTE opposing to what you believe to be right, perhaps.

Sure.

Omnicracy wrote:So, let me see if I understand. To vote for a candidate who shares my political beliefs because they share my political beliefs is a bad thing. It is bad because to think that a government should be run based upon the opinions and beliefs of one person is bad. Is that what your saying?


To consider YOUR prejudices and insular perspective to be a good measure of what is good for a whole country - that would be bad.


1) So, what is your basis for who you vote for then?

2) so you mean me, your excluded from vote for who you lagree with being bad?

User avatar
Omnicracy
Minister
 
Posts: 2923
Founded: Feb 20, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Omnicracy » Mon Nov 02, 2009 11:44 pm

Some one should post something new.

User avatar
Omnicracy
Minister
 
Posts: 2923
Founded: Feb 20, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Omnicracy » Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:26 pm

No more posts officialy make sharing political ideals the best way to vote, as it is currently in the lead.

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