Your opinion of transgender people

[Pillea]

So do you also have a problem with breast enlargements/reductions? What about nose jobs? Or heck, tanning?
All are changes to parts of your body after all....

I wouldn't say problem, but I don't that's natural either. I mean, if the future is "let's all just make ourselves be whoever we wanna be through science", then I'm not in. Just doesn't sit right with me. But you know, it's whatever. People will do what they will.

Okay so it's just surgeries that can allow people to get past what can be life long, crippling depression that you have a problem with. If someone wants to augment themselves otherwise it's "not natural", but not a problem. Good to know.

[Defensor]

I wouldn't say problem, but I don't that's natural either. I mean, if the future is "let's all just make ourselves be whoever we wanna be through science", then I'm not in. Just doesn't sit right with me. But you know, it's whatever. People will do what they will.

Okay so it's just surgeries that can allow people to get past what can be life long, crippling depression that you have a problem with. If someone wants to augment themselves otherwise it's "not natural", but not a problem. Good to know.

Having surgery to save your life is one thing, having surgery because you want a twat instead of a dick is another.

[Tsuntion]

Okay so it's just surgeries that can allow people to get past what can be life long, crippling depression that you have a problem with. If someone wants to augment themselves otherwise it's "not natural", but not a problem. Good to know.

Having surgery to save your life is one thing, having surgery because you want a twat instead of a dick is another.

Those categories can and do overlap.

[Pillea]

Okay so it's just surgeries that can allow people to get past what can be life long, crippling depression that you have a problem with. If someone wants to augment themselves otherwise it's "not natural", but not a problem. Good to know.

Having surgery to save your life is one thing, having surgery because you want a twat instead of a dick is another.

Ah, I see you're well learned on gender identity dysphoria, having undergone a lengthy amount of psychological training and are therefore one of the many experts on transgender identity and gender reassignment surgery's potential role in said lives.

Or you're talking out of your ass, which could it be?

[New England and The Maritimes]

I don't have an opinion on "transgender people." I have opinions on people and I don't give a shit what their "gender" or "race" or "sexuality" or "religion" or "ideology" is.

[Defensor]

Having surgery to save your life is one thing, having surgery because you want a twat instead of a dick is another.

Ah, I see you're well learned on gender identity dysphoria, having undergone a lengthy amount of psychological training and are therefore one of the many experts on transgender identity and gender reassignment surgery's potential role in said lives.

Or you're talking out of your ass, which could it be?

Or you're simply trying to be a pretentious prick because you believe that people can actually be born the wrong gender, and anyone who says otherwise is a bigot?

[Pillea]

Ah, I see you're well learned on gender identity dysphoria, having undergone a lengthy amount of psychological training and are therefore one of the many experts on transgender identity and gender reassignment surgery's potential role in said lives.

Or you're talking out of your ass, which could it be?

Or you're simply trying to be a pretentious prick because you believe that people can actually have been born the wrong gender, and anyone who says otherwise is a bigot?

As does science, history, sociology*anthropology*, and psychology. And yeah, imagine that I, as a transwoman, happen to also agree with that fact.

[Euroslavia]

I don't have an opinion on "transgender people." I have opinions on people and I don't give a shit what their "gender" or "race" or "sexuality" or "religion" or "ideology" is.

Amen. Thank you for this, I couldn't agree more.

[Defensor]

Or you're simply trying to be a pretentious prick because you believe that people can actually have been born the wrong gender, and anyone who says otherwise is a bigot?

As does science, history, sociology, and psychology. And yeah, imagine that I, as a transwoman, happen to also agree with that fact.

Well, for starters, it's nice to meet you.

Second, I will need sources for all the "history, science, and psychology". Sociology is irrelivent.

Third, why exactly did you go through with it? What made you think "I am the wrong gender"?

[New England and The Maritimes]

I don't have an opinion on "transgender people." I have opinions on people and I don't give a shit what their "gender" or "race" or "sexuality" or "religion" or "ideology" is.

Amen. Thank you for this, I couldn't agree more.

It's all tangential. It's all a series of labels to define ideas and experiences and opinions and behaviors, and the essence of a person is these ideas on an individual basis, not the label which prescribes them. If I have a problem with you, let's say as a Buddhist ritualistically shaving your head, I have a problem with you ritualistically shaving your head, not with you meditating or forsaking material pleasures or with you labeling yourself "A Buddhist," so that's what I will want to talk about if I want to bring up the problem. Fixating on someone else's label collection is not conducive to examining and understanding that person as an individual.

[Defensor]

Amen. Thank you for this, I couldn't agree more.

It's all tangential. It's all a series of labels to define ideas and experiences and opinions and behaviors, and the essence of a person is these ideas on an individual basis, not the label which prescribes them. If I have a problem with you, let's say as a Buddhist ritualistically shaving your head, I have a problem with you ritualistically shaving your head, not with you meditating or forsaking material pleasures or with you labeling yourself "A Buddhist," so that's what I will want to talk about if I want to bring up the problem. Fixating on someone else's label collection is not conducive to examining and understanding that person as an individual.

This is most certainly true. I will always like people for who they are, not for their apperance, actions, or beliefs.

[Zweite Alaje]

I don't have an opinion on "transgender people." I have opinions on people and I don't give a shit what their "gender" or "race" or "sexuality" or "religion" or "ideology" is.

You see, this is one thing I hate that people say "I don't care about ___ it doesn't matter". You should care about their gender, religion, or ideology because they matter, but the important part is that you treat them honorably despite that.

Personally, I've come to terms with the concept of transsexuality and I see trans individuals as just people.

[New England and The Maritimes]

I don't have an opinion on "transgender people." I have opinions on people and I don't give a shit what their "gender" or "race" or "sexuality" or "religion" or "ideology" is.

You see, this is one thing I hate that people say "I don't care about ___ it doesn't matter". You should care about their gender, religion, or ideology because they matter, but the important part is that you treat them honorably despite that.

Personally, I've come to terms with the concept of transsexuality and I see trans individuals as just people.

I don't mean that in a dismissive way necessarily. I care about the experiences and ideas that you clump into a label behind it. I take those as essential pieces of your id, but evaluate them on their own merits in their own contexts instead of grouping them together based on arbitrary and vague categorical labels.

[Pillea]

As does science, history, sociology, and psychology. And yeah, imagine that I, as a transwoman, happen to also agree with that fact.

Well, for starters, it's nice to meet you.

Second, I will need sources for all the "history, science, and psychology". Sociology is irrelivent.

Third, why exactly did you go through with it? What made you think "I am the wrong gender"?

For starters, I cannot say the same. Someone who passes off Gender Reassignment Surgery as some procedure that someone just decides to get is not someone I have interest in knowing.

Secondly, throughout history, in many cultures there are clearly documented cases of transgender individuals. Scientific evidence has recently begun showing brain structure differences for at least some cisgender and transgender individuals. And psychology clearly understands that it is a thing because there's an entire classification for it, and it just go revised this year even. Seriously, you want sources, you've got google, it is not the job of trans people to educate you, take 15 minutes and do it yourself. DSM V for psychology, transgender history for history, and transgender brain structure for science.

Thirdly, while it is absolutely none of your business, I have not yet undergone any hormone therapies, nor surgeries, and whether I decide to or not is not something I am completely sure on yet. What made me realize I was transgender was years ago on a close knit forum, someone else coming out to us and speaking to us on their transition. When they talked about dysphoria and the likes it made me realize that it was something I'd been dealing with for some years, causing me immense depression to the point of rather frequent suicidal tendencies. After beginning to come to terms with how I felt I was able to open with my closest friends and even that made me feel more like I was more valid in my life than I'd been in years.

So what made me think "I am the wrong gender"? Was it society telling me the crippling wrongness I felt for years was just "teenage depression"? Nope. Was it my girlfriend jokingly calling me her girlfriend with a penis? Nope. Was it people like you who think transgender people are "unnatural"? Nope. It was my brain, my nature if you will, telling me so. Still does, each and every day.

[Defensor]

I don't have an opinion on "transgender people." I have opinions on people and I don't give a shit what their "gender" or "race" or "sexuality" or "religion" or "ideology" is.

You see, this is one thing I hate that people say "I don't care about ___ it doesn't matter". You should care about their gender, religion, or ideology because they matter, but the important part is that you treat them honorably despite that.

Personally, I've come to terms with the concept of transsexuality and I see trans individuals as just people.

Ah! You always bring the point across better than I do

To clarify, I'm not saying I don't like transgenders, I just don't understand it. And when you don't understand things, they seem weird.

But yes, transsexuals are still people just the same, and I will still respect and treat them as I would anyone. The end.

[Zweite Alaje]

You see, this is one thing I hate that people say "I don't care about ___ it doesn't matter". You should care about their gender, religion, or ideology because they matter, but the important part is that you treat them honorably despite that.

Personally, I've come to terms with the concept of transsexuality and I see trans individuals as just people.

I don't mean that in a dismissive way necessarily. I care about the experiences and ideas that you clump into a label behind it. I take those as essential pieces of your id, but evaluate them on their own merits in their own contexts instead of grouping them together based on arbitrary and vague categorical labels.

Ah ok, I see what you're saying. I guess we're both saying the samething.

[New England and The Maritimes]

I don't mean that in a dismissive way necessarily. I care about the experiences and ideas that you clump into a label behind it. I take those as essential pieces of your id, but evaluate them on their own merits in their own contexts instead of grouping them together based on arbitrary and vague categorical labels.

Ah ok, I see what you're saying. I guess we're both saying the samething.

I think devolving the discussion by trying to package your ideas and experiences and beliefs together dumbs down any attempt to really understand each other. I never ask someone "What are you" because I know what anyone I'm talking to is already; a being. So when I want to know more about someone, I ask specific questions to see what they really think.

[Defensor]

Well, for starters, it's nice to meet you.

Second, I will need sources for all the "history, science, and psychology". Sociology is irrelivent.

Third, why exactly did you go through with it? What made you think "I am the wrong gender"?

For starters, I cannot say the same. Someone who passes off Gender Reassignment Surgery as some procedure that someone just decides to get is not someone I have interest in knowing.

Secondly, throughout history, in many cultures there are clearly documented cases of transgender individuals. Scientific evidence has recently begun showing brain structure differences for at least some cisgender and transgender individuals. And psychology clearly understands that it is a thing because there's an entire classification for it, and it just go revised this year even. Seriously, you want sources, you've got google, it is not the job of trans people to educate you, take 15 minutes and do it yourself. DSM V for psychology, transgender history for history, and transgender brain structure for science.

Thirdly, while it is absolutely none of your business, I have not yet undergone any hormone therapies, nor surgeries, and whether I decide to or not is not something I am completely sure on yet. What made me realize I was transgender was years ago on a close knit forum, someone else coming out to us and speaking to us on their transition. When they talked about dysphoria and the likes it made me realize that it was something I'd been dealing with for some years, causing me immense depression to the point of rather frequent suicidal tendencies. After beginning to come to terms with how I felt I was able to open with my closest friends and even that made me feel more like I was more valid in my life than I'd been in years.

So what made me think "I am the wrong gender"? Was it society telling me the crippling wrongness I felt for years was just "teenage depression"? Nope. Was it my girlfriend jokingly calling me her girlfriend with a penis? Nope. Was it people like you who think transgender people are "unnatural"? Nope. It was my brain, my nature if you will, telling me so. Still does, each and every day.

Well, I'm sorry you feel that way. I hate it when people are closed minded about gun control, but that doesn't mean I hate the guy!

Also, I've googled this subject, only to come up with theories that haven't been 100% proven yet, and that's based off of theories mind you, based on scientist belief that the mind is a process delivered from the brain...a fact that has not yet been proven, nor will for some time. So I can't really call it scientific yet. As far as history goes, it's just documented cases of people feeling depression due to thinking (exact words) that they were born the wrong gender and how that would explain behavior issues. That's it, just documentation. I don't know what that proves.

To wrap it up, I still think you're probably a cool person, I just don't understand still. Whatever the case, have a good day

[Grenartia]

You mad bro?

When I establish my Reich, people who use this phrase will be the first to go. Along with NASCAR fans, and anyone who has ever actively initiated a high-five.

Aw come on, NASCAR isn't all that bad.

Frankly? Yes, I am, because it's an asinine statement that has no bearing in fact, and significantly contributes to a decidedly negative perception of transgender people.

So stop it.

1. Idk man, changing your parts out just seems...unnatural...

2. I honestly can't think of anything positive concerning transgendersto be honest. Sorry

1. >says changing your parts out is unnatural
>uses a computer to do so

2. At the same time, you can't think of anything negative.

Can you think of anything negative?

1. Yeah, they're a transgeneder? 2. Meaning he was a male but is now a female? 3. Even though there are clearly parts of his/it's body that are not natural. 4. So in essence, he's still not a female, just fucking kind of looks like one from a distance. 5. I find that negative, disgusting, and just plain old weird.

6. I'm not saying I hate they guy, he/she whatever is probably a cool...whatever... 7. but that doesn't mean it's a natural or a "right" thing to do, so to say.

1. There's nothing inherently negative about being trans*.

2. No. Meaning somebody who was born male, but identifies as female, somebody who was born female, but identifies as male, or somebody who identifies as both, neither, or something else.

3. Again, naturalistic fallacy. Posting on computers. Irony.

4. Only from a strictly biological perspective. Tell me, of what relevance to social interaction is biological sex? If you kissed somebody with XY chromosomes, would you break out in hives?

5. Would you rather them kill themselves? I'd think any reasonable person would find suicide more negative than being transgender. Also, lots of things could be considered disgusting that nobody thinks twice about. Kissing, for example. Do you realize how filthy the average person's mouth is, even after brushing, flossing, and mouthwash? Why should being transgender be any more disgusting than two people kissing?

6. By referring to somebody who identifies as female as a 'he', you basically are.

7. If they're not depriving others of their reasonable rights without informed consent, then what's the big fucking problem?

I mean, what's to say that I can't go "Well, I really feel like I should've been a dog. Doctor, make me into a female dog!" While I know not all transgenders require "parts swapping", it still is weird changing who you are.

There's an inherent difference between identifying as a member of a gender of the same species, and identifying as a member of a different species altogether. By making that argument, you're not even comparing apples to oranges. You're comparing apples to salmon.

Okay so it's just surgeries that can allow people to get past what can be life long, crippling depression that you have a problem with. If someone wants to augment themselves otherwise it's "not natural", but not a problem. Good to know.

Having surgery to save your life is one thing, having surgery because you want a twat instead of a dick is another.

First off, SRS IS medically necessary for those who get it.

Secondly, you're vastly misrepresenting the issues behind needing SRS.

Ah, I see you're well learned on gender identity dysphoria, having undergone a lengthy amount of psychological training and are therefore one of the many experts on transgender identity and gender reassignment surgery's potential role in said lives.

Or you're talking out of your ass, which could it be?

Or you're simply trying to be a pretentious prick because you believe that people can actually be born the wrong gender, and anyone who says otherwise is a bigot?

There's a difference between sex and gender. Sex is what's between your legs, gender is what's between your ears.

Also, by saying that people CAN'T possibly be born in the wrong body, could it not be said that you yourself are trying to be a 'pretentious prick'?

As does science, history, sociology, and psychology. And yeah, imagine that I, as a transwoman, happen to also agree with that fact.

Well, for starters, it's nice to meet you.

Second, I will need sources for all the "history, science, and psychology". Sociology is irrelivent.

Third, why exactly did you go through with it? What made you think "I am the wrong gender"?

Science, sociology, and psychology are basically the same, seeing as how psychology and sociology are both sciences.

Anywho, I refer you to the American Psychological Association.

[Defensor]

When I establish my Reich, people who use this phrase will be the first to go. Along with NASCAR fans, and anyone who has ever actively initiated a high-five.

Aw come on, NASCAR isn't all that bad.

1. Idk man, changing your parts out just seems...unnatural...

2. I honestly can't think of anything positive concerning transgendersto be honest. Sorry

1. >says changing your parts out is unnatural
>uses a computer to do so

2. At the same time, you can't think of anything negative.

1. Yeah, they're a transgeneder? 2. Meaning he was a male but is now a female? 3. Even though there are clearly parts of his/it's body that are not natural. 4. So in essence, he's still not a female, just fucking kind of looks like one from a distance. 5. I find that negative, disgusting, and just plain old weird.

6. I'm not saying I hate they guy, he/she whatever is probably a cool...whatever... 7. but that doesn't mean it's a natural or a "right" thing to do, so to say.

1. There's nothing inherently negative about being trans*.

2. No. Meaning somebody who was born male, but identifies as female, somebody who was born female, but identifies as male, or somebody who identifies as both, neither, or something else.

3. Again, naturalistic fallacy. Posting on computers. Irony.

4. Only from a strictly biological perspective. Tell me, of what relevance to social interaction is biological sex? If you kissed somebody with XY chromosomes, would you break out in hives?

5. Would you rather them kill themselves? I'd think any reasonable person would find suicide more negative than being transgender. Also, lots of things could be considered disgusting that nobody thinks twice about. Kissing, for example. Do you realize how filthy the average person's mouth is, even after brushing, flossing, and mouthwash? Why should being transgender be any more disgusting than two people kissing?

6. By referring to somebody who identifies as female as a 'he', you basically are.

7. If they're not depriving others of their reasonable rights without informed consent, then what's the big fucking problem?

I mean, what's to say that I can't go "Well, I really feel like I should've been a dog. Doctor, make me into a female dog!" While I know not all transgenders require "parts swapping", it still is weird changing who you are.

There's an inherent difference between identifying as a member of a gender of the same species, and identifying as a member of a different species altogether. By making that argument, you're not even comparing apples to oranges. You're comparing apples to salmon.

Having surgery to save your life is one thing, having surgery because you want a twat instead of a dick is another.

First off, SRS IS medically necessary for those who get it.

Secondly, you're vastly misrepresenting the issues behind needing SRS.

Or you're simply trying to be a pretentious prick because you believe that people can actually be born the wrong gender, and anyone who says otherwise is a bigot?

There's a difference between sex and gender. Sex is what's between your legs, gender is what's between your ears.

Also, by saying that people CAN'T possibly be born in the wrong body, could it not be said that you yourself are trying to be a 'pretentious prick'?

Well, for starters, it's nice to meet you.

Second, I will need sources for all the "history, science, and psychology". Sociology is irrelivent.

Third, why exactly did you go through with it? What made you think "I am the wrong gender"?

Science, sociology, and psychology are basically the same, seeing as how psychology and sociology are both sciences.

Anywho, I refer you to the American Psychological Association.

Ummmm, how is using a computer irony in that context? I don't think you know the meaning of the word

[Zweite Alaje]

You see, this is one thing I hate that people say "I don't care about ___ it doesn't matter". You should care about their gender, religion, or ideology because they matter, but the important part is that you treat them honorably despite that.

Personally, I've come to terms with the concept of transsexuality and I see trans individuals as just people.

Ah! You always bring the point across better than I do

To clarify, I'm not saying I don't like transgenders, I just don't understand it. And when you don't understand things, they seem weird.

But yes, transsexuals are still people just the same, and I will still respect and treat them as I would anyone. The end.

I have I tip for you, talking to people over TG is a lot more effective a method of learning than NSG threads. Talk to a trans NSGers over TG, that how I became more informed on this topic. These threads will only get you DEATed, hence the "Zweite" prefix in my nation title.

[Defensor]

Ah! You always bring the point across better than I do

To clarify, I'm not saying I don't like transgenders, I just don't understand it. And when you don't understand things, they seem weird.

But yes, transsexuals are still people just the same, and I will still respect and treat them as I would anyone. The end.

I have I tip for you, talking to people over TG is a lot more effective a method of learning than NSG threads. Talk to a trans NSGers over TG, that how I became more informed on this topic. These threads will only get you DEATed, hence the "Zweite" prefix in my nation title.

Ugh, just now learning my lesson unfourtunatly Thank you though!

[Grenartia]

Aw come on, NASCAR isn't all that bad.



1. >says changing your parts out is unnatural
>uses a computer to do so

2. At the same time, you can't think of anything negative.



1. There's nothing inherently negative about being trans*.

2. No. Meaning somebody who was born male, but identifies as female, somebody who was born female, but identifies as male, or somebody who identifies as both, neither, or something else.

3. Again, naturalistic fallacy. Posting on computers. Irony.

4. Only from a strictly biological perspective. Tell me, of what relevance to social interaction is biological sex? If you kissed somebody with XY chromosomes, would you break out in hives?

5. Would you rather them kill themselves? I'd think any reasonable person would find suicide more negative than being transgender. Also, lots of things could be considered disgusting that nobody thinks twice about. Kissing, for example. Do you realize how filthy the average person's mouth is, even after brushing, flossing, and mouthwash? Why should being transgender be any more disgusting than two people kissing?

6. By referring to somebody who identifies as female as a 'he', you basically are.

7. If they're not depriving others of their reasonable rights without informed consent, then what's the big fucking problem?



There's an inherent difference between identifying as a member of a gender of the same species, and identifying as a member of a different species altogether. By making that argument, you're not even comparing apples to oranges. You're comparing apples to salmon.



First off, SRS IS medically necessary for those who get it.

Secondly, you're vastly misrepresenting the issues behind needing SRS.



There's a difference between sex and gender. Sex is what's between your legs, gender is what's between your ears.

Also, by saying that people CAN'T possibly be born in the wrong body, could it not be said that you yourself are trying to be a 'pretentious prick'?



Science, sociology, and psychology are basically the same, seeing as how psychology and sociology are both sciences.

Anywho, I refer you to the American Psychological Association.

Ummmm, how is using a computer irony in that context? I don't think you know the meaning of the word

Computers are not natural. You are using something that is not natural to condemn something you claim isn't natural.

Ah! You always bring the point across better than I do

To clarify, I'm not saying I don't like transgenders, I just don't understand it. And when you don't understand things, they seem weird.

But yes, transsexuals are still people just the same, and I will still respect and treat them as I would anyone. The end.

I have I tip for you, talking to people over TG is a lot more effective a method of learning than NSG threads. Talk to a trans NSGers over TG, that how I became more informed on this topic. These threads will only get you DEATed, hence the "Zweite" prefix in my nation title.

Indeed. I offer my inbox for the purpose.

[Zweite Alaje]

I have I tip for you, talking to people over TG is a lot more effective a method of learning than NSG threads. Talk to a trans NSGers over TG, that how I became more informed on this topic. These threads will only get you DEATed, hence the "Zweite" prefix in my nation title.

Ugh, just now learning my lesson unfourtunatly Thank you though!

Yes, if you have a short temper NSG threads on touchy topics like this are not for you. I've gotten so many warnings and bans from LGBT threads it is ridiculous, I now actively avoid topics I feel will anger me.

[Rereumrari]

I don't harbor any direct animosity towards transexuals. I've never met one, but if I did, I would shake his/her hand and treat that person with the same common respect that I give every other person I meet. However, I am very against plastic surgery. I think that it is the product of a society that puts far too much importance on looks and not enough on character. I've always been told that you should love who you are, no matter how you were born and I think those are good words to live by. For that reason, I don't see why the "T" is part of LGBT. Lesbians, Gays, and Bisexuals were indeed born that way and are proud of how they were born. Transexuals on the other hand were not born that way and clearly were not proud of how they were born. For a group that focuses on intrinsic pride, this seems like a very huge contradiction to include people in it who are not proud of themselves. If the technology for sex-changes did not exist, they would probably be either L,G, or B, but instead, they choose to abandon that in hopes of altering themselves to become straight, just like the gay-shaming society wants them to be.

I think it is very sad that society stigmatizes gays so much that one would feel like they would have to change genders just to become socially acceptable to date the people they want to. The worst part about it is that they can't really date the people they want because no technology exists to truly change you into a female or male. The best they can do is make you look like one, but you would never have the actual means to create or give birth to a child. If you were a woman, you're now a woman with a hysterectomy. If you were a guy, you are now a guy with no penis or testicles, Neutered. It's not enough to look like a gender if you want to date the opposite gender, you have to actually be the gender. Attempting to deceive someone with really good surgery and expecting that person not to get angry when you tell them months in to the relationship who you really are will only make things worse.

I mention this because in another thread, a few people said they would not disclose this to a partner they met. That is horribly malicious and ethically wrong to do. If I wouldn't have dated you as a man, I wouldn't date you now when you are trying to mask yourself as a woman. Trying to trick someone with fraud and deceit will not get you any closer to them. As much as you may see yourself as female, you are still not female to other people. Don't lie to your date.