Republican vs Conservative vs Democrat

[Les Drapeaux Brulants]

Anyone following the race in upstate New York? This is the one where the NY Republicans nominated a candidate slightly left of Obama... Also endorsed by the Acornite Working Families Party, Dede Scozzafava, is running against a Democrat, Bill Owens, and a Conservative, Doug Hoffman. Hoffman has been steadily gaining in the polls.

It would be nice to see a Conservative victory only a year after the travesty of 2008.

[The Romulan Republic]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

[Greed and Death]

I don't know where Mrs. Scozzafava economic views lie. She seems as if she is one of the libertarian leaning republicans.
though it is hard to tell because of some of the endorsements she has gotten.

If this is the case this could be the turning point between if the GOP stays a Christian values orientated party, or becomes a more libertarian leaning party.

[Miclania]

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

[The Norse Hordes]

Palin endorsed the conservative, so theyre boned.

[Meoton]

In this American context, Conservative and Liberal, are vague ideologies that are constantly redifined by people with agendas.
Republican and Democrat are political parties.
Your definition of Conservative is obviously based on the talk radio "Conservatives"

[Sibirsky]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

You are confused

[Sibirsky]

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

Communism is slavery of the poor. Capitalism gives them a chance for a job. Property rights. And their own success.

[Kobrania]

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

Communism is slavery of the poor. Capitalism gives them a chance for a job. Property rights. And their own success.

Communism was equality of the populace economically, not slavery, capatalism allows he rich to abuse the poor without legal ramifications.

[Sibirsky]

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

Communism is slavery of the poor. Capitalism gives them a chance for a job. Property rights. And their own success.

Communism was equality of the populace economically, not slavery, capatalism allows he rich to abuse the poor without legal ramifications.

And every single time they end up equally poor. Unless they are high ranking members of the party. The rich do not abuse the poor.

[Waideland]

In this American context, Conservative and Liberal, are vague ideologies that are constantly redifined by people with agendas.
Republican and Democrat are political parties.
Your definition of Conservative is obviously based on the talk radio "Conservatives"

You just basically pwned every Democrat, Republican, and Marxist with that statement. I've never seen it put so well.

The closest political party we have to actual conservatism here in the US are the Libertarians. They basically want to minimalize government interference in people's lives on all levels, whereas with the two major parties, it's just a choice between 2 sets of ideologues. Unfortunately, both major parties have marginalized the Libertarians by claiming all they want to do is legalize drugs, and to make matters worse, the party keeps selecting nominees for president and congress that promise such ridiculous things as dismantling law enforcement and the military a week after they take power.

The worst thing is, if you polled everyone on specific issues, you'd find that the majority of the people agree with Libertarians on far more issues then the other parties, but people don't want to "waste their vote", so they choose between the Republican and Democrat to make sure the lesser of two evils win.

[Kashindahar]

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

Communism is slavery of the poor. Capitalism gives them a chance for a job. Property rights. And their own success.

Communism was equality of the populace economically, not slavery, capatalism allows he rich to abuse the poor without legal ramifications.

And every single time they end up equally poor. Unless they are high ranking members of the party. The rich do not abuse the poor.

Since communism has never actually been implemented on a national level, I'm not sure why you're giving examples of where it's failed.

Before you point out the USSR: Is the DPRK democratic?

[Whiskey Hill]

The Republican had been endorsed previously be WFP, she is not in this race. She is certainly not to the left of Obama. All of these candidates are conservative, just a matter of degree.

It essentially comes down to two things- if you want a crazy right-winger, vote Hoffman. If you want someone who will pragmatically represent this slightly right of center district, vote for Owens or Scozzafava. If you want Republican staffers to get jobs, vote Scozzafava. If you want Democratic staffers to get jobs, vote Owens. It's really that simple in this race. Not a big difference between the candidates, its all about spoils. And bragging rights. Shouldn't forget that.

[Lucky Bicycle Works]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

You are confused

Insult.

---

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

Communism is slavery of the poor. Capitalism gives them a chance for a job. Property rights. And their own success.

Hijack.

---

If America goes back to conservatism (which shouldn't be for a while, hopefully) they would only participate in more useless wars and only cause an economic downfall. Not to mention how they view the poor, the rich would get richer and the poor would begin to become slaves to the oppression that is capitalism and conservatism.

Communism is slavery of the poor. Capitalism gives them a chance for a job. Property rights. And their own success.

Communism was equality of the populace economically, not slavery, capatalism allows he rich to abuse the poor without legal ramifications.

And every single time they end up equally poor. Unless they are high ranking members of the party. The rich do not abuse the poor.

And bingo. We're talking about what you want to talk about, with blatant disregard to the thread subject.

[Whiskey Hill]

In this American context, Conservative and Liberal, are vague ideologies that are constantly redifined by people with agendas.
Republican and Democrat are political parties.
Your definition of Conservative is obviously based on the talk radio "Conservatives"

You just basically pwned every Democrat, Republican, and Marxist with that statement. I've never seen it put so well.

The closest political party we have to actual conservatism here in the US are the Libertarians. They basically want to minimalize government interference in people's lives on all levels, whereas with the two major parties, it's just a choice between 2 sets of ideologues. Unfortunately, both major parties have marginalized the Libertarians by claiming all they want to do is legalize drugs, and to make matters worse, the party keeps selecting nominees for president and congress that promise such ridiculous things as dismantling law enforcement and the military a week after they take power.

The worst thing is, if you polled everyone on specific issues, you'd find that the majority of the people agree with Libertarians on far more issues then the other parties, but people don't want to "waste their vote", so they choose between the Republican and Democrat to make sure the lesser of two evils win.

Libertarians are not conservative. They're right wing liberals. And most people do not agree with them on most issues. Libertarians are fringe and deserve to be fringe. Ugh. Decadent liberalism.

[Kashindahar]

In this American context, Conservative and Liberal, are vague ideologies that are constantly redifined by people with agendas.
Republican and Democrat are political parties.
Your definition of Conservative is obviously based on the talk radio "Conservatives"

You just basically pwned every Democrat, Republican, and Marxist with that statement. I've never seen it put so well.

The closest political party we have to actual conservatism here in the US are the Libertarians. They basically want to minimalize government interference in people's lives on all levels, whereas with the two major parties, it's just a choice between 2 sets of ideologues. Unfortunately, both major parties have marginalized the Libertarians by claiming all they want to do is legalize drugs, and to make matters worse, the party keeps selecting nominees for president and congress that promise such ridiculous things as dismantling law enforcement and the military a week after they take power.

The worst thing is, if you polled everyone on specific issues, you'd find that the majority of the people agree with Libertarians on far more issues then the other parties, but people don't want to "waste their vote", so they choose between the Republican and Democrat to make sure the lesser of two evils win.

Libertarians are not conservative. They're right wing liberals. And most people do not agree with them on most issues. Libertarians are fringe and deserve to be fringe. Ugh. Decadent liberalism.

Social conservatism isn't the only form of conservatism.

[Meoton]

By Western European definitions, I would probably be more often aligned with the Social Democrats.
I agree with the Libertarian party on some things, but I see a need for (and believe in) a strong social safety net, regulation of large corperate entities, and the limiting of the over accumulation of wealth by family dynasties. As it is, big money has undue influence on the government and controls the major media in the U.S.

[Lucky Bicycle Works]

The Republican had been endorsed previously be WFP, she is not in this race. She is certainly not to the left of Obama. All of these candidates are conservative, just a matter of degree.

It essentially comes down to two things- if you want a crazy right-winger, vote Hoffman. If you want someone who will pragmatically represent this slightly right of center district, vote for Owens or Scozzafava. If you want Republican staffers to get jobs, vote Scozzafava. If you want Democratic staffers to get jobs, vote Owens. It's really that simple in this race. Not a big difference between the candidates, its all about spoils. And bragging rights. Shouldn't forget that.

This is how to do it.

Sibirsky, if you love free speech and democratic rights, try to be more like Whiskey Hill here. And less with the "W00t, TWO parties! Now THIS is FREEDOM! YAY for MY party!" childish rubbish. Partisanism when you recognize two parties, is just one better than partisanism when there is only one.

[Whiskey Hill]

Social conservatism isn't the only form of conservatism.

No, there's also economic conservatism, which has taken different forms like feudalism and mercantilism, or my favorite (and I'm being honest), the American system, designed by Hamilton and Clay. Libertarians don't like Hamilton and Clay, who were conservatives. They like Jefferson, the liberal, the market guy. Market economics are not a conservative thing. They're a liberal thing. Libertarians are not conservatives.

[Sibirsky]

Sibirsky, if you love free speech and democratic rights, try to be more like Whiskey Hill here. And less with the "W00t, TWO parties! Now THIS is FREEDOM! YAY for MY party!" childish rubbish. Partisanism when you recognize two parties, is just one better than partisanism when there is only one.

And where do you see me saying that? Besides, the Democrats are for bigger government, and state so, which is fine, but the Republicans are for bigger government also, even thought hey say they're for smaller government, I am for neither ones of the morons.

[Timesjoke]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

Considering that every move made by the Liberals they claim will help the poor actually ends up hurting the poor more I have to giggle every time some uneducated blind follower like this speaks.

Take this cap and trade thing the liberals love, it will end up doubling the heating costs of the average poor family in the coldest regions of the North. Now how is that helping them? They are already poor, doubling their heating bills seems a tad wrong to me.

Raising the minimum wage offers the illusion of more money but all basic goods are priced off of the lowest common earning scale so once prices rebalance, they will be spending the same percentage on basic goods that they used to spend. Raise pay, then you have to raise the cost of the products/services these same people produce, or lower costs maybe........like getting rid of a couple employees to pay for the raise? Think those already low wage employees had money saved up to cover a time out of work and being as they are already working minimum wage do you think they will find a new job?

This heath bill will not even start working for another 5 years, but the new taxes and fees will start right away. Insurance rates will rise about $1,700 per person and someone has to pay for that too.

Raising taxes on what they call the rich is punnishing those who employ people. The vast majority of American jobs are supplied by small to medium businesses where the owners report the business income on their personal taxes. Massive increases in taxes to these people will hurt them, and if the majority of employers are hurt, that will trickle down to the employees.......the same little guys the Liberals are saying they want to help.

Help me out, how many poor people employ other people?

The real scam is when the liberals try to pretend that the rich are paying taxes. But on the whole, it is just not possible. All taxes are paid instead by consumers. When you tax the rich they simply pass that tax down to their goods and services so that can of carrots has 2 cents added to it and the stupid masses just go along never understanding what is really happening.


The greedy oil companies? Well the Government makes more money off of oil than the oil companies do and they don't risk a penny to get the oil, refine it, ship it to stores, or sell it so who is really the bad guy? Government taxes on these products add more to the price of oil than any other factor to include company profit over cost, so the next time you start wishing gas was cheaper, consider that fact.


Put simply, Government programs cost money. When the Government gives you a dollar, that same dollar must be taken from "someone else" but it does not stop there. The buracracy and workers needed to collect and transport that same dollar to you also has a cost and they can't take it out of the first dollar so they also go to the "someone else" for that money too. So to give you 1 dollar, they have to take from "someone else" almost 2 dollars, $1.70 actually. But that is okay because it is not you right? You deserve the free dollar so taking it from "someone else" is a good thing....right? But we already covered that the cost of the things you buy will go up as well but that is not where it stops.


Why do you think there are no "starter homes" anymore? When I was a young man a young couple with one child could afford to buy a small home and as their family grew they would sell the smaller home and get a bigger one. Today the average young couple can't earn enough money to buy a home like that and it is because we have reached the point where the level of taxes and fees on these homes and goods/services have gotten so large that once you pass these costs down to the consumer, the average couple can't afford it. Most of this added cost is because of the Government, not capitalist business.


But Liberals are out to help the little guy.....right? Really?

Actually it is the conservatives and capitalism that has given the little guy more than anyone else. Our poor still has cellphines, 60 inch plasma tv's and $5,000 rims on their cars. Contrary to popular lies all poor have access to healthcare, but the people getting Government supplied care to include preventive care are intentionally included in the Liberals numbers because if they didn't, the majority in America without healthcare would be illegals who should not be getting free care anyway.........but these same illegals still get free healthcare at emergency rooms, there are very few in America who can't get the medical treatments they need.


All I can say is stop being a blind follower and look around, the Liberals are not giving you anything, they are instead taking away your ability to think for yourself and want obedience to their ideas in return for the "free" money they give you.

[Whiskey Hill]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

Considering that every move made by the Liberals they claim will help the poor actually ends up hurting the poor more I have to giggle every time some uneducated blind follower like this speaks.

Take this cap and trade thing the liberals love, it will end up doubling the heating costs of the average poor family in the coldest regions of the North. Now how is that helping them? They are already poor, doubling their heating bills seems a tad wrong to me.

Raising the minimum wage offers the illusion of more money but all basic goods are priced off of the lowest common earning scale so once prices rebalance, they will be spending the same percentage on basic goods that they used to spend. Raise pay, then you have to raise the cost of the products/services these same people produce, or lower costs maybe........like getting rid of a couple employees to pay for the raise? Think those already low wage employees had money saved up to cover a time out of work and being as they are already working minimum wage do you think they will find a new job?

This heath bill will not even start working for another 5 years, but the new taxes and fees will start right away. Insurance rates will rise about $1,700 per person and someone has to pay for that too.

Raising taxes on what they call the rich is punnishing those who employ people. The vast majority of American jobs are supplied by small to medium businesses where the owners report the business income on their personal taxes. Massive increases in taxes to these people will hurt them, and if the majority of employers are hurt, that will trickle down to the employees.......the same little guys the Liberals are saying they want to help.

Help me out, how many poor people employ other people?

The real scam is when the liberals try to pretend that the rich are paying taxes. But on the whole, it is just not possible. All taxes are paid instead by consumers. When you tax the rich they simply pass that tax down to their goods and services so that can of carrots has 2 cents added to it and the stupid masses just go along never understanding what is really happening.


The greedy oil companies? Well the Government makes more money off of oil than the oil companies do and they don't risk a penny to get the oil, refine it, ship it to stores, or sell it so who is really the bad guy? Government taxes on these products add more to the price of oil than any other factor to include company profit over cost, so the next time you start wishing gas was cheaper, consider that fact.


Put simply, Government programs cost money. When the Government gives you a dollar, that same dollar must be taken from "someone else" but it does not stop there. The buracracy and workers needed to collect and transport that same dollar to you also has a cost and they can't take it out of the first dollar so they also go to the "someone else" for that money too. So to give you 1 dollar, they have to take from "someone else" almost 2 dollars, $1.70 actually. But that is okay because it is not you right? You deserve the free dollar so taking it from "someone else" is a good thing....right? But we already covered that the cost of the things you buy will go up as well but that is not where it stops.


Why do you think there are no "starter homes" anymore? When I was a young man a young couple with one child could afford to buy a small home and as their family grew they would sell the smaller home and get a bigger one. Today the average young couple can't earn enough money to buy a home like that and it is because we have reached the point where the level of taxes and fees on these homes and goods/services have gotten so large that once you pass these costs down to the consumer, the average couple can't afford it. Most of this added cost is because of the Government, not capitalist business.


But Liberals are out to help the little guy.....right? Really?

Actually it is the conservatives and capitalism that has given the little guy more than anyone else. Our poor still has cellphines, 60 inch plasma tv's and $5,000 rims on their cars. Contrary to popular lies all poor have access to healthcare, but the people getting Government supplied care to include preventive care are intentionally included in the Liberals numbers because if they didn't, the majority in America without healthcare would be illegals who should not be getting free care anyway.........but these same illegals still get free healthcare at emergency rooms, there are very few in America who can't get the medical treatments they need.


All I can say is stop being a blind follower and look around, the Liberals are not giving you anything, they are instead taking away your ability to think for yourself and want obedience to their ideas in return for the "free" money they give you.

The person who wrote the above has more beliefs about economics than knowledge.

[Lunatic Goofballs]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

Considering that every move made by the Liberals they claim will help the poor actually ends up hurting the poor more I have to giggle every time some uneducated blind follower like this speaks.

-snip-

Quit with the flaming. In addition to being actionable, it only hurts your argument. No mercy will be shown in the future.

[Lunatic Goofballs]

I hope that American voters won't be stupid enough to go back to conservatives just because Obama hasn't made all their wishes come true in his first six months. He's not perfect, but he's accomplished quite a bit, and people are expecting too much of him.

If conservatism makes a real comeback, America's economy, reputation, and standards for human rights will likely collapse. Not that I expect a conservative comeback to be widespread or long term.

-snip-

The person who wrote the above has more beliefs about economics than knowledge.

Attack the argument not the person making it.

[Kantria]

Goddamn LIBRULS! They want my money!