NATION

PASSWORD

Christians, why do you follow Paul's doctrines?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Christians, why do you follow Paul's doctrines?

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:04 am

No particular offense intended. I just thought up a rather perplexing issue with Christianity and would like to hear what it's proponents would have to say for this

It strikes me now, upon consideration, as someone who's reasonably familiar with the Bible (deconverted Christian, read it in its entirety several times), that, taking it at its face value, there doesn't seem to be any particular internal reason for one to take any of the writings of/concerning Paul at their word.

Assuming the narrative of the gospels to be accurate, it would seem that Jesus, upon ascending to heaven, left his 'authority' with his disciples, Peter in particular. From there, his disciples spread out around the Roman Empire and elsewhere making converts and spreading Jesus's teaching, effectively founding the Church.

At some point relatively later, though still in the lifetime of the disciples, schisms begin to form between differing factions of allegedly Christ-aligned religious advocates. Paul himself being only one such man. Per his own presented narrative, he claims to have met Jesus on the road to Damascus, been converted there, etc. but it strikes me that there were a good number of others also claiming to have received the true revelation of Jesus, most of whom have seemed to have faded into historical obscurity, but seem on the face of it, to have equally plausible (ie. unfalsifiable) claim to Paul.

As far as I can tell, beyond his disciples, Jesus himself never seems to name which, if any of these individuals would be his 'true' followers, so there seems to be nothing, objectively, from Jesus himself confirming Paul's authority except for Paul's own claimed narrative.

Basically, I don't see how one draws a logical connection between the authority of Jesus and that of Paul, particularly when some of Paul's teachings seem relatively at odds with the religious teachings Jesus put forth. The more I think of it, it strikes me as quite odd that the writings of Paul are given equal canonical weight with the gospels concerning Jesus, and those writings of his disciples (who Jesus directly stated to be his true followers). Can any Christians shed some light on the underlying reasoning here, because I'm really not seeing it.

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:08 am

As an Orthodox Christian,I do not
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:09 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:As an Orthodox Christian,I do not


Interesting. So the Pauline books aren't considered canonical by the Orthodox Church then?

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:11 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:As an Orthodox Christian,I do not


Interesting. So the Pauline books aren't considered canonical by the Orthodox Church then?


His authority is not but he is a consindered a prophet
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:14 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
Interesting. So the Pauline books aren't considered canonical by the Orthodox Church then?


His authority is not but he is a consindered a prophet


I see. Well, I suppose the issue still stands somewhat then. How exactly is one to know Paul to have been a 'true' follower of Jesus as opposed to any of a number of other such individuals with wildly different theologies but similar such claims, when Jesus himself, in the gospels, never seems to give any sort of indication of which, if any, of them is correct?

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:16 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:
His authority is not but he is a consindered a prophet


I see. Well, I suppose the issue still stands somewhat then. How exactly is one to know Paul to have been a 'true' follower of Jesus as opposed to any of a number of other such individuals with wildly different theologies but similar such claims, when Jesus himself, in the gospels, never seems to give any sort of indication of which, if any, of them is correct?


Thing mate is,that Jesus=God.Everything else,including the church,is man made.This is why from area to area (nation to nation usually) christians have other traditions (who are usualy ancient pagan ones).For me the only ture word is the one of God.Now,I have not studied the writting of Paulos,all I know is the Pope thing and how the Pope betrayed us
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Atest
Attaché
 
Posts: 68
Founded: Jan 13, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Atest » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:17 am

I find it odd that people make such a large leap of faith in assuming that Paul is even just a prophet. How do you know he is a prophet? Because he said so? Because the Bible tells you so? How do you know what the Bible says is true, or that it was even written by the people you think it was written by? It is truly troublesome, since by that characterization, I could become a prophet if I simply say I am.
To establish a fair, educated society grounded in reason and respect.

"Progressive for all."

President: Baligh Ustadh
Foreign Minister: Sultana Hassan

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:19 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
I see. Well, I suppose the issue still stands somewhat then. How exactly is one to know Paul to have been a 'true' follower of Jesus as opposed to any of a number of other such individuals with wildly different theologies but similar such claims, when Jesus himself, in the gospels, never seems to give any sort of indication of which, if any, of them is correct?


Thing mate is,that Jesus=God.Everything else,including the church,is man made.This is why from area to area (nation to nation usually) christians have other traditions (who are usualy ancient pagan ones).For me the only ture word is the one of God.Now,I have not studied the writting of Paulos,all I know is the Pope thing and how the Pope betrayed us


I understand basically where you're coming from. I'm a deconverted Christian (Protestant specifically, so if in somewhat different ways, also not much a fan of that bastard in Rome. xD).

I'm just asking how, even in terms of the Bible/Jesus's words, one can make a case that Paul is telling the truth, when Jesus seems to say nothing to affirm him (aside from in Paul's own account), and Paul's theology seems, at least on some levels, rather different from that espoused by Jesus.

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:19 am

Atest wrote:I find it odd that people make such a large leap of faith in assuming that Paul is even just a prophet. How do you know he is a prophet? Because he said so? Because the Bible tells you so? How do you know what the Bible says is true, or that it was even written by the people you think it was written by? It is truly troublesome, since by that characterization, I could become a prophet if I simply say I am.


He is not a prophet he is an Apostole.He spread christianity,he is called the Apostle of Nations (or Baptizer of Nations)
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:21 am

Atest wrote:I find it odd that people make such a large leap of faith in assuming that Paul is even just a prophet. How do you know he is a prophet? Because he said so? Because the Bible tells you so? How do you know what the Bible says is true, or that it was even written by the people you think it was written by? It is truly troublesome, since by that characterization, I could become a prophet if I simply say I am.


Basically, yeah.

I mean, as a matter of definition, Christians take Jesus to be divine as an article of faith. Which, fine, that's definitional. And I can see fairly clearly how you get from that to the writings of his own affirmed disciples. Just not Paul, who seems, as far as I can see, to be a guy who came around later on, claiming, with no collaborative evidence, to have been 'chosen' by Jesus, even though his doctrines were somewhat different. Just seems kind of dubious, even in its own terms.

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:22 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
Atest wrote:I find it odd that people make such a large leap of faith in assuming that Paul is even just a prophet. How do you know he is a prophet? Because he said so? Because the Bible tells you so? How do you know what the Bible says is true, or that it was even written by the people you think it was written by? It is truly troublesome, since by that characterization, I could become a prophet if I simply say I am.


Basically, yeah.

I mean, as a matter of definition, Christians take Jesus to be divine as an article of faith. Which, fine, that's definitional. And I can see fairly clearly how you get from that to the writings of his own affirmed disciples. Just not Paul, who seems, as far as I can see, to be a guy who came around later on, claiming, with no collaborative evidence, to have been 'chosen' by Jesus, even though his doctrines were somewhat different. Just seems kind of dubious, even in its own terms.


I disagree with the 'chosen by jesus' and the Pope position.But his achievements of spreading christianity are devine work
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:23 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Atest wrote:I find it odd that people make such a large leap of faith in assuming that Paul is even just a prophet. How do you know he is a prophet? Because he said so? Because the Bible tells you so? How do you know what the Bible says is true, or that it was even written by the people you think it was written by? It is truly troublesome, since by that characterization, I could become a prophet if I simply say I am.


He is not a prophet he is an Apostole.He spread christianity,he is called the Apostle of Nations (or Baptizer of Nations)


Well, fine. Semantics over titles aside though, how do you know that Paul wasn't a liar/false prophet as you presumably would view most of the other such individuals in his time period who claimed to have had visions from Jesus/started their own theological movements/etc. ? Because it strikes me that it seems he has no more 'evidence' than any of them that Jesus actually 'chose' him.

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:25 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:
He is not a prophet he is an Apostole.He spread christianity,he is called the Apostle of Nations (or Baptizer of Nations)


Well, fine. Semantics over titles aside though, how do you know that Paul wasn't a liar/false prophet as you presumably would view most of the other such individuals in his time period who claimed to have had visions from Jesus/started their own theological movements/etc. ? Because it strikes me that it seems he has no more 'evidence' than any of them that Jesus actually 'chose' him.


Well sorry to burst your bubble but apart from the 12 students jesus did not choose anyone else.All the Saints were declared so by the chruch and there are plenty of saints who were not even declared (which is why we have a day to celebrated them,it is called the 'Day of Holly All')
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Atest
Attaché
 
Posts: 68
Founded: Jan 13, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Atest » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:25 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Atest wrote:I find it odd that people make such a large leap of faith in assuming that Paul is even just a prophet. How do you know he is a prophet? Because he said so? Because the Bible tells you so? How do you know what the Bible says is true, or that it was even written by the people you think it was written by? It is truly troublesome, since by that characterization, I could become a prophet if I simply say I am.


He is not a prophet he is an Apostole.He spread christianity,he is called the Apostle of Nations (or Baptizer of Nations)


Your point being? Whether or not is divine power level is over 9000 literally has no relevance to what I said. How do you know the man is who you think he is, or that any of the Bible was actually divinely inspired?
To establish a fair, educated society grounded in reason and respect.

"Progressive for all."

President: Baligh Ustadh
Foreign Minister: Sultana Hassan

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:28 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
Well, fine. Semantics over titles aside though, how do you know that Paul wasn't a liar/false prophet as you presumably would view most of the other such individuals in his time period who claimed to have had visions from Jesus/started their own theological movements/etc. ? Because it strikes me that it seems he has no more 'evidence' than any of them that Jesus actually 'chose' him.


Well sorry to burst your bubble but apart from the 12 students jesus did not choose anyone else.All the Saints were declared so by the chruch and there are plenty of saints who were not even declared (which is why we have a day to celebrated them,it is called the 'Day of Holly All')


That's kind of exactly the point. Why do you put the Pauline books (books written by basically just some guy who claimed to have had a vision from Jesus, with no actual evidence of such) at equal canonical weight with the Gospels/books by the disciples (who were directly chosen by Jesus)? Isn't that a bit a dubious? Why not include Mohammed / Joseph Smith / whoever else as well?

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:30 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:
Well sorry to burst your bubble but apart from the 12 students jesus did not choose anyone else.All the Saints were declared so by the chruch and there are plenty of saints who were not even declared (which is why we have a day to celebrated them,it is called the 'Day of Holly All')


That's kind of exactly the point. Why do you put the Pauline books (books written by basically just some guy who claimed to have had a vision from Jesus, with no actual evidence of such) at equal canonical weight with the Gospels/books by the disciples (who were directly chosen by Jesus)? Isn't that a bit a dubious? Why not include Mohammed / Joseph Smith / whoever else as well?


Cause the Catholics needed to support and strengthen their claim?
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Ifreann
Post Overlord
 
Posts: 159013
Founded: Aug 07, 2005
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Ifreann » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:31 am

Some class of gypsy curse, I imagine.

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:32 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
That's kind of exactly the point. Why do you put the Pauline books (books written by basically just some guy who claimed to have had a vision from Jesus, with no actual evidence of such) at equal canonical weight with the Gospels/books by the disciples (who were directly chosen by Jesus)? Isn't that a bit a dubious? Why not include Mohammed / Joseph Smith / whoever else as well?


Cause the Catholics needed to support and strengthen their claim?


As far as I'm aware, Catholics accept the authority of Paul/his works as well. As do nigh just about any modern Christian sects. I'm asking why though, as I don't particularly see any justification in jumping from Jesus to Paul. Seems... quite arbitrary.

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:34 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:
Cause the Catholics needed to support and strengthen their claim?


As far as I'm aware, Catholics accept the authority of Paul/his works as well. As do nigh just about any modern Christian sects. I'm asking why though, as I don't particularly see any justification in jumping from Jesus to Paul. Seems... quite arbitrary.


I told you apart from the POPE title (which is preety much where the catholic faith is based) he is consindered to be the man who spread christianity to the globe.They have even found people in remote areas in asia who claim to have been visited by him
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Ashmoria
Post Czar
 
Posts: 46718
Founded: Mar 19, 2004
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Ashmoria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:34 am

welp...

1) his writings make up a huge chunk of the new testament

2) he founded and supported many many christian communities and advised them in the day to day living as a christian

3) the other post-jesus apostles/disciples took him seriously, found that his dramatic conversion qualified, and accepted his teachings.

4) most christian denominations follow his teachings so its hard be in a mainline church and not be taught paul's doctrines.

what more do you want?
whatever

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:36 am

Ashmoria wrote:welp...

1) his writings make up a huge chunk of the new testament

2) he founded and supported many many christian communities and advised them in the day to day living as a christian

3) the other post-jesus apostles/disciples took him seriously, found that his dramatic conversion qualified, and accepted his teachings.

4) most christian denominations follow his teachings so its hard be in a mainline church and not be taught paul's doctrines.

what more do you want?


This.
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:36 am

DrakoBlaria wrote:
Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
As far as I'm aware, Catholics accept the authority of Paul/his works as well. As do nigh just about any modern Christian sects. I'm asking why though, as I don't particularly see any justification in jumping from Jesus to Paul. Seems... quite arbitrary.


I told you apart from the POPE title (which is preety much where the catholic faith is based) he is consindered to be the man who spread christianity to the globe.They have even found people in remote areas in asia who claim to have been visited by him


I'm not even necessarily disputing that (or at least, certainly for sake of this argument, I shan't in this thread). I'm just asking why you take him at his word and not any of the others at the same time period who made the same claims. I don't see any real causal link between "following Jesus" and "following Paul". What am I missing here?

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:36 am

Dokuritsu Nippon wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:
I told you apart from the POPE title (which is preety much where the catholic faith is based) he is consindered to be the man who spread christianity to the globe.They have even found people in remote areas in asia who claim to have been visited by him


I'm not even necessarily disputing that (or at least, certainly for sake of this argument, I shan't in this thread). I'm just asking why you take him at his word and not any of the others at the same time period who made the same claims. I don't see any real causal link between "following Jesus" and "following Paul". What am I missing here?


Cause of his work.Period
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Dokuritsu Nippon
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1617
Founded: Jun 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dokuritsu Nippon » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:39 am

Ashmoria wrote:welp...

1) his writings make up a huge chunk of the new testament

2) he founded and supported many many christian communities and advised them in the day to day living as a christian

3) the other post-jesus apostles/disciples took him seriously, found that his dramatic conversion qualified, and accepted his teachings.

4) most christian denominations follow his teachings so its hard be in a mainline church and not be taught paul's doctrines.

what more do you want?


1 and 4 are circular reasoning; essentially, "We accept his teachings as canonical because we accept his teachings as canonical." I don't see how you get there from Jesus.

2 - So did a number of other individuals who taught quite different theologies from Paul, and who were not followed, so it seems quite arbitrary.

3 - Where particularly is your evidence for that, either inside or outside of the Bible (obviously excluding the Pauline books, as, again, that would be circular).

How do you get from Jesus to Paul?

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:40 am

I tell you,the catholics see it like that cause of the Pope title.There is no official or even stated link that Paulos is Jesus II
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

Next

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Celritannia, Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot], Neu California, Spirit of Hope

Advertisement

Remove ads