The Jewish Question

[Souseiseki]

Get out of my head. You shall never know where my gold is.

Under your yamaka (sp?), of course.

Now, honestly, I have nothing else to add.

then why are you posting

[Ralkovia]

Get out of my head. You shall never know where my gold is.

switzerland

edit: shit didn't notice nanatsu no tsuki was responsible for this. the first rule of TET is actually no leaving TET.

Cayman Actually.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Nana are you Jewish?

No, I'm not. I know that I had Jewish ancestors once upon a time, but no one in my family, currently, considers themselves Jewish.

I just... lets just say that one of the first books I read in English, as a little girls, was called Number the Stars, by Lois Lowry and what the Jews went through during WWII has always moved me deeply.

[The Tiger Kingdom]

Under your yamaka (sp?), of course.

Now, honestly, I have nothing else to add.

then why are you posting

Because we still feel like an argument may break out at any second and break the temporary lull here, so we all have to keep our typing fingers warm.
That's my reason, anyway. Honestly, I should probably get to work on ES...

[DogDoo 7]

There has to be both. We can't dwell on it constantly, but we can't put it comfortably out of mind, either.

Considering the role the Holocaust has played on the consciousness of the Jews, it is something that will never be gone. It weighs heavy on our hearts. I will tell my sons and daughters the story of what my grandfather had to endure. We must never forget. But there is a time to forgive. It is time to forgive Germany, but never the Nazis.

Past oppression shouldn't be used to justify current oppression. And the memory of the Holocaust should not be trivialized and abused, or else people get sick of it, and end up insulting people who suffered. Never heard so many holocaust jokes before moving here.

[Ostroeuropa]

Oh that's easy.
It's the vaticans fault.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Oh that's easy.
It's the vaticans fault.

One could say that the Catholic Church turned a blind eye where the Jews were concerned in Germany and other places. The Vatican had a policy of no involvement during WWII.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Under your yamaka (sp?), of course.

Now, honestly, I have nothing else to add.

then why are you posting

Goodness, these flies. So bothersome.

[The Tiger Kingdom]

Considering the role the Holocaust has played on the consciousness of the Jews, it is something that will never be gone. It weighs heavy on our hearts. I will tell my sons and daughters the story of what my grandfather had to endure. We must never forget. But there is a time to forgive. It is time to forgive Germany, but never the Nazis.

Past oppression shouldn't be used to justify current oppression.

Who's being oppressed? is this turning into an Israel thing?
Because that's a different thread entirely.

And the memory of the Holocaust should not be trivialized and abused, or else people get sick of it, and end up insulting people who suffered. Never heard so many holocaust jokes before moving here.

That's true, but not many in this thread are guilty of that. Most people appreciate the seriousness of the matter.
To be fair, it was kinda rough at the start. We don't condone those people.

[Ostroeuropa]

Oh that's easy.
It's the vaticans fault.

One could say that the Catholic Church turned a blind eye where the Jews were concerned in Germany and other places. The Vatican had a policy of no involvement during WWII.

And a policy of anti-semitism for the previous 2 millenium. I don't think it would have been possible to get the ball rolling on anti-semitism properly without that. That and a lot of catholics worked in death camps.
So did protestants ofcourse, but they too inherited their anti-semitism from the catholics.

[Ralkovia]

Considering the role the Holocaust has played on the consciousness of the Jews, it is something that will never be gone. It weighs heavy on our hearts. I will tell my sons and daughters the story of what my grandfather had to endure. We must never forget. But there is a time to forgive. It is time to forgive Germany, but never the Nazis.

Past oppression shouldn't be used to justify current oppression. And the memory of the Holocaust should not be trivialized and abused, or else people get sick of it, and end up insulting people who suffered. Never heard so many holocaust jokes before moving here.

Holocaust only justifies the fact that between the thin veneer of civilization that man is still a brute capable of doing horrific things. Even in the middle of the enlightenment of the World, and the beginning of secularization, 6 million people were destroyed because of their religion.

It's a lesson to the Jews as well. What we have learned is that the safety of Jews must be taken into the hands of Jews and we must never relinquish our fate into the hands of others. We won't go walking towards the gas chambers any longer and we won't accept being targeted anymore. We reject the role of the victim.

[The Tiger Kingdom]

Oh that's easy.
It's the vaticans fault.

One could say that the Catholic Church turned a blind eye where the Jews were concerned in Germany and other places. The Vatican had a policy of no involvement during WWII.

Yeah, the Vatican keeps SAYING it has a good record in WW2, but the fact they have to KEEP saying it amidst all the bad-looking evidence doesn't help much.
Catholics did a lot of good things for the Jews during the war at various levels (even using the Vatican itself as a shelter), but no thanks can be given to the Vatican itself for that as its policy, beyond that one exception. Pius was a bit too comfy with fascism.

[Ostroeuropa]

Past oppression shouldn't be used to justify current oppression. And the memory of the Holocaust should not be trivialized and abused, or else people get sick of it, and end up insulting people who suffered. Never heard so many holocaust jokes before moving here.

Holocaust only justifies the fact that between the thin veneer of civilization that man is still a brute capable of doing horrific things. Even in the middle of the enlightenment of the World, and the beginning of secularization, 6 million people were destroyed because of their religion.

It's a lesson to the Jews as well. What we have learned is that the safety of Jews must be taken into the hands of Jews and we must never relinquish our fate into the hands of others. We won't go walking towards the gas chambers any longer and we won't accept being targeted anymore. We reject the role of the victim.

No, nazi germany was not secular.
No, they were destroyed because of their race.

[Ostroeuropa]

One could say that the Catholic Church turned a blind eye where the Jews were concerned in Germany and other places. The Vatican had a policy of no involvement during WWII.

Yeah, the Vatican keeps SAYING it has a good record in WW2, but the fact they have to KEEP saying it amidst all the bad-looking evidence doesn't help much.
Catholics did a lot of good things for the Jews during the war at various levels (even using the Vatican itself as a shelter), but no thanks can be given to the Vatican itself for that as its policy, beyond that one exception. Pius was a bit too comfy with fascism.

Fascism is just a polite way of refering to catholic fundamentalism. Replace the word "Fascist" in history books dealing with things from before 1950 with "Catholic Fundamentalist" and you are refering to the same group of people.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

One could say that the Catholic Church turned a blind eye where the Jews were concerned in Germany and other places. The Vatican had a policy of no involvement during WWII.

And a policy of anti-semitism for the previous 2 millenium. I don't think it would have been possible to get the ball rolling on anti-semitism properly without that.

That reminded me of the Jewish massacre in Strasbourg in the 1300s. The Catholic Church whipped people into a frenzy and blamed the outburst of plague in the area on the Jewish population. I don't remember how many of them were burnt at the auto da fes in the town.

Several hundreds, according to Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strasbourg_massacre

[Souseiseki]

then why are you posting

Goodness, these flies. So bothersome.

i'm not the one that spends most of their time circling around shit so fly doesn't really fit. that was a pretty sick burn though.

[Ralkovia]

Holocaust only justifies the fact that between the thin veneer of civilization that man is still a brute capable of doing horrific things. Even in the middle of the enlightenment of the World, and the beginning of secularization, 6 million people were destroyed because of their religion.

It's a lesson to the Jews as well. What we have learned is that the safety of Jews must be taken into the hands of Jews and we must never relinquish our fate into the hands of others. We won't go walking towards the gas chambers any longer and we won't accept being targeted anymore. We reject the role of the victim.

No, nazi germany was not secular.
No, they were destroyed because of their race.

True, but Judaism is not a race. They targeted Ashkenazim, but the only way to distinguish Ashkenazim from anyone else was by Judaism.

[Ostroeuropa]

And a policy of anti-semitism for the previous 2 millenium. I don't think it would have been possible to get the ball rolling on anti-semitism properly without that.

That reminded me of the Jewish massacre in Strasbourg in the 1300s. The Cotholic Church whipped people into a frenzy and blamed the outburst of plague in the area on the Jewish population. I don't remember how many of them were burnt at the auto da fes in the town.

Several hundreds, according to Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strasbourg_massacre

That, and the Spanish Inquisistion got going out of fear of the
"Secret Muslims" / "Secret Jews" attending mass.
OFFER THEM PORK!
TORTURE THOSE WHO REFUSE!
(Spain and portugal still have the tradition of offering various pork products on a platter during parties.)

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

One could say that the Catholic Church turned a blind eye where the Jews were concerned in Germany and other places. The Vatican had a policy of no involvement during WWII.

Yeah, the Vatican keeps SAYING it has a good record in WW2, but the fact they have to KEEP saying it amidst all the bad-looking evidence doesn't help much.
Catholics did a lot of good things for the Jews during the war at various levels (even using the Vatican itself as a shelter), but no thanks can be given to the Vatican itself for that as its policy, beyond that one exception. Pius was a bit too comfy with fascism.

Agreed. WWII served the Vatican's anti-semitic feelings. Sad to say.

[The Tiger Kingdom]

Holocaust only justifies the fact that between the thin veneer of civilization that man is still a brute capable of doing horrific things. Even in the middle of the enlightenment of the World, and the beginning of secularization, 6 million people were destroyed because of their religion.

It's a lesson to the Jews as well. What we have learned is that the safety of Jews must be taken into the hands of Jews and we must never relinquish our fate into the hands of others. We won't go walking towards the gas chambers any longer and we won't accept being targeted anymore. We reject the role of the victim.

No, nazi germany was not secular.
No, they were destroyed because of their race.

Nazi Germany was decidedly not secular, the endorsement of all those freaky Pagan/Norse rites and the technical support for the Catholic Church kinda go against that.

Yeah, the Vatican keeps SAYING it has a good record in WW2, but the fact they have to KEEP saying it amidst all the bad-looking evidence doesn't help much.
Catholics did a lot of good things for the Jews during the war at various levels (even using the Vatican itself as a shelter), but no thanks can be given to the Vatican itself for that as its policy, beyond that one exception. Pius was a bit too comfy with fascism.

Fascism is just a polite way of refering to catholic fundamentalism. Replace the word "Fascist" in history books dealing with things from before 1950 with "Catholic Fundamentalist" and you are refering to the same group of people.

Hooooooooooo, that'll start a fight.
I won't go that far, but they do seem to work together fairly well when they make contact. That's as far as I'll take it.

[The Tiger Kingdom]

No, nazi germany was not secular.
No, they were destroyed because of their race.

True, but Judaism is not a race. They targeted Ashkenazim, but the only way to distinguish Ashkenazim from anyone else was by Judaism.

Or by the most base and racist Jewish racial stereotypes.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

That reminded me of the Jewish massacre in Strasbourg in the 1300s. The Cotholic Church whipped people into a frenzy and blamed the outburst of plague in the area on the Jewish population. I don't remember how many of them were burnt at the auto da fes in the town.

Several hundreds, according to Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strasbourg_massacre

That, and the Spanish Inquisistion got going out of fear of the
"Secret Muslims" / "Secret Jews" attending mass.
OFFER THEM PORK!
TORTURE THOSE WHO REFUSE!
(Spain and portugal still have the tradition of offering various pork products on a platter during parties.)

The Spanish Inquisition and the Expulsion, IMO, will be one 2 of the biggest crimes committed against Jews by Spain. I also think Rome made a monster in allowing so much independence to the Inquisition in Spain. And the Spanish monarchs, Ferdinand and Isabella, so short-sighted and cruel...

They thought that by forcing the edict on the Jews if Spain, that they would convert to Catholicism so as not to lose their possessions. Little did they know that when forced to choose between home or faith, the great majority of the Jews would choose faith.

Goodness, these flies. So bothersome.

i'm not the one that spends most of their time circling around shit so fly doesn't really fit. that was a pretty sick burn though.

You say that yet, here you are, not posting about the topic in question. Mhm.

[3 State Alliance]

I agree with the OP. Canada's official response from Prime Minister King to assylum seekers was "We are currently not accepting any Jews at the moment." Just think he was from the Liberal Party!

Prime Minister King was also a Hitler fan and bought into international Semitic conspiracies.

[Ralkovia]

True, but Judaism is not a race. They targeted Ashkenazim, but the only way to distinguish Ashkenazim from anyone else was by Judaism.

Or by the most base and racist Jewish racial stereotypes.

The Germans truthfully had no way of knowing. Hence why they relied so heavily on Temple Membership Lists and Collaborators.

The Germans did not go around shooting people with big noses. They could target only the most stereotypical of Jews, who wore all the clothing that made them a Jew.

[Souseiseki]

You say that yet, here you are, not posting about the topic in question. Mhm.

yes. probably shouldn't be doing this. you're infectious.