Only 15% of Americans accept evolution.

[Dyakovo]

And unfortunately, this isn't the thread to debate on whether God himself exists, we do have a thread for that.

I’m not trying to debate the existence of God, I’m not even making a point one way or another, all I’m saying is that both sides of the issue are possibly true, and no one can say that their side of the argument has been “proven” correct.

So you're just spamming?

[West Angola]

And I don't see the OPs tone saying there is no deities.

And yes, someone who denies evolution is denying factual proof. Because this thread is about how many many many Americans deny evolution.

The OP refers to those who believe that God guided evolution as "not accepting basic science." He lumps those who believe in evolution guided by a deity into the group that deny it.

Then how about you learn statistics, or grant the flat earth society equal teaching time for their material in classrooms?

Because a flat earth is disproven by repeated circumnavigations as well as trips to space.

Not relevant to the discussion.

It is relevant, because he treats those who believe God (or another deity) guided evolution as people who “deny” evolution.

So you're just spamming?

No, I’m not making a point as to whether or not God exists, I’m saying that it cannot be proven. Because it cannot be proven, the OP cannot act as though it can.

[Great Nepal]

Sure it is endorsing religious institution however since it harms no one: assuming there is free room, it is fine to give religious what the want.

Actually if setting aside a moment of silence at a time when no one is having lessons to begin with harms atheists then having one less school room for learning because it's set aside for Prayer is harms atheists who believe that the room could be used for a more educational purpose.

See that?
It doesn't need to be prayer room. Assembly hall, when empty does job just as well.

Furthermore there's the supposed peer pressure that you seemed to speak of. I mean if seeing someone pray in the morning will convert you to religion by peer pressure, wouldn't people peer pressure atheists for not going to the prayer room?
I mean obviously if children are so weak willed that they'll suddenly declare they believe in god simply because they hear someone praying then how would they not be weak willed to be pressured by their friends to go to the prayer room with the same result?

Never claimed that.
What I claimed was using study time to do so is shameful and wasteful use of school's study time.

Hey I'm just using your own argument against you, don't fault me.

Quote me saying that peer pressure will convert students.

[Mavorpen]

The OP refers to those who believe that God guided evolution as "not accepting basic science." He lumps those who believe in evolution guided by a deity into the group that deny it.

...Because they aren't accepting basic science. That doesn't mean the OP is saying, "GOD IS A MYTH! EVERYONE WHO DISAGREES IS STOOPID!"

It is relevant, because he treats those who believe God (or another deity) guided evolution as people who “deny” evolution.

They're definitely denying the Theory of Evolution if they're making claims about a deity being involved with the process, effectively rejecting the core concepts of evolution.

[West Angola]

Mostly because science doesn't call for proof, it calls for evidence. And in the question of evolution, which is what this thread is about, not God, both sides are not equally possible. Evolution is one of if not the most well supported theory in science, evidence for God or creation is non-existant. They are not equal.

I never said equal, I said possibly true.

...Because they aren't accepting basic science. That doesn't mean the OP is saying, "GOD IS A MYTH! EVERYONE WHO DISAGREES IS STOOPID!"

If it is said that someone doesn’t accept basic science, the implication is that they are stupid.

[Enadail]

The OP refers to those who believe that God guided evolution as "not accepting basic science." He lumps those who believe in evolution guided by a deity into the group that deny it.

And you're acting like it doesn't. The most basic element of science is empiricism. If you believe something without evidence, or believe science needs something non-empirical, you're ignoring the most basic tenant of science.

[Individuality-ness]

Hey I'm just using your own argument against you, don't fault me.

Quote me saying that peer pressure will convert students.

I think what happened was that he misinterpreted my argument. I said that due to peer pressure students would feel like they HAVE to pray lest they face ostracism from their peers and authority figures should there be a specific time set just for prayer.

[Enadail]

Mostly because science doesn't call for proof, it calls for evidence. And in the question of evolution, which is what this thread is about, not God, both sides are not equally possible. Evolution is one of if not the most well supported theory in science, evidence for God or creation is non-existant. They are not equal.

I never said equal, I said possibly true.

Possibly true in a non-practical sense, yes. Just like its possible I am actually you.

[Dyakovo]

And I don't see the OPs tone saying there is no deities.

And yes, someone who denies evolution is denying factual proof. Because this thread is about how many many many Americans deny evolution.

The OP refers to those who believe that God guided evolution as "not accepting basic science." He lumps those who believe in evolution guided by a deity into the group that deny it.

Then how about you learn statistics, or grant the flat earth society equal teaching time for their material in classrooms?

Because a flat earth is disproven by repeated circumnavigations as well as trips to space.

Not relevant to the discussion.

It is relevant, because he treats those who belie.ve God (or another deity) guided evolution as people who “deny” evolution.

The OP's claim about those that deny evolution is accurate, and, no, whether or not your magical sky faerie is real is not relevant, so quit threadjacking

[Alien Space Bats]

This whole thread annoys the fuck out of me.

• The basic opinion numbers haven't changed since 1982. Thirty years, no change. How in the Hell is this news?
  
  
• 32% say they believe in evolution, but that they also believes God has a hand in the process. Well, duh! Over 80% of Americans believe in God; so what do you expect religious people who believe in evolution to say? "Yes, I believe in a God who watches over us and has an effect on our lives, but no, I think He's always out to lunch when it comes to evolution?!?" Seriously?!?
  
  A religious person who believes in evolution is going to believe that God occasionally slips his hand into the process, for His own inscrutable reasons. This doesn't mean that such a person is going to insist that "intelligent design" or "theistic evolution" should be taught in schools or recognized by science as any kind of established theory; no, this simply means that you're looking at a person of faith who is squaring the circle. Those 32% are religious people who believe in evolution, but also continue to retain their faith. Big deal.

So what this thread boils down to is whining by atheists that there are still a huge majority of people out there who believe in God. Well, too fucking bad. Deal with it and move on, and stop looking like such a bunch of whiny little misanthropes.

A third of the American populace believe in evolution and God, and that's that. Anybody who says that you can't believe in both is full of shit — no, ifs, ands, or buts.

---

ADDENDUM: And don't reply by saying that there's no proof that God has a hand in evolution: That's irrelevant. People of faith who believe in evolution don't believe in a "different kind" of evolution than atheists; they're not advancing an "alternative theory" of evolution that requires the presence of God in order to work. Mostly, they're not thinking about how to link the two beliefs together at all; at most — if they've thought about it — they probably believe that God is like a hacker who left himself a back door in the DNA, by which he could create the duck-billed platypus out of sheer amusement after smoking a jay. IOW, they are simply reconciling two different beliefs that may, at first blush, appear irreconcilable. Interestingly enough, people do this all the time in all sorts of areas (eg., politics, where American liberals support the 1st Amendment while disparaging the 2nd, or where American conservatives refuse to believe that government spending creates jobs — except when it's spending by the Pentagon); it's just what human beings do.

Of course, you can criticize such thinking if you want — that's your prerogative — but psychologists tell us that everybody does this sort of thing, sooner or later. Even atheists.

[Mavorpen]

Mostly because science doesn't call for proof, it calls for evidence. And in the question of evolution, which is what this thread is about, not God, both sides are not equally possible. Evolution is one of if not the most well supported theory in science, evidence for God or creation is non-existant. They are not equal.

I never said equal, I said possibly true.

Except now you're claiming that both are only "possibly true." Evolution is more than "possibly" true.

[Mavorpen]

If it is said that someone doesn’t accept basic science, the implication is that they are stupid.

No. Enough with this persecution complex, where every criticism is a person attack on you.

[Dyakovo]

I never said equal, I said possibly true.

Possibly true in a non-practical sense, yes. Just like its possible I am actually you.

It's possible that he is a zebra with a special keyboard.

[Ende]

So what this thread boils down to is whining by atheists that there are still a huge majority of people out there who believe in God. Well, too fucking bad. Deal with it and move on, and stop looking like such a bunch of whiny little misanthropes.

89 pages summed up in a single paragraph.

Damnnnnn.

[Mavorpen]

ADDENDUM: And don't reply by saying that there's no proof that God has a hand in evolution: That's irrelevant.

Not sure how making a positive claim that alters one of our most well-backed theories with no evidence is irrelevant.

People of faith who believe in evolution don't believe in a "different kind" of evolution than atheists; they're not advancing an "alternative theory" of evolution that requires the presence of God in order to work.

Of course they're not advancing an alternative theory. That would be an abuse of the word theory.

[Mavorpen]

So what this thread boils down to is whining by atheists that there are still a huge majority of people out there who believe in God. Well, too fucking bad. Deal with it and move on, and stop looking like such a bunch of whiny little misanthropes.

89 pages summed up in a single paragraph.

Damnnnnn.

Not if you read the thread.

[Jedi8246]

Why is it embarrassing?

Imagine if a huge amount of your country believed that they were in personal communication with a hair dryer. That view is about as true as anti-evolution.

There is a difference between a hair dryer and God. Even if you don't believe in the deity.

[Esternial]

89 pages summed up in a single paragraph.

Damnnnnn.

Not if you read the thread.

Whining to combat whining.

[Farnhamia]

89 pages summed up in a single paragraph.

Damnnnnn.

Not if you read the thread.

And did ASB get up on the wrong side of the bed? No cause to spoil our fun.

[Mavorpen]

Imagine if a huge amount of your country believed that they were in personal communication with a hair dryer. That view is about as true as anti-evolution.

There is a difference between a hair dryer and God. Even if you don't believe in the deity.

Yes, hair dryers exist.

[Dyakovo]

People of faith who believe in evolution don't believe in a "different kind" of evolution than atheists;

Theistic evolution and the Theory of Evolution via Natural Selection are completely different, so, yes, they do.

[Ende]

89 pages summed up in a single paragraph.

Damnnnnn.

Not if you read the thread.

I read a couple pages, and threads this length tend to repeat.

It's mostly just people bitching.

[Mavorpen]

Not if you read the thread.

Whining to combat whining.

I'm used to receiving 100 smacks to my buttocks.

Not if you read the thread.

And did ASB get up on the wrong side of the bed? No cause to spoil our fun.

I thought we were done with the, "this thread is stupid and pointless, and everyone is whining, and rehgreoignreioger!" posts.

[Dyakovo]

So what this thread boils down to is whining by atheists that there are still a huge majority of people out there who believe in God. Well, too fucking bad. Deal with it and move on, and stop looking like such a bunch of whiny little misanthropes.

89 pages summed up in a single paragraph.

Damnnnnn.

Summed up incorrectly.
Now go away since you have nothing to contribute.

[Mavorpen]

Not if you read the thread.

I read a couple pages, and threads this length tend to repeat.

It's mostly just people bitching.

Not really contesting the bitching part, so much as what is being bitched about. I've not seen any atheists (at least the ones who have contributed the most) screaming, "HOW DARE CHRISTIANS EXIST IN AMERICA!?" Rather, we have been discussing the affects of belief in God on the theory of evolution and whether they are actually rejecting the core concepts of it or not.