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Will you side with the Transhumanists?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Do you support transhumanism?

I support transhumanism.
75
37%
I oppose transhumanism.
31
15%
I don't care about transhumanism.
18
9%
I don't know what transhumanism is.
15
7%
Best of luck, Buck Rogers. In 10,000 years there will still be a version of a toilet, so take your Turing-quality sex-bot fantasies back to 4chan.
45
22%
Myrth
5
2%
Neither Support Nor Oppose. Leave me Out of it.
14
7%
 
Total votes : 203

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Chinese Regions
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Postby Chinese Regions » Sun Dec 23, 2012 4:51 pm

People can't be genetically modified if they are alive, they still have to an embryo, I think? Until we find safer ways then using radiation blasts, mechanisation is the best choice.
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Stovokor
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Postby Stovokor » Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:24 pm

Chinese Regions wrote:People can't be genetically modified if they are alive, they still have to an embryo, I think? Until we find safer ways then using radiation blasts, mechanisation is the best choice.


Actually as it stands it appears we're making faster progress on the genetic/organic side of things, sure a person can only be altered before birth but it will help fix any genetic problems they might have before birth, diseases, defects, etc.
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IshCong
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Postby IshCong » Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:14 pm

The USOT wrote:
Arkinesia wrote:The inevitable problem will be genetic discrimination.

I don't think anyone wants to wish genetic discrimination on people.

But seriously, it's an inescapable future reality with genetic enhancements. We are a naturally discriminatory race, and there's no genetic switch that flips on or off to discrimination.

I think the main issue would be the transatory period, the part in which genetic manipulation is not something available to the masses. I can envision a point where if it was cheaply available it would be akin to discrimination with clothes. Of course you would still have a few nudists (or non augmented individuals) around but they would be a very minority fringe group.


A good reason to try and manage that transitory period carefully, and ensure that it does not linger and become constant.




New Sapienta wrote:
Divair wrote:No reason why we can't have both. I've recently grown a strong liking for nature and I'm still a transhumanist.

Agreed.

I just don't like unfettered transhumanism.


Unfettered anything is usually a bad idea. =T
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Renegade Babylonian Kings
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Postby Renegade Babylonian Kings » Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:30 pm

IshCong wrote:
Unfettered anything is usually a bad idea. =T


As a matter of religious belief, my church teaches that "Unfettered" may only apply to God (Christopher Walken) or Dyanne Thorne (a ghastly sexploitation actress from the seventies who is basically the reason I can't have healthy normal sex with a woman that genuine likes me).
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The Mizarian Empire
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Postby The Mizarian Empire » Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:50 pm

I'm Pro-transhumanism. I admit and agree that the human body does have its faults, however as i've already stated in another thread about this subject, one must be careful. The concept of improving upon the human mind and body is a risky concept and with it comes both major and subtle consequences that must be considered.

When I think of Transhumanism I (typically) think of major re-designing of the human body. By today's standards such alterations exist in the form of plastic surgery (which primarily is for cosmetic/aesthetic purposes only) however what we're suggesting with this line of thought is so SO much more in depth. When someone gets a breast implant or similar such procedures done, 2 things are common: Mocking or Gawking. Mocking in the sense that "Oh har har, XXXXX feels so insecure about themselves that he/she had to get a bigger YYYYY". Gawking in the sense of "Whooooaaa, thats sexy/impressive", nothing more, nothing less.

Transhumanism has the potential to not only completely eliminate this seemingly simple idea or concept from society, but to completely change it's opinion of major alterations to the human body. Religious organizations will probably be all kinds of against this, what with the "Sanctity of the human body" being another thing I often hear such spiritual individuals screaming about in these regards. It may come to a point where its even normal to have such enhancements to such a point that those without them are considered outcasts or undesirables. Without even stopping to consider it this line of thought opens up a whole new train of potential hate-crimes.

Transhumanism has the ability to completely change cultures across the earth as new ideas/inventions become commonplace, take for example the Internet. Society has changed almost completely in the past couple years with wide-spread common use of the internet. Anyone with an internet connection now has all the information he or she desires at the (metaphorical and literal) push of a button. But with such power comes great liability. While much of the information at our disposal can be used for good,wholesome recreational purposes, other parts of it can (and are) used for acts of malice or violence.

With every great power comes a great responsibility, until we can truly stop and consider the long-term effects this could have on society, I say we need to tread incredibly careful in this new territory.
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Renegade Babylonian Kings
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Postby Renegade Babylonian Kings » Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:54 pm

The Mizarian Empire wrote:I'm Pro-transhumanism. I admit and agree that the human body does have its faults, however as i've already stated in another thread about this subject, one must be careful. The concept of improving upon the human mind and body is a risky concept and with it comes both major and subtle consequences that must be considered.

When I think of Transhumanism I (typically) think of major re-designing of the human body. By today's standards such alterations exist in the form of plastic surgery (which primarily is for cosmetic/aesthetic purposes only) however what we're suggesting with this line of thought is so SO much more in depth. When someone gets a breast implant or similar such procedures done, 2 things are common: Mocking or Gawking. Mocking in the sense that "Oh har har, XXXXX feels so insecure about themselves that he/she had to get a bigger YYYYY". Gawking in the sense of "Whooooaaa, thats sexy/impressive", nothing more, nothing less.

Transhumanism has the potential to not only completely eliminate this seemingly simple idea or concept from society, but to completely change it's opinion of major alterations to the human body. Religious organizations will probably be all kinds of against this, what with the "Sanctity of the human body" being another thing I often hear such spiritual individuals screaming about in these regards. It may come to a point where its even normal to have such enhancements to such a point that those without them are considered outcasts or undesirables. Without even stopping to consider it this line of thought opens up a whole new train of potential hate-crimes.

Transhumanism has the ability to completely change cultures across the earth as new ideas/inventions become commonplace, take for example the Internet. Society has changed almost completely in the past couple years with wide-spread common use of the internet. Anyone with an internet connection now has all the information he or she desires at the (metaphorical and literal) push of a button. But with such power comes great liability. While much of the information at our disposal can be used for good,wholesome recreational purposes, other parts of it can (and are) used for acts of malice or violence.

With every great power comes a great responsibility, until we can truly stop and consider the long-term effects this could have on society, I say we need to tread incredibly careful in this new territory.


I take umbrage at how completely reasonable this entire statement is.

You have upstaged me in my own thread.

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:57 pm

Renegade Babylonian Kings wrote:
The Mizarian Empire wrote:I'm Pro-transhumanism. I admit and agree that the human body does have its faults, however as i've already stated in another thread about this subject, one must be careful. The concept of improving upon the human mind and body is a risky concept and with it comes both major and subtle consequences that must be considered.

When I think of Transhumanism I (typically) think of major re-designing of the human body. By today's standards such alterations exist in the form of plastic surgery (which primarily is for cosmetic/aesthetic purposes only) however what we're suggesting with this line of thought is so SO much more in depth. When someone gets a breast implant or similar such procedures done, 2 things are common: Mocking or Gawking. Mocking in the sense that "Oh har har, XXXXX feels so insecure about themselves that he/she had to get a bigger YYYYY". Gawking in the sense of "Whooooaaa, thats sexy/impressive", nothing more, nothing less.

Transhumanism has the potential to not only completely eliminate this seemingly simple idea or concept from society, but to completely change it's opinion of major alterations to the human body. Religious organizations will probably be all kinds of against this, what with the "Sanctity of the human body" being another thing I often hear such spiritual individuals screaming about in these regards. It may come to a point where its even normal to have such enhancements to such a point that those without them are considered outcasts or undesirables. Without even stopping to consider it this line of thought opens up a whole new train of potential hate-crimes.

Transhumanism has the ability to completely change cultures across the earth as new ideas/inventions become commonplace, take for example the Internet. Society has changed almost completely in the past couple years with wide-spread common use of the internet. Anyone with an internet connection now has all the information he or she desires at the (metaphorical and literal) push of a button. But with such power comes great liability. While much of the information at our disposal can be used for good,wholesome recreational purposes, other parts of it can (and are) used for acts of malice or violence.

With every great power comes a great responsibility, until we can truly stop and consider the long-term effects this could have on society, I say we need to tread incredibly careful in this new territory.


I take umbrage at how completely reasonable this entire statement is.

You have upstaged me in my own thread.

If you are male, I question openly your sexuality, unless your cultural is sufficiently advanced so as not to bothered by that. If you are female, I shall wish to rampant genies that you be taken as a slave or, if permitted in your culture, sold into slavery by your father, and then you are sold to a bootleg Cirque Du Soleil crew of Chinese gypsy traveling short-con operators who are also the sole remaining descendants of an ancient order of monks and their preferred street women who knew a powerful and ancient style of Kung Fu that lets you punch through stainless steel appliances and say soothing yet contemplative things.

You old charmer, you.
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IshCong
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Postby IshCong » Sun Dec 23, 2012 8:52 pm

The Mizarian Empire wrote:I'm Pro-transhumanism. I admit and agree that the human body does have its faults, however as i've already stated in another thread about this subject, one must be careful. The concept of improving upon the human mind and body is a risky concept and with it comes both major and subtle consequences that must be considered.

When I think of Transhumanism I (typically) think of major re-designing of the human body. By today's standards such alterations exist in the form of plastic surgery (which primarily is for cosmetic/aesthetic purposes only) however what we're suggesting with this line of thought is so SO much more in depth. When someone gets a breast implant or similar such procedures done, 2 things are common: Mocking or Gawking. Mocking in the sense that "Oh har har, XXXXX feels so insecure about themselves that he/she had to get a bigger YYYYY". Gawking in the sense of "Whooooaaa, thats sexy/impressive", nothing more, nothing less.

Transhumanism has the potential to not only completely eliminate this seemingly simple idea or concept from society, but to completely change it's opinion of major alterations to the human body. Religious organizations will probably be all kinds of against this, what with the "Sanctity of the human body" being another thing I often hear such spiritual individuals screaming about in these regards. It may come to a point where its even normal to have such enhancements to such a point that those without them are considered outcasts or undesirables. Without even stopping to consider it this line of thought opens up a whole new train of potential hate-crimes.

Transhumanism has the ability to completely change cultures across the earth as new ideas/inventions become commonplace, take for example the Internet. Society has changed almost completely in the past couple years with wide-spread common use of the internet. Anyone with an internet connection now has all the information he or she desires at the (metaphorical and literal) push of a button. But with such power comes great liability. While much of the information at our disposal can be used for good,wholesome recreational purposes, other parts of it can (and are) used for acts of malice or violence.

With every great power comes a great responsibility, until we can truly stop and consider the long-term effects this could have on society, I say we need to tread incredibly careful in this new territory.


No, no, no, you're doing this all wrong. You're in favor of trans-humanism. You aren't allowed to ever think about the possible consequences of trans-humanism or the ethical and legal implications of what you're proposing. You're only allowed to rush into this blindly like some rabid fanatic.
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The Emerald Legion
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Postby The Emerald Legion » Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:19 pm

New Sapienta wrote:
Renegade Babylonian Kings wrote:Not necessarily. In some ways, they are very hostile to nature, and in fact most principally concern themselves at any given time with the ideological schism of rabbit season versus duck season.

I'm quite fascinated by these poll results. Not dismayed at all, but surprised. There is more support for transhumanism (at least we left it fairly openly defined and every vote might be advocating something quite different) than I had expected.

You mean like the poster here who is a biophobe and hates nature?

Yeah I don't like that very much either.


*raises head* You called?

But to answer the point being made, I personally find the two stances connected, but at the same time can see how they could be disconnected quite easily were it not for my own, admittedly abnormal, views.

Spoiler for those who feel like skipping me ranting on about my lunacy.
Transhumanism, and my desire for the extermination of organic life, are connected to me simply because they are both an expression of embracing the perfect order of the universe, when you stop believing fairie tales. When you stop worshipping the sacred mysteries of life, you realize that organic life holds no inherent value beyond what it can contribute. Furthermore, living things quite often get in the way, and spready quickly from small starting points. So the obvious solution is to wipe them all out save those that are useful, which are preserved in zoo's. Transhumanism is the cessation of worshiping the sacred mystery of the human body, therefore it becomes nothing but a machine you own, to do with as you will. Making improvements is the logical choice.


Of course, there may be no small amount of personal distaste for organic things influencing my reasoning here...
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Trotskylvania
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Postby Trotskylvania » Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:53 pm

Chinese Regions wrote:People can't be genetically modified if they are alive, they still have to an embryo, I think? Until we find safer ways then using radiation blasts, mechanisation is the best choice.

Oh yes they can. It's just more difficult and not as effective, but the retroviral gene engineering techniques have already been demonstrated.
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Bralia
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Postby Bralia » Sun Dec 23, 2012 11:21 pm

Faolinn wrote:
Bralia wrote:You know, I find it astonishing that some of the people who claim to be liberals in this thread are advocating stagnancy. Transhumanism is the advancement of human kind. The transcendence of human-kind. The sort of progressive change that a lot of liberals I know strive for. Breaking down traditional cultural values to be more inclusive of individuals who aren't quite the same as the majority. People that advocate for the protection of the environment and the advancement of science. And yet, when the idea of transhumanism is proposed, you say we should stick with the "old" ways. It boggles my mind . . .

We do not advocate for stagnation.We merely offer a more sane and balanced path of human evolution.If humanity is no longer defined by our bodies you claim, shouldn't we really be more intensely focused on changing the social climate rather than our bodies?This idea that technology is the only way perplexes me.If we are trying to value more immaterial things, wouldn't it make more sense to just let people be as they are born and to pay less mind to how we are physically. Cultures do not need to be entirely obliterated to be improved. Women have made significant strides all over the world in cultures that are patriarchal and they are becoming less so.Yet they have not stopped celebrating traditional festivals or practicing traditional religions. I've encountered a number of Christian and Muslim feminists. In America most people are still Christian, yet they increasingly show acceptance for homosexuals without abandoning faith. If we do not need to totally abandon our cultures and our ways of life to become better, why do we need to abandon flesh to become better. Racism is dying in many places though ethnicity has not been eliminated. I may have issues with my species, but I like who I am, and my form is my icon to the world.It is uniquely mine.I like to think that because I am being of flesh I have become stronger, that I have learned the true meaning of strength. My flesh has taught me it is not the source of my strength and I will bare it as a reminder of this. It tests me and those test have taught me quite a bit, I used to be like you.I used to believe much of what you did when I was a child, but no more. I have grown into something more. Something that machines did not make me. We believe in the right to find one's own path to transendence. In not toying around with things callously, in the diversity of solutions, in our own potential, that we do not have to give up on being as we are to improve. We believe that people are more than things you can describe in clinical terms and that understanding humanity does not come from dissecting it or in our flesh, but in our minds, in our inner essence. Whether they believe in a soul like I do or not, this becomes a sort of soul to us.

I know what you will say to this, that I'm just going on about ideals, to be quite frank I find that ignorant, and hilarious.You will do the same thing. You will try to mask the same tactic as something else when you use it.

Faolinn, I don't know if you'll get to see this, but I think we're both idealists. We simply disagree on what how to achieve those ideals. :p. Considering we're both liberal-minded, I'm willing to wager that our ideals match up fairly well. And I point to IshCong's post for the critical response, he did a nice job for me since I have to leave rather suddenly.
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Genivaria
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Postby Genivaria » Mon Dec 24, 2012 12:26 am

The Emerald Legion wrote:
New Sapienta wrote:You mean like the poster here who is a biophobe and hates nature?

Yeah I don't like that very much either.


*raises head* You called?

But to answer the point being made, I personally find the two stances connected, but at the same time can see how they could be disconnected quite easily were it not for my own, admittedly abnormal, views.

Spoiler for those who feel like skipping me ranting on about my lunacy.
Transhumanism, and my desire for the extermination of organic life, are connected to me simply because they are both an expression of embracing the perfect order of the universe, when you stop believing fairie tales. When you stop worshipping the sacred mysteries of life, you realize that organic life holds no inherent value beyond what it can contribute. Furthermore, living things quite often get in the way, and spready quickly from small starting points. So the obvious solution is to wipe them all out save those that are useful, which are preserved in zoo's. Transhumanism is the cessation of worshiping the sacred mystery of the human body, therefore it becomes nothing but a machine you own, to do with as you will. Making improvements is the logical choice.


Of course, there may be no small amount of personal distaste for organic things influencing my reasoning here...

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Multiflow
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Postby Multiflow » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:50 am

I approve of transhumanism. The thing I dislike is more of a societal trend which is shown greatly in this sub category. Our pace. We move too fast. Is there any reason that we have to be moving so fast into any of these things? Besides the great unknown of tomorrow, including death, what is the rush?

I have a project I am working on which is borderline H+. After the initial idea I took a break and worked through it. It is a great and simple idea. After the initial run up, I worked on the next steps, and also came up with some great frameworks that lead to free internet, free as in no access fees. Trouble with the first gen of the net was it is easy to hijack into a 'Big Brother' setup, or push into a hive mind setup. I have worked out partial solutions to this, but I am so concerned with it going haywire, that I am working on setting up an isolation lab, preferably out in the ocean with no net contact. Some of the algorithms ... are ... dangerous without proper rearing.

I know that I will not get financing for this, as it moves counter to most business models. So part of the projects' goals is also to make it as cheap and easily to be manufactured from a 'garage' setup. So if successful, open-source and net drop.

I actually described the second project, not the original, the original ... is classified. :D
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The USOT
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Postby The USOT » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:14 am

IshCong wrote:
The Mizarian Empire wrote:I'm Pro-transhumanism. I admit and agree that the human body does have its faults, however as i've already stated in another thread about this subject, one must be careful. The concept of improving upon the human mind and body is a risky concept and with it comes both major and subtle consequences that must be considered.

When I think of Transhumanism I (typically) think of major re-designing of the human body. By today's standards such alterations exist in the form of plastic surgery (which primarily is for cosmetic/aesthetic purposes only) however what we're suggesting with this line of thought is so SO much more in depth. When someone gets a breast implant or similar such procedures done, 2 things are common: Mocking or Gawking. Mocking in the sense that "Oh har har, XXXXX feels so insecure about themselves that he/she had to get a bigger YYYYY". Gawking in the sense of "Whooooaaa, thats sexy/impressive", nothing more, nothing less.

Transhumanism has the potential to not only completely eliminate this seemingly simple idea or concept from society, but to completely change it's opinion of major alterations to the human body. Religious organizations will probably be all kinds of against this, what with the "Sanctity of the human body" being another thing I often hear such spiritual individuals screaming about in these regards. It may come to a point where its even normal to have such enhancements to such a point that those without them are considered outcasts or undesirables. Without even stopping to consider it this line of thought opens up a whole new train of potential hate-crimes.

Transhumanism has the ability to completely change cultures across the earth as new ideas/inventions become commonplace, take for example the Internet. Society has changed almost completely in the past couple years with wide-spread common use of the internet. Anyone with an internet connection now has all the information he or she desires at the (metaphorical and literal) push of a button. But with such power comes great liability. While much of the information at our disposal can be used for good,wholesome recreational purposes, other parts of it can (and are) used for acts of malice or violence.

With every great power comes a great responsibility, until we can truly stop and consider the long-term effects this could have on society, I say we need to tread incredibly careful in this new territory.


No, no, no, you're doing this all wrong. You're in favor of trans-humanism. You aren't allowed to ever think about the possible consequences of trans-humanism or the ethical and legal implications of what you're proposing. You're only allowed to rush into this blindly like some rabid fanatic.
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Samuraikoku
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Postby Samuraikoku » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:21 am

If there's an option to sign up to be an Adeptus Astartes, I'm game.

They shall be my finest warriors, these men who give of themselves to me. Like clay I shall mould them, and in the furnace of war forge them. They will be of iron will and steely muscle. In great armour shall I clad them and with the mightiest guns will they be armed. They will be untouched by plague or disease, no sickness will blight them. They will have tactics, strategies and machines so that no foe can best them in battle. They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity.

They are my Space Marines...

... And they shall know no fear.

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Forster Keys
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Postby Forster Keys » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:22 am

Transhumanism within a capitalist framework (or at least this manifestation of it) is a recipe for disaster.
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ostroeuropa » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:41 am

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44090512/ns ... pectations

How to cure leukemia, and probably a lot more cancers.

The people opposed to human genetic engineering are luddites, pure and simple.
The fact is, human genetic engineering is an extremely positive step in the available tools to humanity, there is nothing sacred about natural biology just as there is nothing sacred about natural shelter or natural foraging.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/1312708.stm

How to cure infertility, PERMANENTLY. (As in, all this childs descendents WILL be fertile.)

In essence, isolate the gene causing infertility, replace it.
It's just that simple.
Every single aspect of the child is from it's parents bar one, the only thing the gene donor contributes to the genetic makeup is a gene overcoming the infertility problem.
This is comparable to someone still being their parents son or daughter, even though they have a donated kidney which shares none of their characteristics.

It's already happening. There hasn't been any catastrophe yet.
The prospect of so easily being able to cure diseases should be a cause for elation.



In the Penn experiment, the researchers removed certain types of white blood cells that the body uses to fight disease from the patients. Using a modified, harmless version of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS, they inserted a series of genes into the white blood cells. These were designed to make to cells target and kill the cancer cells. After growing a large batch of the genetically engineered white blood cells, the doctors injected them back into the patients.


"Let's weaponize HIV...FOR HUMANITIES ARESNAL!!!!"


It's also incredibly easy to envision that utilizing the white blood cell technique, someone could add a genetic market to these white blood cells, infect half with an additional protocall "Hunt down any white blood cells that do not contain this marker."
and leave the other half intact.

You have just cured HIV.
The virus is ALREADY inside the new blood cells, it's just repurposed, and as such other HIV viruses will not infect the new hosts, instead opting for "empty" white blood cells (I.E, the hosts natural ones) which would be TARGETS.
The half lacking this protocall are there to provide the usual immune system duties.
At a rate of 50% definately performing usual duties, you still have a comprimised immune system, but it will never be at fatal levels, especially when you consider the 50% designated to perform host-white blood cell attacks ALSO attack other foreign contaminents.


The fact is, with genetic engineering we can cure ANY DISEASE OR VIRUS that we understand the structure of.
The HIV virus performs an invaluable service to humanity in this purpose. There may one day be a reality where HIV is responsible for saving more human lives than it has ever taken.
Humanity borgs around yet again. We looked at the auroch and assimilated it, we looked at the wolf, and assimilated it. Now HIV is going to be our new pet, if only the moral busybodies would stop objecting to it.
"You shall be domesticated" is our warcry dammit, let humans act human and stop objecting to human nature.
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Mon Dec 24, 2012 8:03 am, edited 12 times in total.
Do you remember the 2012 election where Mitt Romney said Russia was the biggest threat to world peace and Obama and the Democratic establishment mocked him, mere years before they began arguing they had allowed US sovereignty to be usurped on their watch by Russia and this is why the other side was unfit to govern?
That's alright, neither do they apparently.

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The Emerald Legion
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Postby The Emerald Legion » Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:42 pm

Genivaria wrote:The Emerald Legion is NSG's personal Reaper.


Awww... that's such a nice thing to say. :twisted:
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Genivaria wrote:The Emerald Legion is NSG's personal Reaper.

The Drone Empire wrote:"Enlighten the willing, enslave the conquered, eradicate the defiant."
A typical Legionary strategy meeting.
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Phocidaea
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Postby Phocidaea » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:30 pm

Ostroeuropa wrote:The fact is, with genetic engineering we can cure ANY DISEASE OR VIRUS that we understand the structure of.
The HIV virus performs an invaluable service to humanity in this purpose. There may one day be a reality where HIV is responsible for saving more human lives than it has ever taken.
Humanity borgs around yet again. We looked at the auroch and assimilated it, we looked at the wolf, and assimilated it. Now HIV is going to be our new pet, if only the moral busybodies would stop objecting to it.
"You shall be domesticated" is our warcry dammit, let humans act human and stop objecting to human nature.


How is this related to transhumanism? You're saying it's human nature to assimilate other things... but transhumanism is basically about assimilating people.
Call me Phoca.
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Ostroeuropa
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ostroeuropa » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:37 pm

Phocidaea wrote:
Ostroeuropa wrote:The fact is, with genetic engineering we can cure ANY DISEASE OR VIRUS that we understand the structure of.
The HIV virus performs an invaluable service to humanity in this purpose. There may one day be a reality where HIV is responsible for saving more human lives than it has ever taken.
Humanity borgs around yet again. We looked at the auroch and assimilated it, we looked at the wolf, and assimilated it. Now HIV is going to be our new pet, if only the moral busybodies would stop objecting to it.
"You shall be domesticated" is our warcry dammit, let humans act human and stop objecting to human nature.


How is this related to transhumanism? You're saying it's human nature to assimilate other things... but transhumanism is basically about assimilating people.


At a certain point the entire concept breaks down if you look at it in those terms, the only terms in which transhumanism makes any sense at all, and the sense in which its proponents use it, is that transhumanism is support of biologically or mechanically altering humans to make them better.
Do you remember the 2012 election where Mitt Romney said Russia was the biggest threat to world peace and Obama and the Democratic establishment mocked him, mere years before they began arguing they had allowed US sovereignty to be usurped on their watch by Russia and this is why the other side was unfit to govern?
That's alright, neither do they apparently.

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IshCong
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Postby IshCong » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:38 pm

Phocidaea wrote:
Ostroeuropa wrote:The fact is, with genetic engineering we can cure ANY DISEASE OR VIRUS that we understand the structure of.
The HIV virus performs an invaluable service to humanity in this purpose. There may one day be a reality where HIV is responsible for saving more human lives than it has ever taken.
Humanity borgs around yet again. We looked at the auroch and assimilated it, we looked at the wolf, and assimilated it. Now HIV is going to be our new pet, if only the moral busybodies would stop objecting to it.
"You shall be domesticated" is our warcry dammit, let humans act human and stop objecting to human nature.


How is this related to transhumanism? You're saying it's human nature to assimilate other things... but transhumanism is basically about assimilating people.


No, it's not. It is making use of technology to improve the Human condition. It is not about assimilating people and I have no idea what would make you say that, aside from perhaps strawmanning.
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Sociobiology
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Postby Sociobiology » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:39 pm

biological transhumanism
genetic upgrades on the house

why would you possibly not want to be something that can rebuild itself on the molecular level?

I want to at least be as immortal as a echinoderm or a Tardigrade.
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Phocidaea
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Postby Phocidaea » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:41 pm

IshCong wrote:
Phocidaea wrote:
How is this related to transhumanism? You're saying it's human nature to assimilate other things... but transhumanism is basically about assimilating people.


No, it's not. It is making use of technology to improve the Human condition. It is not about assimilating people and I have no idea what would make you say that, aside from perhaps strawmanning.


If that's the definition, then why isn't it just "humanism"? The "trans" implies you are trying to move past humanity to something else.
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Hulboria
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Postby Hulboria » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:41 pm

You have no idea how many times I had to consciously stop myself from saying "what a crock of bull" out loud while reading that OP.
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IshCong
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Postby IshCong » Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:55 pm

Phocidaea wrote:
IshCong wrote:
No, it's not. It is making use of technology to improve the Human condition. It is not about assimilating people and I have no idea what would make you say that, aside from perhaps strawmanning.


If that's the definition, then why isn't it just "humanism"? The "trans" implies you are trying to move past humanity to something else.


Because humanism already applies to something else, that doesn't focus on the use of technology in the same way trans-humanism does. The two aren't mutually exclusive, of course, I'd say they're actually complementary.
"I think that Ish'Cong coming back is what actually killed Nations. Not the CAS ragequitting and the Axis being the Axis."
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