Should the British monarchy be abolished?

[Forsher]

That bit clearly didn't get across well. What it is meant to be saying is that because the the Assembly can do what the Monarch can do the Monarch can quite obviously do it as well.

and you'd be wrong, for the reason I stated, which you didn't adress.

Yeah, and that reason addresses the post where it may look like I'm saying that the Monarch can do everything the Assembly can.

And, by the way, Idi Amin didn't exactly have a democratic mandate did he? It may be unpalatable but that doesn't make it impossible.

[The UK in Exile]

and you'd be wrong, for the reason I stated, which you didn't adress.

Yeah, and that reason addresses the post where it may look like I'm saying that the Monarch can do everything the Assembly can.

And, by the way, Idi Amin didn't exactly have a democratic mandate did he? It may be unpalatable but that doesn't make it impossible.

he ran the country into the ground and murdered hundreds of thousands of its citizens and then had to flee the country ahead of a lynch mob.

Which is sort of the opposite of running a country. so it turns out is sort of impossible, actually.

[Nadkor]

That's not how that works.

It's Godwin's Law and it only applies when the comparison isn't valid, correct?

No - it's a statement of the increasing probability of a Nazi/Hitler comparison being made the longer a discussion goes on, and it says nothing about anyone 'winning' or 'losing' as a result, or about whether the comparison is valid or not.

It could just as easily be "as a sentence grows longer the probability of including the word 'the' approaches 1" and it would say precisely as much about validity or about winning or losing.

[Varijnland]

We 'Militant British Monarchist' prefer to be called Cavaliers.

Oh yeah Monarchists FTW (Even though they lost once)

[Mytheria]

I see no reason to, in fact it is more beneficial to keep and maintain the British monarchy than it is to abolish it.

[Ifreann]

I am quite sure the royal family does not have that kind of power on national finance, or at least it has not been done for centuries. Besides, what is wrong with child-prostitution tourism anyway?

Actually, do not answer that. It would derail the thread.

OMG, I have to puke now. I've met strange people in here, but this is beyond any limit.

Everything you've just said is wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Lords (Read the entire article)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finances_o ... yal_Family

I could read these, but I already know that the Royal Family doesn't control the finances of the UK, so I won't waste my time.

For CENTURIES they have enslaved the people and still do,

No, they don't.

they get paid millions of pounds every year

Because they've earned it.

while the ordinary folks die on the streets jobless and homeless...

Which is not really anything to do with the Royals.

---

They're pretty harmless and good for fobbing off all the hand-shaking diplomatic wankery while the real politicans make the decisions. They also occasionally throw up an interesting scandal. I'm not sure what isn't to like.

It's a bit shit that people can get born into being important parts of the government.

---

If they want it abolished, they'll march on Buckingham Palace, until then, the term 'King of England' still makes sense.

Unless Liz has died or sprouted balls, not really.

---

"Power"? Do you have any idea what you are talking about?! The Royal family doesn't have any power!

I dunno. How else would they light all the rooms in the Palace?

Burning chavs to generate electricity. You know, people power.

[Kleomentia]

While i dont know enough about the current British government i have to say, while being a monarchist, im a against it being abolished.

[The Joseon Dynasty]

While i dont know enough about the current British government i have to say, while being a monarchist, im a against it being abolished.

You probably ought to read up a bit, though. For all you know, we're horribly oppressed. In fact, Paul McCartney's performance at the Jubilee was only so terrible because it was an encoded distress call.

[Machtergreifung]

Yes. Theymust be abolished. Those rich snobs diserve nothing, what have they even done? Set up a few charitys and command a few regiments in the army, yet not be in amuch if any real trouble? I hate monarchy, but it wouldn't be so bad if they were not born into the family. If we really have to keep this outdated system, then at least give it to someone who diserves it and earned it instead of some spoilt snobs.

You should try reading a biography of Elizabeth II. Perhaps you'd have a different perspective.

Titular role during WW2, married a Greek who had family ties to Nazi's, and then supported a few charities and fringe movements.

What exactly makes her life so drasticaly different from that of a B grade celebrity, other than the fact that celebrities have to work for their fame?

[Marcurix]

You should try reading a biography of Elizabeth II. Perhaps you'd have a different perspective.

Titular role during WW2, married a Greek who had family ties to Nazi's, and then supported a few charities and fringe movements.

What exactly makes her life so drasticaly different from that of a B grade celebrity, other than the fact that celebrities have to work for their fame?

What makes you think she didn't? Unlike most celebrities, whom often come and go, her life was decided for her when she was born. Few people can claim to have worked as long or even as hard as she has. With all due respect, go and actually read up on this stuff will you? The kind of work she has done, and continues to do, is a bit more tenuous that your little summary.

[Grave_n_idle]

You should try reading a biography of Elizabeth II. Perhaps you'd have a different perspective.

Titular role during WW2, married a Greek who had family ties to Nazi's, and then supported a few charities and fringe movements.

What exactly makes her life so drasticaly different from that of a B grade celebrity, other than the fact that celebrities have to work for their fame?

That's exactly why I advised Fontoria to read a biography. Arguing against something based on ignorance is a poor argument.

[Machtergreifung]

Titular role during WW2, married a Greek who had family ties to Nazi's, and then supported a few charities and fringe movements.

What exactly makes her life so drasticaly different from that of a B grade celebrity, other than the fact that celebrities have to work for their fame?

What makes you think she didn't? Unlike most celebrities, whom often come and go, her life was decided for her when she was born. Few people can claim to have worked as long or even as hard as she has. With all due respect, go and actually read up on this stuff will you? The kind of work she has done, and continues to do, is a bit more tenuous that your little summary.

I fail to see how turning up to a few paid dinners or speaches is "hard". The Queen was born to her fame, she didn't earn it, nor has she. Frankly, Paris Hilton has made more effort to maintain her status than the queen has. Please, provide evidence of the Queen making efforts to show her worth to society.

Titular role during WW2, married a Greek who had family ties to Nazi's, and then supported a few charities and fringe movements.

What exactly makes her life so drasticaly different from that of a B grade celebrity, other than the fact that celebrities have to work for their fame?

That's exactly why I advised Fontoria to read a biography. Arguing against something based on ignorance is a poor argument.

Then please, enlighten me as to how my summary above is different from the truth.

[Marcurix]

What makes you think she didn't? Unlike most celebrities, whom often come and go, her life was decided for her when she was born. Few people can claim to have worked as long or even as hard as she has. With all due respect, go and actually read up on this stuff will you? The kind of work she has done, and continues to do, is a bit more tenuous that your little summary.

I fail to see how turning up to a few paid dinners or speaches is "hard". The Queen was born to her fame, she didn't earn it, nor has she. Frankly, Paris Hilton has made more effort to maintain her status than the queen has. Please, provide evidence of the Queen making efforts to show her worth to society.

That's exactly why I advised Fontoria to read a biography. Arguing against something based on ignorance is a poor argument.

Then please, enlighten me as to how my summary above is different from the truth.

In her duties as queen? She travels. As the ceremonial head she goes around the country, and often beyond, performing the ceremonial duties she is required. Opening hospitals, visiting schools, and many other similar activities. She often receives the so called red box-documents from ministers and such that she must read and or sign to give her ascent, along with other everyday duties. To put the already simplified version shortly, imagine that she has everyday duties and a full calendar of traveling and further duties beyond that. If you've ever been in that kind of situation, you can't help but respect her. Given how long she's been doing it and how old she is. Comparing her to Paris Hilton-even saying the socialite works harder, shows an extreme lack of understanding on your part.

[Grave_n_idle]

Then please, enlighten me as to how my summary above is different from the truth.

I can't do justice to a several hundred page biography in this format, so I advise you to go read one for yourself, if you are interested - the same advice I gave to the other poster.

As it stands, you're arguing (vehemently) from ignorance.

[North Calaveras]

Nope, in fact I think it should be given some more power instead of basically being a figurehead.

[Cvtopia]

Nope, in fact I think it should be given some more power instead of basically being a figurehead.

What? Why? Giving someone power who hasn't been approved by the people??

[North Calaveras]

Nope, in fact I think it should be given some more power instead of basically being a figurehead.

What? Why? Giving someone power who hasn't been approved by the people??

Well, the Royal family seems to be held in high regard in the UK, so I think they are worthy of more power. Plus to be a king/queen and have no power is kind of embarassing.

[New Sapienta]

What? Why? Giving someone power who hasn't been approved by the people??

Well, the Royal family seems to be held in high regard in the UK, so I think they are worthy of more power. Plus to be a king/queen and have no power is kind of embarassing.

That is the status of monarchs in almost every country.

Except for dicatators, but I don't think you'd include them.

[Nadkor]

What? Why? Giving someone power who hasn't been approved by the people??

Well, the Royal family seems to be held in high regard in the UK, so I think they are worthy of more power. Plus to be a king/queen and have no power is kind of embarassing.

Giving the Queen some actual power would make it possible to have an opinion on her other than "ah, sure I guess if I was pushed I'd say she's fine", which is pretty much what most people say now, and would inevitably lead to erosion in the support for the monarchy as people begin to debate her decisions.

She's different from the politicians because she doesn't actually do anything worthy of debate. The reason we're by and large okay with the monarchy is precisely because the Queen has no hard power.

Giving the Queen power would lead to the downfall of the monarchy, I guarantee you.

[The UK in Exile]

I fail to see how turning up to a few paid dinners or speaches is "hard". The Queen was born to her fame, she didn't earn it, nor has she. Frankly, Paris Hilton has made more effort to maintain her status than the queen has. Please, provide evidence of the Queen making efforts to show her worth to society.




Then please, enlighten me as to how my summary above is different from the truth.

In her duties as queen? She travels. As the ceremonial head she goes around the country, and often beyond, performing the ceremonial duties she is required. Opening hospitals, visiting schools, and many other similar activities. She often receives the so called red box-documents from ministers and such that she must read and or sign to give her ascent, along with other everyday duties. To put the already simplified version shortly, imagine that she has everyday duties and a full calendar of traveling and further duties beyond that. If you've ever been in that kind of situation, you can't help but respect her. Given how long she's been doing it and how old she is. Comparing her to Paris Hilton-even saying the socialite works harder, shows an extreme lack of understanding on your part.

as impressive as having a job is, I'm pretty sure the Queen isn't the only person who has one.

[Priory Academy USSR]

In her duties as queen? She travels. As the ceremonial head she goes around the country, and often beyond, performing the ceremonial duties she is required. Opening hospitals, visiting schools, and many other similar activities. She often receives the so called red box-documents from ministers and such that she must read and or sign to give her ascent, along with other everyday duties. To put the already simplified version shortly, imagine that she has everyday duties and a full calendar of traveling and further duties beyond that. If you've ever been in that kind of situation, you can't help but respect her. Given how long she's been doing it and how old she is. Comparing her to Paris Hilton-even saying the socialite works harder, shows an extreme lack of understanding on your part.

as impressive as having a job is, I'm pretty sure the Queen isn't the only person who has one.

Ah, but the Queen is unique as she is born into what is quite simply slavery. She has no choice in the matter to become Queen, unless she abdicates, which caused enough problems the last time.

[The UK in Exile]

as impressive as having a job is, I'm pretty sure the Queen isn't the only person who has one.

Ah, but the Queen is unique as she is born into what is quite simply slavery. She has no choice in the matter to become Queen, unless she abdicates, which caused enough problems the last time.

I imagine quite a few african-americans would take issue with your definition of "Unique", "Slavery" and "choice". that said, if the Queen finds the whole affair so onerous I will happily take it off her hands.

[North Calaveras]

Ah, but the Queen is unique as she is born into what is quite simply slavery. She has no choice in the matter to become Queen, unless she abdicates, which caused enough problems the last time.

I imagine quite a few african-americans would take issue with your definition of "Unique", "Slavery" and "choice". that said, if the Queen finds the whole affair so onerous I will happily take it off her hands.

So would I

It's good to be King, even if I had no power.

[Immoren]

Naah.

[Machtergreifung]

I fail to see how turning up to a few paid dinners or speaches is "hard". The Queen was born to her fame, she didn't earn it, nor has she. Frankly, Paris Hilton has made more effort to maintain her status than the queen has. Please, provide evidence of the Queen making efforts to show her worth to society.




Then please, enlighten me as to how my summary above is different from the truth.

In her duties as queen? She travels. As the ceremonial head she goes around the country, and often beyond, performing the ceremonial duties she is required. Opening hospitals, visiting schools, and many other similar activities. She often receives the so called red box-documents from ministers and such that she must read and or sign to give her ascent, along with other everyday duties. To put the already simplified version shortly, imagine that she has everyday duties and a full calendar of traveling and further duties beyond that. If you've ever been in that kind of situation, you can't help but respect her. Given how long she's been doing it and how old she is. Comparing her to Paris Hilton-even saying the socialite works harder, shows an extreme lack of understanding on your part.

I still can't see how overly difficult her role is. Your average minister or government offical will probably do much and more than cut some ribbons and sign some documents. As an aside, I knew a local councilor who turned up for everything that was starting up, from after-school clubs to sports centers being opened. Where's his palace and right to international travel.

Then please, enlighten me as to how my summary above is different from the truth.

I can't do justice to a several hundred page biography in this format, so I advise you to go read one for yourself, if you are interested - the same advice I gave to the other poster.

As it stands, you're arguing (vehemently) from ignorance.

I've asked you to enlighten me as to how difficult the Queen's job is. Unless you're telling me that signing some papers, traveling abroad and attending some opening ceremonies is hard.

as impressive as having a job is, I'm pretty sure the Queen isn't the only person who has one.

Ah, but the Queen is unique as she is born into what is quite simply slavery. She has no choice in the matter to become Queen, unless she abdicates, which caused enough problems the last time.

Yes, the Queen can relate to all those oppressed and enslaved people in the world. Who wants to get up in the morning and leave their palace to go and open schools? If she was a private citizen, she wouldn't have the problem, would she?