Should the British monarchy be abolished?

[Pesda]

If you want to call it mass delusion, that's okay. I don't care.

I don't call it mass delusion, it is mass delusion.

It's not. People can belong to any nation they want.

[Machtergreifung]

Still doesn't mean a Nigerian shares any common cultural background with any other African...

Or, a better example, a tribe of folks in Nigeria exclusively call themselves by the name of said tribe- doesn't make them any less Nigerians.

That's assuming that the term Nigerians refers to something more than the geographical area in which they reside.

(By the way, it the case of Britain and the British, it doesn't)

[Nova Imperius]

And where does all of that generated money go? Taxes, not those rich bankers.

Right?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2007/ju ... .business1

It may surprise you, but some of it goes into Scotland, and it is also the reason why Scotland probably won't survive. So, thank you London, and thank you England, for continuing to fund Scotland.

Well........ Scotland pays 9.6% of the UK taxes but only gets 9.3% out again. So we are not a burden. As for Wales, it pays 4.2% of the taxes and gets 5.3% out

[Pesda]

I never said it does. However 2 million people not calling themselves British is proof of a Welsh nation.

No, it is proof that there are two million people who call themselves Welsh. There are several million people who claimed to be Jedis, they are not anymore Jedis than I am.

No, it's proof that the nation exists. Why is there need for a sovreign state to have a nation?

[New Sapienta]

I don't call it mass delusion, it is mass delusion.

It's not. People can belong to any nation they want.

So I'm really a Swede despite being born and living in America and have absolutely no ties to Sweden(to my knowledge, the Vikings did get prolific in ireland after all)?

EDIT: For anyone wondering I do not really consider myself a Swede nor do I really wish to.

[The Godly Nations]

It may surprise you, but some of it goes into Scotland, and it is also the reason why Scotland probably won't survive. So, thank you London, and thank you England, for continuing to fund Scotland.

Someone posted the figures before me in the thread, but Scotland gives more than it takes. So, you're welcome, UK, for that extra revenue we generate for you.

Excluding the North Sea, you Scots are at a deficit.
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2012/03/9525

[The UK in Exile]

Or, a better example, a tribe of folks in Nigeria exclusively call themselves by the name of said tribe- doesn't make them any less Nigerians.

That's assuming that the term Nigerians refers to something more than the geographical area in which they reside.

(By the way, it the case of Britain and the British, it doesn't)

I'll wager their are plenty of folk who don't consider themselves irish, scots, welsh and english who weren't born in any of those places who do consider themselves british.

[The Godly Nations]

No, it is proof that there are two million people who call themselves Welsh. There are several million people who claimed to be Jedis, they are not anymore Jedis than I am.

No, it's proof that the nation exists. Why is there need for a sovreign state to have a nation?

Maybe because we usually call a sovereign state a nation? You are Welsh, no one is denying that, but not to the exclusion of being British.

[Machtergreifung]

Someone posted the figures before me in the thread, but Scotland gives more than it takes. So, you're welcome, UK, for that extra revenue we generate for you.

Excluding the North Sea, you Scots are at a deficit.
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2012/03/9525

North Sea isn't going anywhere in a hurry.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-s ... s-15415218

[Pesda]

It's not. People can belong to any nation they want.

So I'm really a Swede despite being born and living in America and have absolutely no ties to Sweden(to my knowledge, the Vikings did get prolific in ireland after all)?

That's different, the Welsh people do have ties to Wales; but you could be a Swede, I suppose, but I don't know why you'd want to be.

[Machtergreifung]

That's assuming that the term Nigerians refers to something more than the geographical area in which they reside.

(By the way, it the case of Britain and the British, it doesn't)

I'll wager their are plenty of folk who don't consider themselves irish, scots, welsh and english who weren't born in any of those places who do consider themselves british.

I'll wager that the sky is green, and that there are Irish, Scots, Welsh and English that consider themselves Irish, Welsh, Scots and English.

[Kilgrammie]

Still doesn't mean a Nigerian shares any common cultural background with any other African...

Or, a better example, a tribe of folks in Nigeria exclusively call themselves by the name of said tribe- doesn't make them any less Nigerians.

Perhaps we should all just be European then, after all it also says European Union on our passports too, and the UK would be the lesser more inferior "Union"

[Nova Imperius]

Someone posted the figures before me in the thread, but Scotland gives more than it takes. So, you're welcome, UK, for that extra revenue we generate for you.

Excluding the North Sea, you Scots are at a deficit.
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2012/03/9525

Thats like saying "Excluding your key industry, you english are a deficit." Thing is WITH our main industry we are not

[The Godly Nations]

Or, a better example, a tribe of folks in Nigeria exclusively call themselves by the name of said tribe- doesn't make them any less Nigerians.

Perhaps we should all just be European then, after all it also says European Union on our passports too, and the UK would be the lesser more inferior "Union"

Ah! That reminds me- we are Europeans aren't we? Could it be that we are both European and Britons? Just like you are a Scotsman and a Briton?

[Kilgrammie]

That's different, the Welsh people do have ties to Wales; but you could be a Swede, I suppose, but I don't know why you'd want to be.

A turnip mibbies???

Ah! That reminds me- we are Europeans aren't we? Could it be that we are both European and Britons? Just like you are a Scotsman and a Briton?

Scottish by birth, European by Choice & i'll NEVER be British

Just in case you never noticed the Romans called the area now know as Scotland..... Caledonia.

This British pish is an invention to eradicate the Nations of England, Scotland, Wales & Ireland. such a shame it never quite worked out.

How dare we cling to our roots!

[The Godly Nations]

Excluding the North Sea, you Scots are at a deficit.
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2012/03/9525

Thats like saying "Excluding your key industry, you english are a deficit." Thing is WITH our main industry we are not

I'll admit as much- that Scotland does, in fact, produce more than it takes in.

[The UK in Exile]

No, it's proof that the nation exists. Why is there need for a sovreign state to have a nation?

Maybe because we usually call a sovereign state a nation? You are Welsh, no one is denying that, but not to the exclusion of being British.

we usually call it a nation-state (hey! thats the name of the site!), to avoid the confusion your so inexplicably mired in.

britain is geographical location.
the UK is a state. but not a nation-state.
the Scottish, Irish, Welsh and English are all Nations but not states. The Irish are A nation with both a Nation State(roi) and a separate State (uk).
british refers to people from the UK. who are citizens of a State but not members of a "british" nation.

an independent scotland would be both Nation and Nation-state.

[Ostroeuropa]

Maybe because we usually call a sovereign state a nation? You are Welsh, no one is denying that, but not to the exclusion of being British.

we usually call it a nation-state (hey! thats the name of the site!), to avoid the confusion your so inexplicably mired in.

britain is geographical location.
the UK is a state. but not a nation-state.
the Scottish, Irish, Welsh and English are all Nations but not not states. The Irish are A nation with both a Nation State(roi) and a separate State (uk).
british refers to people from the UK. who are citizens of a State but not members of a "british" nation.

an independent scotland would be both Nation and Nation-state.

"Four nations, one state" is typically the maxim.

[Pesda]

No, it's proof that the nation exists. Why is there need for a sovreign state to have a nation?

Maybe because we usually call a sovereign state a nation? You are Welsh, no one is denying that, but not to the exclusion of being British.

Do we?
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definitio ... n?q=nation

a large body of people united by common descent, history, culture, or language, inhabiting a particular state or territory

The Welsh people are united by common descent, history, culture, and just under 20% share the Welsh language. We inhabit a particular territory. Says nothing about a sovereign state.
Now I could argue that it excludes me from being British, because I could have little of the above in common with the rest of the British people, but I'm not going to cause I don't mind Britishness.

[Nova Imperius]

Just a thing for all these angry anti-monarchy scots. Would you be happy to see the Aristocracy die??? Yes i assume. Would you be happy to see all the scottish clan chiefs be abolished as they are technically part of the aristocracy?? No i assume

[Pesda]

That's different, the Welsh people do have ties to Wales; but you could be a Swede, I suppose, but I don't know why you'd want to be.

A turnip mibbies???

What?

[The Godly Nations]

Maybe because we usually call a sovereign state a nation? You are Welsh, no one is denying that, but not to the exclusion of being British.

Do we?
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definitio ... n?q=nation

a large body of people united by common descent, history, culture, or language, inhabiting a particular state or territory

The Welsh people are united by common descent, history, culture, and just under 20% share the Welsh language. We inhabit a particular territory. Says nothing about a sovereign state.
Now I could argue that it excludes me from being British, because I could have little of the above in common with the rest of the British people, but I'm not going to cause I don't mind Britishness.

Since you have been attached to us so long that we share the same history for quite a long while, and your ethnic heritage is kind of, I dunno, mixed with us, as well as most of youse speaking the same language as us here (example, the thing you just typed), does that make the Welsh and the English one nation? Why don't we just end this since we are mostly in agreement- you are Welsh, you are also a Briton.

[New Sapienta]

So I'm really a Swede despite being born and living in America and have absolutely no ties to Sweden(to my knowledge, the Vikings did get prolific in ireland after all)?

That's different, the Welsh people do have ties to Wales; but you could be a Swede, I suppose, but I don't know why you'd want to be.

But you said I can be anything.

Caan I be every nationality?

[Pesda]

Maybe because we usually call a sovereign state a nation? You are Welsh, no one is denying that, but not to the exclusion of being British.

we usually call it a nation-state (hey! thats the name of the site!), to avoid the confusion your so inexplicably mired in.

britain is geographical location.
the UK is a state. but not a nation-state.
the Scottish, Irish, Welsh and English are all Nations but not not states. The Irish are A nation with both a Nation State(roi) and a separate State (uk).
british refers to people from the UK. who are citizens of a State but not members of a "british" nation.

an independent scotland would be both Nation and Nation-state.

Thank you for your clarification.

[Ostroeuropa]

Do we?
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definitio ... n?q=nation


The Welsh people are united by common descent, history, culture, and just under 20% share the Welsh language. We inhabit a particular territory. Says nothing about a sovereign state.
Now I could argue that it excludes me from being British, because I could have little of the above in common with the rest of the British people, but I'm not going to cause I don't mind Britishness.

Since you have been attached to us so long that we share the same history for quite a long while, and your ethnic heritage is kind of, I dunno, mixed with us, as well as most of youse speaking the same language as us here (example, the thing you just typed), does that make the Welsh and the English one nation?

This can be extrapolated outward by the way, so I define nation as a group of people who decide they are a nation distinct from other ones.
It's the only definition people throw around occasionally that doesn't inevitably lead to the regression to a one-world-nation, or collapse into 7 billion different nations immediately.
It also robs nationhood of any sense of importance, which is a good thing in my view.