NRA - Put Armed Good Guys In All Schools

[Abatael]

No, politicizing the death of over twenty innocent children and adults is wrong.

I'm curious. How do you discuss a matter of public policy concerning gun violence without it being political?

Gun violence can easily be discussed without discussing politics.

For example:

Person A: Hey, did you hear about that shooting in the school?
Person B: Yeah.

See?

[Choronzon]

All of those things involved killing beyond recreational shooting, and I don't think training to be a more proficient killer counts as using your gun for purposes other than killing.

Still waiting.

War re-enactments and such, so education. (I'm having fun thinking of these )

Live, modern firearms are not necessary for war re-enactments.

[Genivaria]

I guess there's the advantage of being a Federation of states rather than a centralist goverment (at least i theory), so laws can be adapted to the state they are related to, since there are different situations and outlooks depending of wich part of the country you are, so just to get some perspective wich state are you guys from? have there been similar events in your state or region? and if so, how have they been handled?

I'm a born and raised Texan, the gun laws here are very lax, and our murder rate very high.

[Choronzon]

I'm curious. How do you discuss a matter of public policy concerning gun violence without it being political?

Gun violence can easily be discussed without discussing politics.

For example:

Person A: Hey, did you hear about that shooting in the school?
Person B: Yeah.

See?

Stop arguing for the status quo while pretending like you're not making a political argument.

[Big Jim P]

Hunting, recreational shooting, and (as pointed out earlier) self-defense.

All of those things involved killing beyond recreational shooting, and I don't think training to be a more proficient killer counts as using your gun for purposes other than killing.

Still waiting.

You think all killing is wrong. It is not.

[Ostroeuropa]

War re-enactments and such, so education. (I'm having fun thinking of these )

Live, modern firearms are not necessary for war re-enactments.

Scientific studies, and Durability tests.

[Liriena]

Guns don't kill people. People kill people with guns as a medium.
If you say that guns kill people then my brother can tell his teacher that his pencil made him misspell words or my friend can say that his car made him hit that lady or that spoons made Rosie O'Donnell fat or my nine fingered cousin can say that the butcher knife made him cut his finger off. Bottom line is that guns when handled by mentally sound, well trained people can't hurt any innocent person. If guns should be banned so should cars, beer, cigarettes, knives, and trains because they can all be used to kill people. In fact almost anything in the world can be used to kill somebody.

One thing: guns are specifically crafted to be weapons. That's the very reason why they exist. Guns don't take us from our home to our workplace. Guns don't write the answers to test. Guns are designed to injure and kill.

By their very definition, they can't be compared to beer, cars or cigarette.

This goes beyond "responsible ownership and use".

[Genivaria]

I'm curious. How do you discuss a matter of public policy concerning gun violence without it being political?

Gun violence can easily be discussed without discussing politics.

For example:

Person A: Hey, did you hear about that shooting in the school?
Person B: Yeah.

See?

.....your joking right?

[Occupied Deutschland]

Oh no, you'll have to use a 5 to 15 round magazine instead of a 30 round magazine. Whatever will you do (1)!....

Ooor you could buy a Mossberg Plinkster which is just as comfy as an AR-15 clone. Hell it even has a fun name, plinkster (2).

Or, even better, you could find a simple internal-magazine bolt-action or lever-action rifle and become a better shooter that way (3). I've never understood that, aside from the military fetish there's really no reason not to get a firearm where you have to work the action in order to reload and re-cock (4). It's simpler, less prone to breakage, plus it's more gratifying in the way, feeling the parts do their thing (5).

1) Probably take out the pins in the restricted magazines so I don't have to fuck with loading the damned things up so often.
2) As fun as the name is, I don't want a Plinkster, I want 2 dollars an AR-15.
3) Having to work a bolt just to reload doesn't magically make my range time pay off more.
4) Aside from the military fetish there's no reason to own a Hummer either (trick statement, there is, this denigrating someone's choice of [x] just apparently makes people feel better about themselves or something).
5) So? The old car I own is simpler and less prone to breakage as well (and all that character-building from knowing how all the parts do their thing and being able to fix them myself), but for everyday driving a modern vehicle is much more convenient.

And what non-lethal way does one defend oneself with a gun?
Unless we're counting pistol-whipping here.

Allow me to quote myself here, if you will.

"Hey asshole, whoever you are I have a gun and the police are on the way!"

That's how. Pretty easy. Anecdotal evidence tells me very effective.

Honing ones killing skills through marksmanship competitions do not count as "other purposes."

Try again.

This was, is, and always will be fertilizer-grade bullshit.

Edit: Quote tags

[The Andrewtopian Republic]

I don't see why we can't have a few armed police officers (which there was in my school), but I don't know if I want to see a bunch of students or even teachers with guns. The difference is that the officers have a great deal of training with gun safety, keeping their guns out of the hands of unauthorized people, etc while teachers probably don't. With students, the risks are obvious.

[Choronzon]

You think all killing is wrong. It is not.

Please show me where I have implied anything of the sort. Go ahead. Search all my posts throughout NSG.

In fact, in this very thread (I think on this very page) I said I did not think all killing was wrong.

Keep trying.

[Zutroy]

Alright. We'll start by rebuilding police forces that have been gutted by cuts, then we'll rebuild the mental health infrastructure that's been gutted by cuts? How's that?

Willing to pay for it? Or are you not that interested in ensuring the security of the average citizen?

Or we can just take responsibility for our own security.

So then it's the latter. Admit that you care less about public safety than you do about your social-darwinian fantasy of having the puny gun-averse culled from society.

[Choronzon]

This was, is, and always will be fertilizer-grade bullshit.

Edit: Quote tags

Just because you don't like an argument doesn't mean its wrong.

[Mavorpen]

I'm curious. How do you discuss a matter of public policy concerning gun violence without it being political?

Gun violence can easily be discussed without discussing politics.

For example:

Person A: Hey, did you hear about that shooting in the school?
Person B: Yeah.

See?

Try actually reading my posts.

I specifically stated discussing PUBLIC POLICY concerning gun violence.

[Bafuria]

Guys, why are we even talking about this shooting out in that place called Connecticut (wherever that is!)? Its not a big deal! Only 20 kids were gunned down while in school, and only a few of teachers! Why do we need to talk about guns? Why do we even care? You're all blowing it way out of proportion!

Punishing millions of people for something one person did by enacting a law will not increase public safety at all is completely unacceptable.
Even if the Assault weapons ban was implemented, there would still be millions of grandfathered high capacity magazines in ciruclation that aren't going anywhere.

Mr. Mass Shooter is just going to have to spend a little more cash on mags, (Or he might go: "Fuck it, I'm not paing 100 bucks on a thirty round magazine" I've changed my mind about shooting up my school!")

[Gauthier]

Guys, why are we even talking about this shooting out in that place called Connecticut (wherever that is!)? Its not a big deal! Only 20 kids were gunned down while in school, and only a few of teachers! Why do we need to talk about guns? Why do we even care? You're all blowing it way out of proportion!

Punishing millions of people for something one person did by enacting a law will not increase public safety at all is completely unacceptable.
Even if the Assault weapons ban was implemented, there would still be millions of grandfathered high capacity magazines in ciruclation that aren't going anywhere.

Mr. Mass Shooter is just going to have to spend a little more cash on mags, (Or he might go: "Fuck it, I'm not paing 100 bucks on a thirty round magazine" I've changed my mind about shooting up my school!")

Because someone will still be determined to shoot lots of people, we shouldn't regulate guns and magazines. With that logic, since someone will still be determiend to break laws we shouldn't have laws to begin with.

[Choronzon]

Guys, why are we even talking about this shooting out in that place called Connecticut (wherever that is!)? Its not a big deal! Only 20 kids were gunned down while in school, and only a few of teachers! Why do we need to talk about guns? Why do we even care? You're all blowing it way out of proportion!

Punishing millions of people for something one person did by enacting a law will not increase public safety at all is completely unacceptable.
Even if the Assault weapons ban was implemented, there would still be millions of grandfathered high capacity magazines in ciruclation that aren't going anywhere.

Mr. Mass Shooter is just going to have to spend a little more cash on mags, (Or he might go: "Fuck it, I'm not paing 100 bucks on a thirty round magazine" I've changed my mind about shooting up my school!")

More of this childish "reasonable gun control laws are punishing meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!" bullshit?

[Zutroy]

I'm curious. How do you discuss a matter of public policy concerning gun violence without it being political?

Gun violence can easily be discussed without discussing politics.

For example:

Person A: Hey, did you hear about that shooting in the school?
Person B: Yeah.

See?

What the hell kind of thread would that be?

[Occupied Deutschland]

This was, is, and always will be fertilizer-grade bullshit.

Edit: Quote tags

Just because you don't like an argument doesn't mean its wrong.

You're right.

The argument being bullshit is what makes it wrong.

[Lenciland]

Guns don't kill people. People kill people with guns as a medium.
If you say that guns kill people then my brother can tell his teacher that his pencil made him misspell words or my friend can say that his car made him hit that lady or that spoons made Rosie O'Donnell fat or my nine fingered cousin can say that the butcher knife made him cut his finger off. Bottom line is that guns when handled by mentally sound, well trained people can't hurt any innocent person. If guns should be banned so should cars, beer, cigarettes, knives, and trains because they can all be used to kill people. In fact almost anything in the world can be used to kill somebody.

One thing: guns are specifically crafted to be weapons. That's the very reason why they exist. Guns don't take us from our home to our workplace. Guns don't write the answers to test. Guns are designed to injure and kill.

By their very definition, they can't be compared to beer, cars or cigarette.

This goes beyond "responsible ownership and use".

Guns at least where I live are used for hunting, re-enactments, and self-defense everybody owns a gun and we have a very low murder rate and high self defense rates. We have the Castle Law and various self-defense laws. Cigarettes kill more people every year than guns in my state where almost everybody smokes.

[Abatael]

Gun violence can easily be discussed without discussing politics.

For example:

Person A: Hey, did you hear about that shooting in the school?
Person B: Yeah.

See?

Try actually reading my posts.

I specifically stated discussing PUBLIC POLICY concerning gun violence.

I skimmed through it. Generally you don't have anything important to say.

Anyways, you could just, you know, abide by the 2nd Amendment and let people own guns.

[Bafuria]

Punishing millions of people for something one person did by enacting a law will not increase public safety at all is completely unacceptable.
Even if the Assault weapons ban was implemented, there would still be millions of grandfathered high capacity magazines in ciruclation that aren't going anywhere.

Mr. Mass Shooter is just going to have to spend a little more cash on mags, (Or he might go: "Fuck it, I'm not paing 100 bucks on a thirty round magazine" I've changed my mind about shooting up my school!")

More of this childish "reasonable gun control laws are punishing meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!" bullshit?

I'm in favor of reasonable gun control laws.

An assault weapons ban isn't one of them.

[Genivaria]

Try actually reading my posts.

I specifically stated discussing PUBLIC POLICY concerning gun violence.

I skimmed through it. Generally you don't have anything important to say.

Anyways, you could just, you know, abide by the 2nd Amendment and let people own guns.

Insults, very mature.

[Mavorpen]

Anyways, you could just, you know, abide by the 2nd Amendment and let people own guns.

Not sure who's arguing people can't use guns.

Are you done with the straw men?

[Vazdania]

Punishing millions of people for something one person did by enacting a law will not increase public safety at all is completely unacceptable.
Even if the Assault weapons ban was implemented, there would still be millions of grandfathered high capacity magazines in ciruclation that aren't going anywhere.

Mr. Mass Shooter is just going to have to spend a little more cash on mags, (Or he might go: "Fuck it, I'm not paing 100 bucks on a thirty round magazine" I've changed my mind about shooting up my school!")

More of this childish "reasonable gun control laws are punishing meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!" bullshit?

The laws that the Obama administration are trying to push through are by NO means reasonable.