Germany To Ban Far-Right Political Party

[The Black Plains]

We do. Its just that a lot of communist or turning communist countries are single party or just have a Communist and Socialist party.

If we're banning Nazis, there's a strong argument towards banning Communist as well.

We anarcho-capitalists are safe because most of us are bourgeoisie. *Feels secure*

[Ifreann]

What would banning them as a political party actually do?

The party would no longer function as a legal person, would not be allowed to own property, participate in elections, and membership would be forbidden.

Would the NPD thereafter be considered a criminal organisation?

Pretty much.

Could one be imprisoned for membership in the NPD?

Afterwards? Quite possibly. There's laws prohibiting the joining of criminal organizations.

Well, while I don't like the idea of banning political parties generally, if they're legitimately acting like a criminal organisation then there's nothing else for it.

Or would they just no longer be an official, taxpayer supported party?

Taxpayer funding isn't dependant on official status. It depends on how well you did in the last election. Since the NPD is currently represented in two (?) state parliaments, they get funded.

I suppose that them getting banned would mean by-elections, then?

Could a banned NPD just run candidates as independent out of their own pockets?

In theory. In practice that might work on a communal level, but is pretty unlikely on a state level and unthinkable on the federal level. They could also join other parties. Of course, simply refounding the NPD under a different name would end up with that being banned even faster, as then they'd be guilty of refounding a forbidden party.

Makes sense.

[Of the Free Socialist Territories]

We do. Its just that a lot of communist or turning communist countries are single party or just have a Communist and Socialist party.

If we're banning Nazis, there's a strong argument towards banning Communist as well.

There isn't really a Communist party to ban, given that the DKP is more or less a gutted shell of a party, from what I can glean from the article.

German's major leftist party is Die Linke, and given that that's democratic-socialist, it doesn't really qualify for being banned, and nor should it.

To ban Communists (i.e. antidemocratic Marxist-Leninists) in Germany, you'd first have to find some to ban.

[Crata]

We do. Its just that a lot of communist or turning communist countries are single party or just have a Communist and Socialist party.

If we're banning Nazis, there's a strong argument towards banning Communist as well.

They have been banned. The Communist Party of Germany has been banned in 1956.

[Ceannairceach]

Despite my value of democracy and the right to assemble and advocate for a position, I have no intrinsic dislike of a ban on this specific party. I'd rather watch them self destruct, as is likely with the NDP, but banning I do not care about. Either way, it works for me.

[Ralkovia]

If we're banning Nazis, there's a strong argument towards banning Communist as well.

There isn't really a Communist party to ban, given that the DKP is more or less a gutted shell of a party, from what I can glean from the article.

German's major leftist party is Die Linke, and given that that's democratic-socialist, it doesn't really qualify for being banned, and nor should it.

To ban Communists (i.e. antidemocratic Marxist-Leninists) in Germany, you'd first have to find some to ban.

True for Germany, however I was merely showing Bojikami that rooting for the banning of a non-mainstream political party when you're advocating a non-mainstream political party isn't exactly the smartest move.

[Ublia]

Nazism in Germany is never going to achieve any real power.

That's also up for debate. Of course Germany is far from it and it appears unlikely, but to say "never" seems to be an assumption rather than a fact.

Point taken. However after suffering through two World Wars one thanks to this putrid ideology of Nazism would you want to go back. I think not. However I pray that it never does return for the sake of Germany and the human race as a whole.

[Wolfmanne]

It's bad idea. It will gather sympathy for them in the future. The reason for free speech is so that parties like these embarrass themselves.

[The Rich Port]

Screw 'em.

Anything "far-right" or "far-left" can never be a good thing.

At least anarchists are too busy doing drugs and listening to punk rock.

The only drugs right-wing militias do is crystal meth and they listen to the national anthem of their respective countries.

I would want to shoot something too if my life was that insufferable.

[Ceannairceach]

If we're banning Nazis, there's a strong argument towards banning Communist as well.

They have been banned. The Communist Party of Germany has been banned in 1956.

The German Communist Party still exists--holding a single regional seat--and the Social Democratic Party exists as well.

[Dimar]

Fair point. I didn't think Germany was doing too bad, though, at least in comparison to other countries.

Everyone in Europe isn't in a great spot right now.

In Norway the unemployment rate is at just over 3% and still dropping

[Nazis in Space]

Oh my God, I love NS. "Freedom is good, but not for those conservatives." :roll:

That's why we see so much support to ban the CDU.


Oh, wait, nope.

Though a case can be made that the CDU is using its considerably greater support - by a factor of 20+x - to grant itself immunity from similar legal repercussions, given its own illegal activities.

[The Anglo-Saxon Empire]

Lawmakers in Berlin have been given the green light to file a complaint with the country's highest court seeking to ban the far-right National Democratic Party (NPD) following a Friday vote by Germany's upper legislative chamber, the Bundesrat, on the issue.

The approval of the legal bid to ban the right-wing extremist party comes after governors of the 16 states had already agreed on supporting the measure earlier this month. They recommended that the Bundesrat, which represents Germany's 16 states, do the same.

"We are convinced that the NPD is unconstitutional," said Christine Lieberknecht, the governor of the eastern state of Thuringia and a member of Chancellor Angela Merkel's conservative Christian Democratic Union (CDU), who added that the far-right party was aggressively pursuing its goals.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/ger ... 72969.html

Opinions?

Mine? I don't think it's a terrible idea, but it does increase the risk of them organizing underground.

Bad idea.

I know what the NPD stands for, and as a Jew I think its grotesque, however no party in a democratic system should be banned. Nazi, Communist, Theocratic, etc. Not receive tax payer funding? Maybe. However, if its an outright ban that stops the NPD from pursuing political offices then even I must stand against it.

Thank you. I despise NSG in general for so many reasons beyond just politics, but this is disgusting. Just because someone believes in something you disagree with or believes in an inherently oppressive or violent ideology doesn't give you the right to ban it. Free speech exists for a reason, if you are so in favour of freedom, defeat them using your right to free speech, convince people that they are bad.

[Crata]

The German Communist Party still exists--holding a single regional seat--and the Social Democratic Party exists as well.

Point made. The original Communist Party of Germany has been banned in 1956. They have then reformed themselves and now exist under a different name.

[Ceannairceach]

Everyone in Europe isn't in a great spot right now.

In Norway the unemployment rate is at just over 3% and still dropping

What's the inflation rate?

[Crata]

Though a case can be made that the CDU is using its considerably greater support - by a factor of 20+x - to grant itself immunity from similar legal repercussions, given its own illegal activities.

Being illegal is not equal to unconstitutional.

[Divair]

In Norway the unemployment rate is at just over 3% and still dropping

What's the inflation rate?

1.15%

[Ceannairceach]

Bad idea.

I know what the NPD stands for, and as a Jew I think its grotesque, however no party in a democratic system should be banned. Nazi, Communist, Theocratic, etc. Not receive tax payer funding? Maybe. However, if its an outright ban that stops the NPD from pursuing political offices then even I must stand against it.

Thank you. I despise NSG in general for so many reasons beyond just politics, but this is disgusting. Just because someone believes in something you disagree with or believes in an inherently oppressive or violent ideology doesn't give you the right to ban it. Free speech exists for a reason, if you are so in favour of freedom, defeat them using your right to free speech, convince people that they are bad.

Normally I would agree, but they're, like, Nazis. If we can discriminate against anyone, anything, then Nazis would be it. They are perhaps the only political organization that the world can unilaterally view as evil and corrupt.

[Ralkovia]

Everyone in Europe isn't in a great spot right now.

In Norway the unemployment rate is at just over 3% and still dropping

http://www.newsinenglish.no/2010/05/05/ ... ially-low/

[Frisivisia]

Screw 'em.

Anything "far-right" or "far-left" can never be a good thing.

At least anarchists are too busy doing drugs and listening to punk rock.

The only drugs right-wing militias do is crystal meth and they listen to the national anthem of their respective countries.

I would want to shoot something too if my life was that insufferable.

Dat golden mean fallacy.

[Laerod]

Just because you consider major crimes and terrorism "free speech" doesn't mean they are.

Mind linking to these "major crimes" and "terrorism" that the party funded or organized?

Terrorism. Top 5 NPD criminals, a satirical show documenting 5 leading NPD politicians that have been convicted (in order of appearance) of heavy assault, inducing an explosion, threats to public safety and heavy assault, dangerous assault and a 7-year sentence for attacking NATO soldiers, and attempted assault resulting in death (legal terms loosely translated). All are in executive positions in the NPD. Statistically speaking, not a month goes by without NPD party or elected officials committing a crime: In the past ten years, 110 of them have committed roughly 120 crimes, the most common offense being assault at around 70.

[Illestia]

What would banning them as a political party actually do? Would the NPD thereafter be considered a criminal organisation? Could one be imprisoned for membership in the NPD? Or would they just no longer be an official, taxpayer supported party? Could a banned NPD just run candidates as independent out of their own pockets?

Realistically?

A new party is founded, or they merge into another right-wing party.

Whether another party would accept them is a different matter, though. The last time they tried to ban the NPD, the attempt failed because every single instance of unconstitutional activity provided to the courts turned out to have been the action of an undercover agent, or paid snitch working for the government.

In any case, given the hilarious state of the party's finances, and the tendency of its leadership to use said finances to fund themselves a new car or two, the difference between 'Banning' and 'Watching it self-destruct' is pretty minor. So minor that I'm tempted to suggest that the attempt to ban it is an attempt to gain political capital without it backfiring hilariously (As it did the last time) on account of the party being effectively dead in the first place, making it a pleasantly-easy target that can nonetheless convince the electorate that you're 'Doing something'.

This

[Laerod]

The party would no longer function as a legal person, would not be allowed to own property, participate in elections, and membership would be forbidden.

Pretty much.

Afterwards? Quite possibly. There's laws prohibiting the joining of criminal organizations.

Well, while I don't like the idea of banning political parties generally, if they're legitimately acting like a criminal organisation then there's nothing else for it.

Yeah, there's plenty high hurdles for getting it done nowadays. They have to actively (though not necessarily publicly) be campaigning for a "violent" overthrow of the political system.

Taxpayer funding isn't dependant on official status. It depends on how well you did in the last election. Since the NPD is currently represented in two (?) state parliaments, they get funded.

I suppose that them getting banned would mean by-elections, then?

I have no idea, to be honest. It could be that they keep their mandates, they're just independents.

[Chestaan]

Normally I don't support banning political parties no matter how much I disagree with their beliefs. However, the fact that this party is engaging in various crimes makes the ban legitimate. If they were just voicing ridiculous opinions I wouldn't support the ban.

[The Black Plains]

Screw 'em.

Anything "far-right" or "far-left" can never be a good thing.

At least anarchists are too busy doing drugs and listening to punk rock.

Excuse me?!