School Shooting in Connecticut - Multiple Fatalities

[The Zeonic States]

I believe it's em

That would be plural, as in "them."

._. My bad

[Forsher]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: When these shooters take their own life, it leaves the public without a sense of closure. There's no trial, no interrogation. We will never know why he did this, unless he (as such killers are prone to doing,) kept some sort of journal or left some sort of notes for "posterity," knowing he'd end up dead.

On this, I agree with you.

I'm pretty sure there would be an inquiry. I mean, when buildings fall down in earthquakes there are inquiries. When mines get blown up and kill miners there are inquiries. When suicides happen there is an inquest...

[Farnhamia]

On this, I agree with you.

I'm pretty sure there would be an inquiry. I mean, when buildings fall down in earthquakes there are inquiries. When mines get blown up and kill miners there are inquiries. When suicides happen there is an inquest...

Sure, but there's nothing like hearing it from the horse's mouth and in this case, the horse is dead.

[Norjagen]

We are very much in agreement, there. Nothing you can do against a sniper except run for hard cover. And, if you're going to be a lion, you need to be prepared to back that roar up with some bite, and do it without hesitation. In many cases, the shooter isn't expecting armed opposition, and the effect of suddenly having their own life in peril can, at times, be enough to shock them into surrender, or delay them long enough for a competent shooter to take the shot. I'm not denying that everything doesn't have to line up just right for your gun to do you any good. I'm presenting a simple question:
If everything DOES line up, and the stars align, and you have an opportunity to stop a tragedy like today's shooting, saving the lives of those who aren't able to save themselves, wouldn't you rather have the right tool for the job at your disposal?

It was yesterday.

I would contend without appropriate tools an opportunity cannot exist. However, it is better to leave a dangerous situation than attempt to do something about it if one isn't able to. Do not jump in to save a drowning person if one cannot swim. Same principle applies.

yes, but if you have a life ring or a float, the right tools, you could save a life; perhaps a number of lives. There are people who simply cannot walk away from that sort of situation. People who have to do something. These are the personality types who become firefighters; willing to risk or sacrifice their own lives, in defense of another. I couldn't live knowing that innocent people were killed, while I snuck away to save my own skin. It'd eat me up for the rest of my life, and I'm not the only one who feels that way.

that said, not everyone carries concealed, and there's a reason for that. Not everyone wants that sort of responsibility. Not everyone can HANDLE that responsibility. And that's okay. It's their choice.

[The Joseon Dynasty]

Most don't care about the killer.

I do. He was little more than a kid himself. When a 20 year old goes nuts like that, I wonder who failed him. He was as much a victim; we just don't know what he was a victim of yet.

That's probably why many of these people commit such crimes, though. People care about the perpetrator. Even if he was isolated and neglected in life, he becomes someone in death; someone that others want to understand and empathise with, and to others someone that evokes terror and awe.

To a disturbed mind, this is a worthy objective.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't seek to understand these people, but our characterisation and sheer coverage of them borders on celebrity status.

[The Zeonic States]

I do. He was little more than a kid himself. When a 20 year old goes nuts like that, I wonder who failed him. He was as much a victim; we just don't know what he was a victim of yet.

That's probably why many of these people commit such crimes, though. People care about the perpetrator. Even if he was isolated and neglected in life, he becomes someone in death; someone that others want to understand and empathise with, and to others someone that evokes terror and awe.

To a disturbed mind, this is a worthy objective.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't seek to understand these people, but our characterisation and sheer coverage of them borders on celebrity status.

Timothy McVeigh is practically a National Hero to some folks.

I admit he did a bang up fireworks show; Probably one of the most successful domestic terrorists in North American History no doubt but he isn't a hero.

He is a mass murdering dog who should have been killed a long time before he was.

[Norjagen]

That's probably why many of these people commit such crimes, though. People care about the perpetrator. Even if he was isolated and neglected in life, he becomes someone in death; someone that others want to understand and empathise with, and to others someone that evokes terror and awe.

To a disturbed mind, this is a worthy objective.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't seek to understand these people, but our characterisation and sheer coverage of them borders on celebrity status.

Timothy McVeigh is practically a National Hero to some folks.

I admit he did a bang up fireworks show; Probably one of the most successful domestic terrorists in North American History no doubt but he isn't a hero.

He is a mass murdering dog who should have been killed a long time before he was.

Timothy McVeigh thought he was going to avenge the massacre at Waco and become a hero, and in the eyes of some radicals, he is. Doesn't change the fact that he targeted a building full of innocent people. He also added the stigma of association to militia groups all across the nation, and hurt the cause he claimed to be fighting for. Hell, I identify as a libertarian, and hang out with some of those militia types when I'm shooting at the local range, and even they agree he was a monster. Killed innocent people, and made the whole country think that a whole sect of innocent citizens were terrorist nutjobs.

[The Black Forrest]

Most don't care about the killer.

I do. He was little more than a kid himself. When a 20 year old goes nuts like that, I wonder who failed him. He was as much a victim; we just don't know what he was a victim of yet.

I don't know. I can't feel pity for somebody who shoots up a room of 1st graders.

I don't know who failed him. If the mom did I could see him lashing out at her. But a room full of kids? Even in prison they have to separate the child predators from the others as they tend to go after them.

It may be very well this kid was nothing more then a "bad seed."

[Augarundus]

Schools should mandate that every teacher and student carry a shotgun at all times.

Think that'll solve the problem.

[Camicon]

Most don't care about the killer.

I do. He was little more than a kid himself. When a 20 year old goes nuts like that, I wonder who failed him. He was as much a victim; we just don't know what he was a victim of yet.

He was a victim, yes, but at the end of the day each and every one of us are accountable for the things we do. As confused and messed up as this kid may have been, he still killed twenty-seven people. There are millions of people no doubt in a similar situation, perhaps in a worse situation, that haven't committed the atrocities that Adam Lanza did.

[The Joseon Dynasty]

Schools should mandate that every teacher and student carry a shotgun at all times.

Think that'll solve the problem.

Yer darn tootin'!

[Gauntleted Fist]

So, according to CBS reports on what the medical examiner said, all of the people killed were killed with a rifle.

On Saturday, Carver, the medical examiner, said that all the victims at the school were shot with a rifle, at least some of them up close, and that all were apparently shot more than once.

I thought they were all killed with the pistols. No idea why.

[Bafuria]

Schools should mandate that every teacher and student carry a shotgun at all times.

Think that'll solve the problem.

Ugh.

I would consider a guard at every school with an FAL, wearing Interceptor body armor, by that's still pushing it.

[Norjagen]

So, according to CBS reports on what the medical examiner said, all of the people killed were killed with a rifle.

On Saturday, Carver, the medical examiner, said that all the victims at the school were shot with a rifle, at least some of them up close, and that all were apparently shot more than once.

I thought they were all killed with the pistols. No idea why.

Paper said he was armed with two pistols and a ".223 rifle." The pistols were a Glock and Sig Sauer, and the rifle was most likely an AR-platform semi auto. that's only a guess, but it's the most prolific .223 out there.

[Bug Out]

So, according to CBS reports on what the medical examiner said, all of the people killed were killed with a rifle.

On Saturday, Carver, the medical examiner, said that all the victims at the school were shot with a rifle, at least some of them up close, and that all were apparently shot more than once.

I thought they were all killed with the pistols. No idea why.

That was the report. The rifle was supposedly found in his car.

[Norjagen]

So, according to CBS reports on what the medical examiner said, all of the people killed were killed with a rifle.



I thought they were all killed with the pistols. No idea why.

That was the report. The rifle was supposedly found in his car.

That's what i heard. I assumed it wasn't involved, or it would have been on his person.

[The Zeonic States]

Timothy McVeigh is practically a National Hero to some folks.

I admit he did a bang up fireworks show; Probably one of the most successful domestic terrorists in North American History no doubt but he isn't a hero.

He is a mass murdering dog who should have been killed a long time before he was.

Timothy McVeigh thought he was going to avenge the massacre at Waco and become a hero, and in the eyes of some radicals, he is. Doesn't change the fact that he targeted a building full of innocent people. He also added the stigma of association to militia groups all across the nation, and hurt the cause he claimed to be fighting for. Hell, I identify as a libertarian, and hang out with some of those militia types when I'm shooting at the local range, and even they agree he was a monster. Killed innocent people, and made the whole country think that a whole sect of innocent citizens were terrorist nutjobs.

I do work for a Milita upon occasion; I hang up with those men, drink with them, Shoot with them, occasionally live with them.

And not one of us regardless of our religion, political affilation or stigma or lack there of to the United States or it's government makes us support that man. And it basically ruined like you said the image of the Milita, it added so much red tape to what we can barely maintain the arnseal that will be used to defend the people of this community in the event of serve issues.

We can barely maintain the personal needed and when it comes to funding? Most of this is privately funded now, I recall older milita used to get State or federal grants; You think that happens now? Fuck no.

Heck when i a resident of luisville Kentucky i was in a Milita for almost four Years; I helped found one in Chicago after i left the Army. I like the idea of serving as the People's protector and thats why a good deal of these folks stick around despite the hardships but well that issue put the Milita's on a downward sprial which has killed more of them then i care to think about.

[Gauntleted Fist]

Paper said he was armed with two pistols and a ".223 rifle." The pistols were a Glock and Sig Sauer, and the rifle was most likely an AR-platform semi auto. that's only a guess, but it's the most prolific .223 out there.

No, I'm not in question of what he was armed with. What I didn't understand was my bizarre belief that he had killed everyone with the pistols (For which I can find no real source.) when it is now being reported that everyone was killed with a rifle.

That was the report. The rifle was supposedly found in his car.

But how would everyone be killed with a rifle if it was in his car?

[Bug Out]

That was the report. The rifle was supposedly found in his car.

That's what i heard. I assumed it wasn't involved, or it would have been on his person.

I have a hard time believing they were shot with a rifle as the rounds would have gone through the walls and bound to have injured others. A .223 moving at 3300 ft/sec wouldn't stop in a child or adult at close range.

[Gauntleted Fist]

I have a hard time believing they were shot with a rifle as the rounds would have gone through the walls and bound to have injured others. A .223 moving at 3300 ft/sec wouldn't stop in a child or adult at close range.

Most of the children killed were apparently huddled up together near to the ground. So he would have been shooting down at them. Essentially into the ground. (Except for the adults.)

Confusing.

[Farnhamia]

Paper said he was armed with two pistols and a ".223 rifle." The pistols were a Glock and Sig Sauer, and the rifle was most likely an AR-platform semi auto. that's only a guess, but it's the most prolific .223 out there.

No, I'm not in question of what he was armed with. What I didn't understand was my bizarre belief that he had killed everyone with the pistols (For which I can find no real source.) when it is now being reported that everyone was killed with a rifle.

That was the report. The rifle was supposedly found in his car.

But how would everyone be killed with a rifle if it was in his car?

He had two?

[Gauntleted Fist]

He had two?

He did?

Argh, fact checking. God damn it.

[Farnhamia]

That's what i heard. I assumed it wasn't involved, or it would have been on his person.

I have a hard time believing they were shot with a rifle as the rounds would have gone through the walls and bound to have injured others. A .223 moving at 3300 ft/sec wouldn't stop in a child or adult at close range.

The NY Times says:

The gunman in the Connecticut shooting blasted his way into the elementary school and then sprayed the children with bullets, first from a distance and then at close range, hitting some of them as many as 11 times, as he fired a semiautomatic rifle loaded with ammunition designed for maximum damage, officials said Saturday.

The state’s chief medical examiner, H. Wayne Carver II, said all of the 20 children and 6 adults gunned down at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., had been struck more than once in the fusillade.

He said their wounds were “all over, all over.”

“This is a very devastating set of injuries,” he said at a briefing in Newtown. When he was asked if they had suffered after they were hit, he said, “Not for very long.”

And really, does it matter where the rounds stopped? Since people in other rooms were not injured, we can assume the angle or having to pass through multiple human bodies, however small, stopped them, wouldn't you say?

[Farnhamia]

He had two?

He did?

Argh, fact checking. God damn it.

I'm guessing but that would explain it.

[Bug Out]

I have a hard time believing they were shot with a rifle as the rounds would have gone through the walls and bound to have injured others. A .223 moving at 3300 ft/sec wouldn't stop in a child or adult at close range.

Most of the children killed were apparently huddled up together near to the ground. So he would have been shooting down at them. Essentially into the ground. (Except for the adults.)

Confusing.

I understand they made a lot of errors trying to report on this first, but missing about where the rifle was found and what rounds were spent is really unbelievable as anyone should be able to tell the difference between a rifle casing and a pistol casing, and you know these had to be all over the area.