Why was Hitler not responsible for the economy being fixed?

[The Corparation]

That's not the topic of the thread, is it?

You can't use that excuse if you ALSO went off topic.

Again a Mod has asked us all to end this thread-jack.

[Ostroeuropa]

Well he did help the Economy, but it was through the very fascist coercive force that made him infamous (such as stealing money from Jewish businesses), so it's not like if Hitler had been dissuaded from pogroms and fascism that he would have independently solved the German economy

This is a staggeringly important point.
All the """Successes""" of german policy at the time are bound up with their biggest failures, and those successes are short term at best.

"Invading poland was great, because it provided more grain for germany."
^
That's the kind of economic policy we're talking here.

[Chinamerica]

There was somebody on these forums who had a lot of info in their sig explaining why Hitler didn't 'fix' the German economy and how the statement 'he was a good leader apart from the Holocaust thing' is untrue.

Can someone help me find this person? I'm in an argument with a Nazi at the moment.

That'd be me.

Ah, thank you. I'll make sure to bookmark this for future use against Nazis!

[The Remote Islands]

There was somebody on these forums who had a lot of info in their sig explaining why Hitler didn't 'fix' the German economy and how the statement 'he was a good leader apart from the Holocaust thing' is untrue.

Can someone help me find this person? I'm in an argument with a Nazi at the moment.

Hitler had an economy like the Vikings did. Based heavily on war time looting of conqured gold reserves. His economy was huge on spending and kept taxes low for his "Aryans" leading to a massive debt that was made up by forced labor and looting.

Nazism has horrible economics compared to fascism. Fascism is somewhat capitalist. Nazism doesn't work.

Nazism is all about spending loads of money to kill all the Jews, isn't it? So according to Keynesian economics (i might be wrong, feel free to yell at me), it would work like a charm until all the Jews are dead. Then they'd just move on to the commies, the gays, the jazz musicians...until there's nobody left but themselves. And who knows what might happen then...

[Pictor]

i dont think he was a good strategist nor a good leader. he was a rather okay one. many people think that sure he was a racist fu.ck but he was a good leader but they"re wrong! he managed to kill lots of people but killing people is easy.(to make sure they stay alive is hard)
he made a really bad dicision against what his advisers told him and attacked Russia in cold season. a good leader and strategist wouldn't do that.
he failed to acquire the knowledge of atomic bomb and basically failed to finish what he started(not that i wanted him to by the way)
and if you see that he got where he got it was because of his good military officers and leaders.
although i think he was a good politician because he did manage to take over the German government and established himself as a Führer and united the Germans with racism,hatred toward jews and great propaganda.

ps. ok that didnt have anything to with economy but you know read it anyway! lol

[Laerod]

Hitler had an economy like the Vikings did. Based heavily on war time looting of conqured gold reserves. His economy was huge on spending and kept taxes low for his "Aryans" leading to a massive debt that was made up by forced labor and looting.

Nazism has horrible economics compared to fascism. Fascism is somewhat capitalist. Nazism doesn't work.

Nazism is all about spending loads of money to kill all the Jews, isn't it? So according to Keynesian economics (i might be wrong, feel free to yell at me), it would work like a charm until all the Jews are dead. Then they'd just move on to the commies, the gays, the jazz musicians...until there's nobody left but themselves. And who knows what might happen then...

No, Nazism isn't really about spending money or saving money at all. It's not really an economic ideology.

[Ralkovia]

Well he did help the Economy, but it was through the very fascist coercive force that made him infamous (such as stealing money from Jewish businesses), so it's not like if Hitler had been dissuaded from pogroms and fascism that he would have independently solved the German economy

This is a staggeringly important point.
All the """Successes""" of german policy at the time are bound up with their biggest failures, and those successes are short term at best.

"Invading poland was great, because it provided more grain for germany."
^
That's the kind of economic policy we're talking here.

Indeed. I mean, the biggest battle he lost was because he wanted "oil."
Rather than repulsing the brits from the middle east, which might have worked, he chose to invade deep into russia.

A genius, hitler was not.

[Totalise]

Hitler was a bad leader because my jewish history teacher said so.

Seriously though he implemented the Holocaust which killed 11,000,000 people, founded the very racist ideology of National Socialism, was a dictator, and he started WW2 by invading Poland.

you have to remember that the western allies good friend was the exact mirror image of hitler except on the opposite end of the spectrum of politics. our good friend stalin killed over 30 million of his own people.
hitler was an ok civic and military leader. he had brilliant minds all around him, he brought an end to the depression in germany, finished rearming the german military, renounced the rape of german that was the Versailles treaty. allied leader during the 30's looked up to him, and Mussolini for their polices.

[Laerod]

i dont think he was a good strategist nor a good leader. he was a rather okay one. many people think that sure he was a racist fu.ck but he was a good leader but they"re wrong! he managed to kill lots of people but killing people is easy.(to make sure they stay alive is hard)
he made a really bad dicision against what his advisers told him and attacked Russia in cold season. a good leader and strategist wouldn't do that.

The Germans were in Russia for quite a bit more than just a season. Try about 4 years.

he failed to acquire the knowledge of atomic bomb and basically failed to finish what he started(not that i wanted him to by the way)

There was never really a German equivalent to the Manhattan Project.

and if you see that he got where he got it was because of his good military officers and leaders.

Not entirely. The Fall of France was primarily on his initiative and went against what his military advisers told him to do, which is why he was so confident in his own abilities afterwards.

although i think he was a good politician because he did manage to take over the German government and established himself as a Führer and united the Germans with racism,hatred toward jews and great propaganda.

Germany was far less united than you seem to realize.

[Vredlandia]

although i think he was a good politician because he did manage to take over the German government and established himself as a Führer and united the Germans with racism,hatred toward jews and great propaganda.

Taking over the government wasn't that hard. The catholic church supported him because he was openly anti-communist and the industry supported him because war was unavoidably with Hitler and war means money. Further only few people actually wanted democracy back in that time and Hitler promised to abolish democracy.

he made a really bad dicision against what his advisers told him and attacked Russia in cold season. a good leader and strategist wouldn't do that. he failed to acquire the knowledge of atomic bomb and basically failed to finish what he started(not that i wanted him to by the way)
and if you see that he got where he got it was because of his good military officers and leaders.

He almost got the atomic bomb. According to a documentary I saw a few weeks ago it were finnish resistance groups who sank a ship with the last needed uranium cargo.

[The Remote Islands]

Nazism is all about spending loads of money to kill all the Jews, isn't it? So according to Keynesian economics (i might be wrong, feel free to yell at me), it would work like a charm until all the Jews are dead. Then they'd just move on to the commies, the gays, the jazz musicians...until there's nobody left but themselves. And who knows what might happen then...

No, Nazism isn't really about spending money or saving money at all. It's not really an economic ideology.

I was referring more to the economic policies that might spring from a Nazi regime. I guess there isn't much for economic brains there after all.

[Vestr-Norig]

Hitler did indeed manage to get Germany out of the economic crisis. He did save Germany from economical crisis, but, he led it into an even greater and more devestated crisis, and he refused to give in even though he know the war was lost, thus, he was not a good leader. A good leader cares for the people he's leading, all of them.

[Laerod]

Hitler was a bad leader because my jewish history teacher said so.

Seriously though he implemented the Holocaust which killed 11,000,000 people, founded the very racist ideology of National Socialism, was a dictator, and he started WW2 by invading Poland.

hitler was an ok civic and military leader. he had brilliant minds all around him, he brought an end to the depression in germany,

WRONG.

finished rearming the german military,

Finished disarming Germany too. As well as dismantling her industry.

renounced the rape of german that was the Versailles treaty.

And got it replaced with actual occupation and curtailing of German sovereignity until about 1991.

allied leader during the 30's looked up to him, and Mussolini for their polices.

Name them.

[Laerod]

No, Nazism isn't really about spending money or saving money at all. It's not really an economic ideology.

I was referring more to the economic policies that might spring from a Nazi regime. I guess there isn't much for economic brains there after all.

Arguably they had some good ideas, but those that did (Hjalmar Schacht) jumped ship when the ideas were exploited beyond what was reasonable.

Hitler did indeed manage to get Germany out of the economic crisis. He did save Germany from economical crisis, ...

Wrong.

[Paixao]

Why has everybody missed out on the fact that he LEFT THE ECONOMY TO OTHER PEOPLE! EDIT: Apart from Laerod, well done Laerod

Hitler was a lazy fuck, lets be honest here. He did not like meetings, making laws, or doing paperwork.

Between 1934 and 36, Hjalmar Schact did all the economic stuff, then got sacked when he wouldn't go as crazy as Hitler wanted

Between 36 and 42 Goering re-militarized, took women and jews out the statistic (CHEATING!), forced people to work (can't do that in a democracy), and invaded places. It was unsustainable and inefficient.

Between 42 and the end, Speer made a few reforms and did the best with the broken post-Barbarossa Germany. He failed.

All in all Hitler did NOTHING for the economy beyond go "ME WANT TEH BIG GUNS FOR INVADE SLAVIC COUNTRYZ!", yet took the credit for reviving it in the public mind.

Its bonkers!

[The Remote Islands]

Why has everybody missed out on the fact that he LEFT THE ECONOMY TO OTHER PEOPLE! EDIT: Apart from Laerod, well done Laerod

Hitler was a lazy fuck, lets be honest here. He did not like meetings, making laws, or doing paperwork.

Between 1934 and 36, Hjalmar Schact did all the economic stuff, then got sacked when he wouldn't go as crazy as Hitler wanted

Between 36 and 42 Goering re-militarized, took women and jews out the statistic (CHEATING!), forced people to work (can't do that in a democracy), and invaded places. It was unsustainable and inefficient.

Between 42 and the end, Speer made a few reforms and did the best with the broken post-Barbarossa Germany. He failed.

All in all Hitler did NOTHING for the economy beyond go "ME WANT TEH BIG GUNS FOR INVADE SLAVIC COUNTRYZ!", yet took the credit for reviving it in the public mind.

Its bonkers!

I seem to recall that until WWII, Hitler liked to sleep in. One has to wonder just how lucky he was to become TEH FUHRER.

[Paixao]

There was never really a German equivalent to the Manhattan Project.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what about the Norweigian Heavy Water (Deuterium) Plants that the Brits took out? I was of the opinion that they were a key factor in the German atom bomb program that, had they remained, could have given Germany the edge...?

[The Remote Islands]

Relevant: http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/World_War_II_%28video_game%29 I don't care about anything you lot have to say, this is relevant damn it.

[Ostroeuropa]

There was never really a German equivalent to the Manhattan Project.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what about the Norweigian Heavy Water (Deuterium) Plants that the Brits took out? I was of the opinion that they were a key factor in the German atom bomb program that, had they remained, could have given Germany the edge...?

If by edge you mean, suddenly the world exploded, sure.
Remember, even WE didn't know about radiation before we used the bombs, and we only dropped two.
Just how many would Hitler have dropped before the enviroment collapsed

[The Corparation]

he made a really bad dicision against what his advisers told him and attacked Russia in cold season. a good leader and strategist wouldn't do that. he failed to acquire the knowledge of atomic bomb and basically failed to finish what he started(not that i wanted him to by the way)
and if you see that he got where he got it was because of his good military officers and leaders.

He almost got the atomic bomb. According to a documentary I saw a few weeks ago it were finnish resistance groups who sank a ship with the last needed uranium cargo.

He never even got that close to the bomb. Once the Allies caught on commando raids pretty much wiped out major aspects of the program. The loss of the heavy water plant in Norway especially was a huge blow. Another thing to note as well is that many of Germany's key physicists had fled the country making Germany significantly at a loss with regards to the brains needed for the bomb.

[The Darwinian People]

I understand what communism is.
And I know that the USSR went by: Leninism, Stalinism, and Trotskyism.
True communism is Marxism but won't work.
An ingenious idea that just isn't possible.

1. Then why are you arguing? Hitler and Stalin were both National Socialists so comparisons are unimportant.
2. The USSR didn't go by Trotskyism at all.
3. No, Marxism is a theory of how Communism can/will be achieved; their are non-Marxist forms of communism.
4. Irrelevant; if you believe it's a good idea then you should make it work.

[Las Vansterdam]

I'm more then a little curious about the kill scores hitler and Satlin have. Since no one can seem to agree how do you know for certain what it is?

[Laerod]

There was never really a German equivalent to the Manhattan Project.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what about the Norweigian Heavy Water (Deuterium) Plants that the Brits took out? I was of the opinion that they were a key factor in the German atom bomb program that, had they remained, could have given Germany the edge...?

No. The German nuclear program was ... dead in the heavy water, so to speak.

[Paixao]

I seem to recall that until WWII, Hitler liked to sleep in. One has to wonder just how lucky he was to become TEH FUHRER.

Not just until WWII. His own secretary is recorded to have said, when he was staying at the Berghoff (holiday home - not that a leader like him should really ever be on holiday...) "He would wake up at 10am, but would not leave his room until 2pm, whereapon he would have lunch. In the afternoon he liked to take long walks, that would often take up to 4 hours. Finally, in the evening, he would watch his favorite films"

He was incredibly lazy, but a fantastic speaker and an even better poster boy for the whole thing. Taking power wasn't all luck... he had some considerable political skill, but keeping it involved a LOT of luck.

[The Darwinian People]

I'm more then a little curious about the kill scores hitler and Satlin have. Since no one can seem to agree how do you know for certain what it is?

Honestly; once you started getting into the millions, does it even matter? Both regimes were seriously, morally, screwed up.