The war on Christmas

[Menassa]

I've been using the Hebrew Solar/Lunar calendar for god knows how long.

Which is fine if the other person knows the Hebrew solar/lunar calendar. Most people, however do not. The BCE/CE calendar is the most widely known.

Yes.... when I'm talking about the full solar calender I use the BCE/CE system.

[Farnhamia]

Jesus was actually born in between 2 and 7 BCE. But anyway, no, the basis of our calendar is the only part of "modern history" that revolves around the approximate birth of Jesus. The calendar has been secularized via the use of BCE/CE.

Out of curiosity, what delineates the Common Era vs. the before period?

An arbitrary line in the hourglass sand based on a calculating mistake by Dionysius Exiguus. And even after he invented the "Anno Domini" dating scheme, it was another 100, 150 years before it took hold. Any dating method is arbitrary, really. The Western version, dating from the ostensible birth of Jesus of Nazareth, is just the most common one. Taking religion out of it gives you the CE/BCE method.

[Divair]

Not only is Christianity right,

[Citation needed]

it is one of the major pillars of successful, modern, Western society we have today.

[Citation needed]

Not only did it civilise us, it helped propel us into an age of enlightenment previously never experienced in the "250,000" years humans have apparently been around.

[Citation needed]

Now because we have it much easier than our ancestors ever did

Because of technology, not Christianity.

- we should abandon/deny/ridicule our Christian heritage? No thanks.

Christians abandoned pagan heritage. And, in turn, Christian heritage is now being abandoned in favour of atheism.




You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

[New Rogernomics]

*yawn*

Opinion is in avy.

[Dyakovo]

So because Christianity expanded through violence, and it is now convenient for us to use a calendar based on the Christian one, Christianity is somehow right?

Not only is Christianity right, it is one of the major pillars of successful, modern, Western society we have today. Not only did it civilise us, it helped propel us into an age of enlightenment previously never experienced in the "250,000" years humans have apparently been around.

Now because we have it much easier than our ancestors ever did - we should abandon/deny/ridicule our Christian heritage? No thanks.

While Christianity was a major factor in a lot of advancements in European society, it also held back advancement for almost a thousand years, so its contributions are pretty much a wash.

[Manahakatouki]

So because Christianity expanded through violence, and it is now convenient for us to use a calendar based on the Christian one, Christianity is somehow right?

Not only is Christianity right, it is one of the major pillars of successful, modern, Western society we have today. Not only did it civilise us, it helped propel us into an age of enlightenment previously never experienced in the "250,000" years humans have apparently been around.

Now because we have it much easier than our ancestors ever did - we should abandon/deny/ridicule our Christian heritage? No thanks.

Thank the Christians for the Dark Ages...

Thank them for getting out of it as well of course...

But thank them for their break in the black ditch of humanity...

[Cameroi]

O'Riley trolling again. no news.

[Srboslavija]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

[Genivaria]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

This is called projecting. If you had any evidence to present then you would've shown it by now.
The only conclusion we can draw is that you are very dishonest.

[Immoren]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

Pot. Meet kettle.

[Manahakatouki]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

Doesn't foolproof usually come to the conclusion that your opinion is right...?

I don't know...

[Dyakovo]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

You have no fool-proof argument. All you have is a fool's argument. Our conclusions haven't been reached arbitrarily, they have been reached by studying the actual facts.

[German American States]

Something really sad is my one of my Muslim friend's favorite movies is Elf. We should keep the Christmas crap up, but try to agknowledge some of the other people. And stop the commercializing of Christmas already!

[Tekania]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

I don't think he's impossible to deal with. Sure he has opinions which differ.... but at least his opinions are formed from a factual understanding of the landscape and not the mindless parrotings of liars standing on pulpits. You seem woefully ignorant of Christian history, and frankly, for you to be so ignorant while espousing to be Christian is horrid (it's also, sadly, way too common).

[Cameroi]

midwinter's eve was stolen by christianity, along about the time julius and augustus were added to the calendar, which in turn, near the middle of the 20th century was then stolen from them, by bizdroidism. so what is this war of which he speaks. is it shoppers at off the wall mart beating each other over the head in the check out lines?

[Neutraligon]

midwinter's eve was stolen by christianity, along about the time julius and augustus were added to the calendar, which in turn, near the middle of the 20th century was then stolen from them, by bizdroidism. so what is this war of which he speaks. is it shoppers at off the wall mart beating each other over the head in the check out lines?

Unfortunately, I would be surprised if that didn't happen.

[Tekania]

They don't have to put an X on anything.... the X is part of a widely used Christian shorting of Christ (XP) which has been around for more than 1,000 years. It comes from "X" as in the Greek letter 'chi'. It's just part of common vernacular now. An early example can be found in labarum for example as used by Constantine I. And on that note:



Of course, in addition to your error on that point, you're also apperently ignorant that plenty of us Christians also think that humans have been on Earth for millions of years. Not all of us are young-earthers, sorry to burst your bubble there.

Look at my flag for an example of a Chi-Rho one of the oldest Christian symbols for am example of what this guys saying.

Yes, very good example. So horrible now-a-days, people using new fangled 1000+ year old plus ideas in abbreviating terms.

[Transhuman Proteus]

You also seem to have ignored most of my post. Shame, really.

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

Ah, the old weasel tactic of "it wouldn't matter if I showed you all the proof in the world, it wouldn't change your mind, so I wont. But I totally have proof I could show you. But I wont because it wouldn't do any good. But I totally have proof. Really."

No, you don't. You wont spend the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a fool proof argument because you have neither, but don't want to admit it. But it's ok, you don't need to - we know. Compare what you are doing to what Divair and Dyakovo are doing, which is they are arguing using actual history, facts etc while all you have is baseless statements like "not only is Christianity right...".

[Dyakovo]

Because people like you, Dyakovo et al are impossible to deal with. You've come to the arbitrary conclusion that your opinion is right and anything that differs is inherently wrong. What do I gain from spending the next 30 minutes citing sources and presenting a foolproof argument if you've already made up your mind and are not at all willing to change it.

Let's not waste both our time any further.

I don't think he's impossible to deal with. Sure he has opinions which differ.... but at least his opinions are formed from a factual understanding of the landscape and not the mindless parrotings of liars standing on pulpits. You seem woefully ignorant of Christian history, and frankly, for you to be so ignorant while espousing to be Christian is horrid (it's also, sadly, way too common).

I get "he's impossible to deal with" (or something similar) a lot from fundies... I figure it means I'm doing something right.

[Tekania]

I don't think he's impossible to deal with. Sure he has opinions which differ.... but at least his opinions are formed from a factual understanding of the landscape and not the mindless parrotings of liars standing on pulpits. You seem woefully ignorant of Christian history, and frankly, for you to be so ignorant while espousing to be Christian is horrid (it's also, sadly, way too common).

I get "he's impossible to deal with" (or something similar) a lot from fundies... I figure it means I'm doing something right.

If it were up to me, I'd require mandatory courses on Church history for congregants. If someone is going to attend church they should really know what they are attending. You don't want to know how many times I may be discussing some point of protestant history and mention some central figure from the Reformation (say Ulricht Zwingli) with another protestant and get met with "Who?". As far as I'm concerned that's like talking to someone claiming to be a physicist and finding out he doesn't know who Enrico Fermi is.

[The Keystone Federation]

I think it's a continuation of the Liberal war on tradition and their hatred of it. It's freakin Christmas, and it should be called Christmas! I'm not even a Christian, but I go along with it. It's a good family oriented holiday....oh wait that's probably why the liberals want to kill it.

The real war on tradition is the better American appreciation of Christmas than Thanksgiving. That's my opinion.

[Norstal]

Something really sad is my one of my Muslim friend's favorite movies is Elf. We should keep the Christmas crap up, but try to agknowledge some of the other people. And stop the commercializing of Christmas already!

No.

Crucified Santa and Doraemon nativity scenes for the win.

[The Godly Nations]

The War on Christmas is an annual war occuring every year around December, when Christians make a giant fuss over any semblance of secularism, no matter how innoculous, as an attack on Christian Religion and all true Christian People everywhere, and the Secularists make a giant fuss over anything that has any religious connotation, such as a cross or little Jesus in a manger with cows, asses, paedophiles, and his parents cooing over the babe. And then New Years come, we forget all about it, and Paranoid Christians would start another round of Christmas nothingness the next year.

[Tmutarakhan]

As far as I'm concerned that's like talking to someone claiming to be a physicist and finding out he doesn't know who Enrico Fermi is.

Who? sorry, I couldn't help it

[The Realm of God]

Out of curiosity, what delineates the Common Era vs. the before period?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Era
" BCE is the abbreviation for Before the Common/Current/Christian Era"


Roughly speaking, it's the before and after era of Christianity. It's mostly a convenience thing, it's impossible to introduce a new calendar now.

Eh not impossible, difficult.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Republican_Calendar

It's just.....impractical

Today is the

13th day of the month of Frost.