Roman Catholic Priests to be violated in Australia

[Ostroeuropa]

They are asking to change the law, and the discussion is about why the priests are complaining about the proposed change.
Also source.

No, it is not. The discussion is about the law in general and anything related to the law. There was nothing prohibiting this discussion to that only.

Code of Canon Law, 983 Section 1: The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore, it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray, in any way, a penitent, in words or in any manner and for any reason.

I don't see how a club's rulebook should dictate what the law of a nation should be.
Your club is not special.

[Abatael]

The problem is the government thinks it can violate this Seal; it cannot and will not.

If a club aids and abett a crime because their club rules demand it, that's fine. We can't change their rules.
But we CAN punish them for it. And that is what will be done.
Yes, a priest may be thrown out of the church for disobeying church doctrine. We don't care. We'll punish them for breaking the law.

Do whatever you want; they won't violate the Seal.

The problem is the government thinks it can violate this Seal; it cannot and will not.

Of course it cant.
What it can do is demand priest disclose child molesters and punish them for not complying with court order; just like there is law against honour killing but people can do it... then face force of the law.

Exactly. And no government will ever get anything out of this; it is futile.

[Great Nepal]

They are asking to change the law, and the discussion is about why the priests are complaining about the proposed change.
Also source.

No, it is not. The discussion is about the law in general and anything related to the law. There was nothing prohibiting this discussion to that only.

Code of Canon Law, 983 Section 1: The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore, it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray, in any way, a penitent, in words or in any manner and for any reason.

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

[Ostroeuropa]

If a club aids and abett a crime because their club rules demand it, that's fine. We can't change their rules.
But we CAN punish them for it. And that is what will be done.
Yes, a priest may be thrown out of the church for disobeying church doctrine. We don't care. We'll punish them for breaking the law.

Do whatever you want; they won't violate the Seal.

Of course it cant.
What it can do is demand priest disclose child molesters and punish them for not complying with court order; just like there is law against honour killing but people can do it... then face force of the law.

Exactly. And no government will ever get anything out of this; it is futile.

Sure they will.
The catholic church has demonstrated that it is infuriatingly immoral and adaptable.
They WILL obey this law, because the priests are all shits out for themselves, and won't risk jail.

[Great Nepal]

Of course it cant.
What it can do is demand priest disclose child molesters and punish them for not complying with court order; just like there is law against honour killing but people can do it... then face force of the law.

Exactly. And no government will ever get anything out of this; it is futile.

So, by that logic we should legalise honour killing cos some people still do it?

[Abatael]

No, it is not. The discussion is about the law in general and anything related to the law. There was nothing prohibiting this discussion to that only.

Code of Canon Law, 983 Section 1: The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore, it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray, in any way, a penitent, in words or in any manner and for any reason.

I don't see how a club's rulebook should dictate what the law of a nation should be.
Your club is not special.

They will not conform with the law under any circumstance. They will be civilly disobedient; they will break the law, be tortured, humiliated, ruined, and executed before disclosing the confession.

[Ostroeuropa]

I don't see how a club's rulebook should dictate what the law of a nation should be.
Your club is not special.

They will not conform with the law under any circumstance. They will be civilly disobedient; they will break the law, be tortured, humiliated, ruined, and executed before disclosing the confession.

Fine by me.
But you are wrong. They'll do what they always do. Have a convenient revelation allowing them to change the rules to suit the law.

[L Ron Cupboard]

Do whatever you want; they won't violate the Seal.

They take that particular rule more seriously than the one about not violating children?

[Great Nepal]

Do whatever you want; they won't violate the Seal.

They take that particular rule more seriously than the one about not violating children?

No, they will most likely take option of not going to jail more seriously than either of those.

[Abatael]

No, it is not. The discussion is about the law in general and anything related to the law. There was nothing prohibiting this discussion to that only.

Code of Canon Law, 983 Section 1: The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore, it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray, in any way, a penitent, in words or in any manner and for any reason.

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

Do whatever you want; they won't violate the Seal.



Exactly. And no government will ever get anything out of this; it is futile.

Sure they will.
The catholic church has demonstrated that it is infuriatingly immoral and adaptable.
They WILL obey this law, because the priests are all shits out for themselves, and won't risk jail.

No, they won't. They will follow Canon Law accordingly.

Exactly. And no government will ever get anything out of this; it is futile.

So, by that logic we should legalise honour killing cos some people still do it?

This is a false analogy. You are comparing killing someone to disclosing information.

[Raeyh]

I don't see how a club's rulebook should dictate what the law of a nation should be.
Your club is not special.

They will not conform with the law under any circumstance. They will be civilly disobedient; they will break the law, be tortured, humiliated, ruined, and executed before disclosing the confession.

Then they go to jail. I would think the faithful would be pleased for an opportunity to show their faith.

"Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness"

[Ostroeuropa]

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

Sure they will.
The catholic church has demonstrated that it is infuriatingly immoral and adaptable.
They WILL obey this law, because the priests are all shits out for themselves, and won't risk jail.

No, they won't. They will follow Canon Law accordingly.

So, by that logic we should legalise honour killing cos some people still do it?

This is a false analogy. You are comparing killing someone to disclosing information.

Just like the whole
"CANON LA-what? we can't do slavery anymore? OMG I HAD A REVELATION U GAIZ IT'S NOT COOL 2 SLAVERY."
"CANON LAW!!! What? Jews in fires? People are angry at us? Uh... REVELATION U GAIZ!"
"CHURCH DOCTRINE! CONDOMS!!! uh...ok...sure, condoms is ok if you got aids igues.."

[Abatael]

They will not conform with the law under any circumstance. They will be civilly disobedient; they will break the law, be tortured, humiliated, ruined, and executed before disclosing the confession.

Fine by me.
But you are wrong. They'll do what they always do. Have a convenient revelation allowing them to change the rules to suit the law.

When that happens, I will retract this all, but it won't happen, so there will be no retraction.

Do whatever you want; they won't violate the Seal.

They take that particular rule more seriously than the one about not violating children?

The Seal is absolute; so, yes.

[Great Nepal]

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

No, priest decides if they care about children or stupid seal. If they choose latter, they are in violation of national law and will face punishment they deserve.

This is a false analogy. You are comparing killing someone to disclosing information.

Disclosing information about child molesters who are threat to public.

[Abatael]

They will not conform with the law under any circumstance. They will be civilly disobedient; they will break the law, be tortured, humiliated, ruined, and executed before disclosing the confession.

Then they go to jail. I would think the faithful would be pleased for an opportunity to show their faith.

"Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness"

Yes, this is what I am saying.

[Ostroeuropa]

Then they go to jail. I would think the faithful would be pleased for an opportunity to show their faith.

"Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness"

Yes, this is what I am saying.

Ok great.
This is an outcome i'm fine with.

[Nidaria]

No, it is not. The discussion is about the law in general and anything related to the law. There was nothing prohibiting this discussion to that only.

Code of Canon Law, 983 Section 1: The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore, it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray, in any way, a penitent, in words or in any manner and for any reason.

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

Religious and moral law trumps civil law. This is a clear persecution of the Catholic Church.

[Revolutopia]

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

God never once mentions any seal of confessional in the Bible, while he does speak against abusing children.

Yet, a number of Catholic Priests have had no problem breaking the latter, and the Church Higher Ups have had no problem protecting those priests.

[Abatael]

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

No, priest decides if they care about children or stupid seal. If they choose latter, they are in violation of national law and will face punishment they deserve.

They will not disclose it or violate the Seal of the Confessional under any circumstances.

They will face a punishment, if one is imposed; that is rather obvious.

This is a false analogy. You are comparing killing someone to disclosing information.

Disclosing information about child molesters who are threat to public.

Murdering =/= Disclosing information.

In words: Murder is not an analog to violating the Seal.

[Ostroeuropa]

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

Religious and moral law trumps civil law. This is a clear persecution of the Aztec Church.

(Fixed.)
Now, justify why you are against human sacrifice.

[Northwest Slobovia]

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

I believe God decided that rape was wrong, and priests do it anyway. Amazing how that works.

[Threlizdun]

Religious and moral law trumps civil law. This is a clear persecution of the Catholic Church.

Fortunately you are wrong on both accounts. Civil law most certainly trumps religious law and the Catholic Church is not being given special status over others.

[Great Nepal]

Religious and moral law trumps civil law. This is a clear persecution of the Catholic Church.

Have you stumbled on time machine around fifteenth century?
This is twenty first century, we trend to do things differently around here than in your century.

[Revolutopia]

We dont care.

Here is national law.
Here is state law.
Here is city law.




Here is code of cannon law and other religious laws.
National government enforces national law, and priest decides if they want to follow national law or religious one. If they choose latter; they will face sanctions under national one.

Religious and moral law trumps civil law. This is a clear persecution of the Catholic Church.

No, it actually the opposite civil law trumps Religious and moral law.

Additionally, this only a revocation of a special privilege that the CC doesn't deserve.

[Abatael]

Yes, this is what I am saying.

Ok great.
This is an outcome i'm fine with.

I was not arguing they will not be punished.

The priest does not decide; God decides, and it has been decided that they will not violate the Seal.

God never once mentions any seal of confessional in the Bible, while he does speak against abusing children.

Yet, a number of Catholic Priests have had no problem breaking the latter, and the Church Higher Ups have had no problem protecting those priests.

But Pope has, and His Holiness is the method, through which the will of God is revealed.

Cry me a river.